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Boss battle short supplies

Admiral Q BakerAdmiral Q Baker ✭✭✭
edited June 2023 in The Bridge
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I know someone had to address this b4 but......Star Trek Timelines this is a ridiculous problem to have! How are we beating ultra nightmare and still don't have enough to upgrade the bridge.🤬 This is the type of stuff that makes you stop play and or stop spending on this game. This needs to be fix!
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Comments

  • IvanstoneIvanstone ✭✭✭✭✭
    I’m beating UNM twice a day and still don’t have enough. First World Problems.
    7pujag610agq.png
    VIP 13 - 305 Crew Slots - 915 Immortals
  • Ivanstone wrote: »
    I’m beating UNM twice a day and still don’t have enough. First World Problems.
    7pujag610agq.png

    This crazy man
  • WebberoniWebberoni ✭✭✭✭✭
    That's what happens when there is no long-term planning, when the idea for multiple bridges isn't properly QC'd ahead of time, and the players are more ingenious than expected.
  • IvanstoneIvanstone ✭✭✭✭✭
    Some form of bottle neck is expected and it’s hardly the only wasted resource in this game. Oh well. My bridge is developing at a reasonable rate.
    VIP 13 - 305 Crew Slots - 915 Immortals
  • IvanstoneIvanstone ✭✭✭✭✭
    AviTrek wrote: »
    The bigger issue is because of Magnesite being the bottleneck it now no longer makes sense to waste valor beating a boss. You're better off spreading out your valor to hit max damage on as many levels as possible. Every valor you waste trying to solve a trait is valor you don't use to earn more Magnesite. So the game is actively incentivizing you to not solve traits.

    Not really. It’s highly dependent on how much damage you can do per valour spent. Even then not all trade offs are great.

    For example, I usually spend 4 Valour per UNM kill. Or 200 Mag per valour. I send out mix solves. Usually Two node solvers+Dereth/Phlox+CTKirk. How much damage I do depends on how good the node solvers are at battles. Sometimes the 4th valour is a max damage crew.

    You can be more efficient in UNM if you hit each boss twice but you still have to kill it to refresh it. Better to just kill it as often as possible which means some node solving has to happen.

    Hard mode is the same problem. I know it’s possible to score 23M in one attack but if you miss you wasted a valour. Even then it’s only 150 Mag.

    Brutal is worse. Nightmare is better but in order to make the most out of it you usually need to hit twice. If you can reliably do 43M/Valour then that’s a good trade off.
    VIP 13 - 305 Crew Slots - 915 Immortals
  • Bylo BandBylo Band ✭✭✭✭✭
    Recently our fleet came up with this new FBB strategy. We are only on day 2 and it is taking people time to adjust so we are not in a full sprint yet, but this is what we are trying to address this issue.

    We call it Magnemax (I did not come up with this name, my idea was to call it The Magnesificant Protocols, it was rejected for some reason ;) ) and it goes like this:

    Keep the Hard boss up 24/7, everyone attacks it for damage ONCE, it goes down pretty fast, a new one is launched, repeat. We help people setup their teams so they are doing 16,000,000+ damage which both helps them get more Magnesite but also gets these fights over faster so the next one can start.

    Keep the Nightmare boss up 24/7, everyone attacks it twice for damage and then stops (we help people setup their attack crew so they can do the most damage possible).

    A couple of days during the week we switch back to UNM runs which we defeat, we do this to keep from getting rusty in case we need to go back to UNM 24/7 at some point and to keep the people who enjoy node solving happy.

    The idea is to use up Valor as it comes in and convert it efficiently into Magnesite, while still being accessible to some of the newer folks we have joining our ranks who don't have bridge levels as advanced as our seasoned players. If this makes sense for use in your fleets, feel free to use it, and I won't mind if you decide to call it The Magnesificant Protocols B)
  • W.W. CarlisleW.W. Carlisle ✭✭✭✭✭
    My fleet mates and I are steadily hitting the wall at Level 13. By the time we hit UNM, I'll likely be maxed for Mag. We've yet to clear 75% on NM. Best is 71%. If I did my math right, we can beat it, if twenty of us can deal 92.5m each. I'm the only reaching those numbers so far.
    How about swapping some of the trainers in the Campaign for FBB related items? It was rebalanced for Retrieval, but nothing for FBB was added. Bridge components and Valor would be awesome. A Bitrium III or two towards the end of the Ultimate track would be very welcome by those at the 13 wall and really wouldn't make that huge of an overall difference to the game balance. The ones that are beating UNM daily won't care, if some players get half to one Bridge level a year from Campaign, and the ones that can't reach UNM, let alone beat it, will take anything. Mag on the middle tier, better stuff on top, and a bit of Valor scattered in would be a selling point. Thoughts?
    W.W. CarlislePlayed since January 20, 2019Captain Level- 99 (May 9, 2022)VIP 14Crew Quarters: 485/485Most recent/Lowest- Anbo-jyutsu Kyle Riker (1/5* Lvl 30) 5/29/23Immortalized x-866 5* x184, 4* x 490, 3* x91, 2* x62, and 1* x27Most recent Immortal - Tearful Janeway 4* 5/25/23Current non-event project- Improving my Science base skill. Retrieval Project- Mestral 1/5*
  • Our Fleet has this for a system.

