Well if we really are going down the technicality route...
Miss would imply also that the Q in question is young and unmarried, we have no background information on this nor does the captain.
So the safest diplomatic option would be Ms. but then again Janeway was not really in the diplomatic mood at the point as I recall.
actually if we are going down the implication route, the Q in question also implied that she was in a relationship with Q for a very long time, and seemed pretty possessive of him, which would further imply that she is not married. In my experience women usually specify if they prefer being called Ms., and when Janeway did call her Miss Q, she didn't seem to object, possibly cause some people feel Ms. makes one sound old.
So if the Q in question doesn't seem to have a problem being called Miss Q, why does anyone else.
Well if we really are going down the technicality route...
Miss would imply also that the Q in question is young and unmarried, we have no background information on this nor does the captain.
So the safest diplomatic option would be Ms. but then again Janeway was not really in the diplomatic mood at the point as I recall.
actually if we are going down the implication route, the Q in question also implied that she was in a relationship with Q for a very long time, and seemed pretty possessive of him, which would further imply that she is not married. In my experience women usually specify if they prefer being called Ms., and when Janeway did call her Miss Q, she didn't seem to object, possibly cause some people feel Ms. makes one sound old.
So if the Q in question doesn't seem to have a problem being called Miss Q, why does anyone else.
I think you miss my point, I believe the use of Miss was very clever use on Janeway's part, although she had no specific indication (at the point she used the term "Miss Q") she would anticipate that Ms Q could be as old as Q and Janeway would know just how old he is. I believe she was using it in a specific derisive, belittling way.
In every dealing with the Q whether it's Janeway or Picard they are about picking flaws of the Q but also the dialogue between the Q and the Captains is mostly icy.
Either way the term was used in the programme and should stand, I have no problem with that, we have similar debates about dress code and symbolism.
But I think the point is some people prefer a) some people prefer b) and some people prefer neither. I think they are perfectly justified in raising this the problem has been created by the show at the end of the day...
What do you call an alternate Q who is not a Variant of Q but most definitely is a Q and is definitely different to the other Q, and is not male but is female?
That is the Q.
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I don't really have an issue with the name, but my two cents is, since all members of the Continuum have the exact same name (with the exception of ones like Amanda and Riker, who each lived a life prior to joining the Continuum), you really should differentiate each variant by what it was known for in that episode or scene, just like with variants of any other crew — and not by gender. So, in this case, that might be something like "Old Flame Q" for Suzie's character.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing. ~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
I don't really have an issue with the name, but my two cents is, since all members of the Continuum have the exact same name (with the exception of ones like Amanda and Riker, who each lived a life prior to joining the Continuum), you really should differentiate each variant by what it was known for in that episode or scene, just like with variants of any other crew — and not by gender. So, in this case, that might be something like "Old Flame Q" for Suzie's character.
Depends on who's perspective you're saying "known for"... to Janeway (who admittedly has a weak understanding of the Q in general) she was "Miss Q"
I would always rather someone be a little too sensitive than not sensitive enough, but I won't care what her name is when she is frozen after the event. If anything, her being the only "Miss" will make her easier to find later.
I don't really have an issue with the name, but my two cents is, since all members of the Continuum have the exact same name (with the exception of ones like Amanda and Riker, who each lived a life prior to joining the Continuum), you really should differentiate each variant by what it was known for in that episode or scene, just like with variants of any other crew — and not by gender. So, in this case, that might be something like "Old Flame Q" for Suzie's character.
Depends on who's perspective you're saying "known for"... to Janeway (who admittedly has a weak understanding of the Q in general) she was "Miss Q"
Ehh, I don't think there's really a basis for polemics here. When I say "known for", I thought it obvious I meant "known for by us, the viewers" — in other words, how a viewer would describe such things as the actions, background or intent of a character in a scene or episode.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing. ~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
I went to this thread thinking maybe it was about the characters stats or you know some actually useful information...
I am confused with what is wrong with using the title miss? as far as I remember, it denotes a woman who is unmarried. As far as I can tell The Q in question is female and unmarried? Would we be this upset if someone Called the Main Q, Mr Q? I fail to see the offense.
I can't believe this needs to be stated in this century, but the reason some people are offended by titles like Miss is the sexist notion that a woman's title depends on her relationship to a man, while a man is always Mr if he is married or not. Others are offended because it can be used to put down a woman by implying immaturity. Still others are not offended, it depends on the individual and respecting their wishes.
I have no problem with the name regarding Miss Q. As stated elsewhere, it is a canonial title and a unique identifier from the other Q, and a cleaver pun (even more cleaver than indended in a meta way) and there is no sign that the chatacter is offended by the title specifically (she seemed more offended by Janeway's existence). And do the Q even have genders as we think about them? Food for thought.
And do the Q even have genders as we think about them? Food for thought.
They definitely have “biological sex” as they can have children, and it takes more than one individual for that (so it’s not parthenogenesis). Now the question is what meaning you put into “gender”.
And do the Q even have genders as we think about them? Food for thought.
They definitely have “biological sex” as they can have children, and it takes more than one individual for that (so it’s not parthenogenesis). Now the question is what meaning you put into “gender”.
Let's not go there. It is an interesting discussion right now. But if we go there somebody is going to offend somebody else and this thing will be shut down in a heartbeat.
And do the Q even have genders as we think about them? Food for thought.