    Tues-Sun we complete 1 UNM boss.

    On Mondays we cycle Hards to beat them.

    Everyday we always have EVERY level open. For non-spenders we recommend hits on Nightmare to max Mag or Hard. We keep all levels open because several of us extra dil spenders hit Brutal for max as well.

    Eventually, Bril 2 will be our resource issue and not Mag, but that is several months from now.

    Personally, I spend 300 dil per day and this is my set up.

    7/8 UNM.... I run nodes for my fleet.
    2 on NM(This maxed me)
    2 on Brutal (This maxed me)
    1 on Hard(I average 21 mil per hit)
    2 on Normal ( First hit gives me 40 Mag second give me 20)
    1 on Easy(This maxed rewards)
  • AldudeAldude ✭✭✭✭✭
    My fleet also has a strategy.

    Get as much honour as we can and try to 50% nightmare as often as possible to help others.

    ...
    Didn't say it was a good, progressive strategy... But it is *a* strategy
    Fleet Admiral of NCC UK Midlands."Leave any bigotry in your quarters. There's no room for it on the bridge." - J.T. Kirk, 2266
  • weakinteractionweakinteraction ✭✭✭✭
    I'd be interested to know how many of the really active fleets are now actively avoiding node solving so that everyone can max out on magnesite. Feels like another example of the details of how a feature is structured working against the original intent.
  • IvanstoneIvanstone ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'd be interested to know how many of the really active fleets are now actively avoiding node solving so that everyone can max out on magnesite. Feels like another example of the details of how a feature is structured working against the original intent.

    There's been a bunch of times where we didn't complete the 5th node on UNM. I wouldn't say it was planned. I think some people just like doing damage or their schedules only allow them to burn a bunch of valour in one shot.

    However, our fastest kills come from completing all nodes and its probably better to kill the boss more often letting it idle while people get their minimums in. We usually get ~25 people reliably hitting thresholds anyways.
    VIP 13 - 305 Crew Slots - 915 Immortals
  • DavideBooksDavideBooks ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'd be interested to know how many of the really active fleets are now actively avoiding node solving so that everyone can max out on magnesite. Feels like another example of the details of how a feature is structured working against the original intent.

    My fleet has a bunch of people who like figuring out the nodes. Getting enjoyment from the game is important. But even if we just went for magnicite, how much more would we really get? We usually have a Nightmare about 75% finished every 24 hours and we destroy an Ultra-Nightmare about every 18. I believe we could get the Ultra-Nightmare a whole lot faster if we skipped the Nightmare, but that would leave too many of our fleet behind. Not everyone can get minimums with two or three valor.
  • GanonGanon ✭✭
    edited July 2023
    I'd be interested to know how many of the really active fleets are now actively avoiding node solving so that everyone can max out on magnesite. Feels like another example of the details of how a feature is structured working against the original intent.

    Because of the reward tables, node solving is needed to maximize Magnesite earning. My fleet averages about 2.5 UNMs killed per day with 35-40ish captains doing some damage and 25-30 doing max threshold. 95% of the time we solve all 5 chains, but if the combos are particularly good, we occasionally only solve 4. Hard to know for sure how much Valor is used solving combos, but a proxy indicator I have (that's probably on the high end) would suggest that we use less than 16 Valor across the fleet per UNM boss kill on average.

    So the more active fleet members (who get in and post max threshold on each UNM) are getting 2,000 Magnesite / day. The most active ones will also do max threshold on 1 NM per day, so they're getting 2,525 Magnesite / day.

    If you just do max threshold on Hard, Brutal, NM, and UNM once per day you would get 1700 Magnesite / day.

    If you only do max threshold on NM and the rest of Valor used on Hards, you would need to do over 13 Hards per day to generate this amount of Magnesite. Although this is the best method for maximizing Honor.

    I'm pretty sure SSR is doing more than 3 UNMs / day.
  • I've made peace with the node-solving minigame in its current form. Typically, two node runs is enough to solve a chain, and so the total "wasted" valor among the fleet is only somewhere around 10-15. But it's a fine line, and that line is about to move.

    The next Portal update (should be quite soon, as early as next week) will be adding another batch of potential solution crew. Some notable impact will be added Kwejian, Orion, Andorian, and other racial combos that previously had limited potential. We've heard no signal as to whether another adaptation will be made (last time, the portal update was seemingly delayed while the developers added the "two must solve" rule).

    And so, we're looking at a squeeze in two directions. As Avi pointed out, node-solving fleet members are already naturally thinning out, either due to attrition or apathy. With a portal update, there are two groups of players who will be further impacted: Those who simply don't have the correct crew, and can't contribute to solving new pairs...and those who balk at the increased difficulty and just convert to being pure DPS contributors. Some players will rise to the new challenge: retrieve new solver crew; improve their DPS-per-valor. Some will not, and will drop.

    On the other end, there is the increased cost in valor when new skill pairs receive their first duplicate, and become new possibilities that will need to be tested. Again, it's incremental, but nonzero. So with max threshold becoming more difficult to achieve while contributing to node-solving, we'll see those players who opt to continue solving nodes, either risk falling short of Threshold, or will need to bow out of the minigame early in order to get enough DPS in.

    To tie things together -- Fewer players, and higher valor costs. Not a good intersection.

    I don't think this specific Portal update will make FBB unplayable, but what I'm saying is that this is a rolling snowball. And it's part of the fundamental problem of the age of the game - the portal pool is so vast now, that while there are some positives (wide array of fan-favorite characters) there is also impact to core game mechanics (portal pulls devalued due to power creep, crew retrieval increasing in difficulty, and of course the impact to FBB).

    I'm glad that WRG was out ahead of this in the last Portal update. I look forward to seeing what else they have to help!
  • IvanstoneIvanstone ✭✭✭✭✭
    AviTrek wrote: »
    Fewer and fewer people are solving nodes because the reward structure actively discourages it.

    I don’t think that’s true. It’s quite possible to score your threshold while doing partial node solves. You don’t need to solve every node. You also don’t need to do as much damage as possible. A 2xRepair/1xDamage/1xNode solve combo will reliably do close to 15-20M in an Artifact (depends on chain). More if the above crew can solve additional nodes or do good damage if it’s the node solver.

    Presently I’m spending 4 valour per UNM. I’m very often only in the 70-80M range. I’m typically solving around 5 nodes per boss. It varies a lot but even a flubbed node is still useful information. I will usually go after the more obscure solve if possible. I will usually leave easy solves to my fleet. For example, if I know Mintaken Troi will solve something then I won’t use her. A lot of the fleet is aware of her trait potential so most of us keep a copy out.

    I usually start a new battle with Dereth/CTKirk/2xNodeSolvers. I do that for my first two chains. I then swap out a Node Solver for another repair or damage dealer depending on the chain for the rest of my valour.
    VIP 13 - 305 Crew Slots - 915 Immortals
  • AviTrekAviTrek ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ivanstone wrote: »
    AviTrek wrote: »
    Fewer and fewer people are solving nodes because the reward structure actively discourages it.

    I don’t think that’s true. It’s quite possible to score your threshold while doing partial node solves. You don’t need to solve every node. You also don’t need to do as much damage as possible. A 2xRepair/1xDamage/1xNode solve combo will reliably do close to 15-20M in an Artifact (depends on chain). More if the above crew can solve additional nodes or do good damage if it’s the node solver.

    Presently I’m spending 4 valour per UNM. I’m very often only in the 70-80M range. I’m typically solving around 5 nodes per boss. It varies a lot but even a flubbed node is still useful information. I will usually go after the more obscure solve if possible. I will usually leave easy solves to my fleet. For example, if I know Mintaken Troi will solve something then I won’t use her. A lot of the fleet is aware of her trait potential so most of us keep a copy out.

    I usually start a new battle with Dereth/CTKirk/2xNodeSolvers. I do that for my first two chains. I then swap out a Node Solver for another repair or damage dealer depending on the chain for the rest of my valour.