They definitely have “biological sex” as they can have children, and it takes more than one individual for that (so it’s not parthenogenesis). Now the question is what meaning you put into “gender”.
Can any two Q produce a child or do they require two distinct different types of Qs to produce a child.
And do the Q even have genders as we think about them? Food for thought.
They definitely have “biological sex” as they can have children, and it takes more than one individual for that (so it’s not parthenogenesis). Now the question is what meaning you put into “gender”.
Can any two Q produce a child or do they require two distinct different types of Qs to produce a child.
Interesting question. My opinion is that option “any two” would be illogical (yes, even the Q should have some logic behind them). Why then not just one? Or not 2+
Anyway, the terms “biological sex” and “sexual reproduction” imply combining genetic materials of two (or theoretically more) parents in a child. If any two of the Q can make a child, it would not mean that they don’t have biological sex, it would mean they have only one (something that Earth science haven’t encountered yet), or that they can have more than one in an individual.
Why is it okay to use the demeaning name "Miss Q" just because Janeway used it to insult Q? The regular Q called Worf "Microbrain" as a racial insult, but nobody at any point thought it would be okay to name a character that in this game.
I reject the argument that the name isn't offensive just because it's not offensive in whatever area or age range you're in. And I reject this need to insult players who are offended by it. What's wrong with you people?
Janeway is the ONLY person who calls this Q "Miss" and she does it right after being called a "dog". Even B'Elanna doesn't use the same term (despite trading barbs with her, too). Every other line in the episode refers to this Q only as "Q" -- her proper name.
Like "Disfigured Pike", whose name (but not rarity) were changed after DB realized it was offensive to refer to someone this way (and to imply that being physically disabled makes him less useful than the legendary versions of the character), "Miss Q" is in need of a name change.
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actually if we are going down the implication route, the Q in question also implied that she was in a relationship with Q for a very long time, and seemed pretty possessive of him, which would further imply that she is not married. In my experience women usually specify if they prefer being called Ms., and when Janeway did call her Miss Q, she didn't seem to object, possibly cause some people feel Ms. makes one sound old.
So if the Q in question doesn't seem to have a problem being called Miss Q, why does anyone else.
I think you miss my point, I believe the use of Miss was very clever use on Janeway's part, although she had no specific indication (at the point she used the term "Miss Q") she would anticipate that Ms Q could be as old as Q and Janeway would know just how old he is. I believe she was using it in a specific derisive, belittling way.
In every dealing with the Q whether it's Janeway or Picard they are about picking flaws of the Q but also the dialogue between the Q and the Captains is mostly icy.
Either way the term was used in the programme and should stand, I have no problem with that, we have similar debates about dress code and symbolism.
But I think the point is some people prefer a) some people prefer b) and some people prefer neither. I think they are perfectly justified in raising this the problem has been created by the show at the end of the day...
What do you call an alternate Q who is not a Variant of Q but most definitely is a Q and is definitely different to the other Q, and is not male but is female?
That is the Q.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
Depends on who's perspective you're saying "known for"... to Janeway (who admittedly has a weak understanding of the Q in general) she was "Miss Q"
Ehh, I don't think there's really a basis for polemics here. When I say "known for", I thought it obvious I meant "known for by us, the viewers" — in other words, how a viewer would describe such things as the actions, background or intent of a character in a scene or episode.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
I can't believe this needs to be stated in this century, but the reason some people are offended by titles like Miss is the sexist notion that a woman's title depends on her relationship to a man, while a man is always Mr if he is married or not. Others are offended because it can be used to put down a woman by implying immaturity. Still others are not offended, it depends on the individual and respecting their wishes.
I have no problem with the name regarding Miss Q. As stated elsewhere, it is a canonial title and a unique identifier from the other Q, and a cleaver pun (even more cleaver than indended in a meta way) and there is no sign that the chatacter is offended by the title specifically (she seemed more offended by Janeway's existence). And do the Q even have genders as we think about them? Food for thought.
They definitely have “biological sex” as they can have children, and it takes more than one individual for that (so it’s not parthenogenesis). Now the question is what meaning you put into “gender”.
Let's not go there. It is an interesting discussion right now. But if we go there somebody is going to offend somebody else and this thing will be shut down in a heartbeat.
Can any two Q produce a child or do they require two distinct different types of Qs to produce a child.
Interesting question. My opinion is that option “any two” would be illogical (yes, even the Q should have some logic behind them). Why then not just one? Or not 2+
Anyway, the terms “biological sex” and “sexual reproduction” imply combining genetic materials of two (or theoretically more) parents in a child. If any two of the Q can make a child, it would not mean that they don’t have biological sex, it would mean they have only one (something that Earth science haven’t encountered yet), or that they can have more than one in an individual.
I reject the argument that the name isn't offensive just because it's not offensive in whatever area or age range you're in. And I reject this need to insult players who are offended by it. What's wrong with you people?
Janeway is the ONLY person who calls this Q "Miss" and she does it right after being called a "dog". Even B'Elanna doesn't use the same term (despite trading barbs with her, too). Every other line in the episode refers to this Q only as "Q" -- her proper name.
Like "Disfigured Pike", whose name (but not rarity) were changed after DB realized it was offensive to refer to someone this way (and to imply that being physically disabled makes him less useful than the legendary versions of the character), "Miss Q" is in need of a name change.