    Whether it's possible or not, it's a fact that less and less people in my fleet are trying.

    And I can hit max individual damage in 3 valor. Depending when with boosts I do that, I can sometimes mix in a little node solving on my final attempt. But spending that fourth valor on UN is one less valor I can use to earn mag on another level.
  • I think related to this discussion - my gut sense is that many of players that "enjoy solving nodes" are probably just using DataCore and aren't really enjoying it, just doing the grind to help the fleet. I'm certainly in that category. Any novelty interest in that is long gone. I don't want to grind on game play if I don't have to.
  • IvanstoneIvanstone ✭✭✭✭✭
    I think related to this discussion - my gut sense is that many of players that "enjoy solving nodes" are probably just using DataCore and aren't really enjoying it, just doing the grind to help the fleet. I'm certainly in that category. Any novelty interest in that is long gone. I don't want to grind on game play if I don't have to.

    Some people are definitely doing it for the multisolve. You won’t have to look hard to find people screen capping 5 node clears.
    AviTrek wrote: »
    Ivanstone wrote: »
    AviTrek wrote: »
    Fewer and fewer people are solving nodes because the reward structure actively discourages it.

    I don’t think that’s true. It’s quite possible to score your threshold while doing partial node solves. You don’t need to solve every node. You also don’t need to do as much damage as possible. A 2xRepair/1xDamage/1xNode solve combo will reliably do close to 15-20M in an Artifact (depends on chain). More if the above crew can solve additional nodes or do good damage if it’s the node solver.

    Presently I’m spending 4 valour per UNM. I’m very often only in the 70-80M range. I’m typically solving around 5 nodes per boss. It varies a lot but even a flubbed node is still useful information. I will usually go after the more obscure solve if possible. I will usually leave easy solves to my fleet. For example, if I know Mintaken Troi will solve something then I won’t use her. A lot of the fleet is aware of her trait potential so most of us keep a copy out.

    I usually start a new battle with Dereth/CTKirk/2xNodeSolvers. I do that for my first two chains. I then swap out a Node Solver for another repair or damage dealer depending on the chain for the rest of my valour.

    Whether it's possible or not, it's a fact that less and less people in my fleet are trying.

    And I can hit max individual damage in 3 valor. Depending when with boosts I do that, I can sometimes mix in a little node solving on my final attempt. But spending that fourth valor on UN is one less valor I can use to earn mag on another level.

    And what happens if you don’t clear UNM in 12 hours? What if it takes 18 hours? Because that’s the end result of not properly clearing nodes.
    VIP 13 - 305 Crew Slots - 915 Immortals
  • AviTrekAviTrek ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ivanstone wrote: »
    I think related to this discussion - my gut sense is that many of players that "enjoy solving nodes" are probably just using DataCore and aren't really enjoying it, just doing the grind to help the fleet. I'm certainly in that category. Any novelty interest in that is long gone. I don't want to grind on game play if I don't have to.

    Some people are definitely doing it for the multisolve. You won’t have to look hard to find people screen capping 5 node clears.
    AviTrek wrote: »
    Ivanstone wrote: »
    AviTrek wrote: »
    Fewer and fewer people are solving nodes because the reward structure actively discourages it.

    I don’t think that’s true. It’s quite possible to score your threshold while doing partial node solves. You don’t need to solve every node. You also don’t need to do as much damage as possible. A 2xRepair/1xDamage/1xNode solve combo will reliably do close to 15-20M in an Artifact (depends on chain). More if the above crew can solve additional nodes or do good damage if it’s the node solver.

    Presently I’m spending 4 valour per UNM. I’m very often only in the 70-80M range. I’m typically solving around 5 nodes per boss. It varies a lot but even a flubbed node is still useful information. I will usually go after the more obscure solve if possible. I will usually leave easy solves to my fleet. For example, if I know Mintaken Troi will solve something then I won’t use her. A lot of the fleet is aware of her trait potential so most of us keep a copy out.

    I usually start a new battle with Dereth/CTKirk/2xNodeSolvers. I do that for my first two chains. I then swap out a Node Solver for another repair or damage dealer depending on the chain for the rest of my valour.

    Whether it's possible or not, it's a fact that less and less people in my fleet are trying.

    And I can hit max individual damage in 3 valor. Depending when with boosts I do that, I can sometimes mix in a little node solving on my final attempt. But spending that fourth valor on UN is one less valor I can use to earn mag on another level.

    And what happens if you don’t clear UNM in 12 hours? What if it takes 18 hours? Because that’s the end result of not properly clearing nodes.

    UM+NM+BR+.5HR is more Mag and honor than 2 UN.

    And if I'm trying to do 2 UN in one day that only leaves me one valor to dedicate to solving traits per boss. Plus it doesn't leave my stuck if the fleet slows down because other people aren't solving nodes.
  • AviTrekAviTrek ✭✭✭✭✭
    I think related to this discussion - my gut sense is that many of players that "enjoy solving nodes" are probably just using DataCore and aren't really enjoying it, just doing the grind to help the fleet. I'm certainly in that category. Any novelty interest in that is long gone. I don't want to grind on game play if I don't have to.

    I did enjoy solving nodes. Especially the chaining logic. Assume card A for node1, see what that forces for the others and keep repeating until I find an impossible node or a valid solution for all meaning those could all be true.
  • IvanstoneIvanstone ✭✭✭✭✭
    AviTrek wrote: »
    Ivanstone wrote: »
    I think related to this discussion - my gut sense is that many of players that "enjoy solving nodes" are probably just using DataCore and aren't really enjoying it, just doing the grind to help the fleet. I'm certainly in that category. Any novelty interest in that is long gone. I don't want to grind on game play if I don't have to.

    Some people are definitely doing it for the multisolve. You won’t have to look hard to find people screen capping 5 node clears.
    AviTrek wrote: »
    Ivanstone wrote: »
    AviTrek wrote: »
    Fewer and fewer people are solving nodes because the reward structure actively discourages it.

    I don’t think that’s true. It’s quite possible to score your threshold while doing partial node solves. You don’t need to solve every node. You also don’t need to do as much damage as possible. A 2xRepair/1xDamage/1xNode solve combo will reliably do close to 15-20M in an Artifact (depends on chain). More if the above crew can solve additional nodes or do good damage if it’s the node solver.

    Presently I’m spending 4 valour per UNM. I’m very often only in the 70-80M range. I’m typically solving around 5 nodes per boss. It varies a lot but even a flubbed node is still useful information. I will usually go after the more obscure solve if possible. I will usually leave easy solves to my fleet. For example, if I know Mintaken Troi will solve something then I won’t use her. A lot of the fleet is aware of her trait potential so most of us keep a copy out.

    I usually start a new battle with Dereth/CTKirk/2xNodeSolvers. I do that for my first two chains. I then swap out a Node Solver for another repair or damage dealer depending on the chain for the rest of my valour.

    Whether it's possible or not, it's a fact that less and less people in my fleet are trying.

    And I can hit max individual damage in 3 valor. Depending when with boosts I do that, I can sometimes mix in a little node solving on my final attempt. But spending that fourth valor on UN is one less valor I can use to earn mag on another level.

    And what happens if you don’t clear UNM in 12 hours? What if it takes 18 hours? Because that’s the end result of not properly clearing nodes.

    UM+NM+BR+.5HR is more Mag and honor than 2 UN.

    And if I'm trying to do 2 UN in one day that only leaves me one valor to dedicate to solving traits per boss. Plus it doesn't leave my stuck if the fleet slows down because other people aren't solving nodes.

    That’s 20 more Mag. It’s certainly more honour but honour reward are proportional to valour spent whereas Mag rewards aren’t.

    Furthermore, there are only 25 nodes to be solved. A well populated fleet shouldn’t have to rely on a few doing most of the work.
    VIP 13 - 305 Crew Slots - 915 Immortals
  • W.W. CarlisleW.W. Carlisle ✭✭✭✭✭
    Some of us are enjoying watching this debate with zero understanding of it. I'm maxed Mag at 13. This is wholly foreign to me.
    The only reason I'm playing FBB is to guide my fleet towards eventually beating NM (current best is 77%) and starting in on UNM. I'm hoping that this Endurance Event gives my junior captains the Bridge boost to make a dent in NM. We might have to start playing lower difficulties for a while to get them caught up with the long-term players. I'm willing to do it. I'm the Admiral. Long term strategy and fleet success is my responsibility. I'm not getting anything by playing right now, so I'm more than willing to switch to another difficulty for a while, if it is a net benefit.
    I need to poll my fleet to see where everyone is at. I wish Admirals could see Bridge levels to gauge which Bosses need played.
    W.W. CarlislePlayed since January 20, 2019Captain Level- 99 (May 9, 2022)VIP 14Crew Quarters: 485/485Most recent/Lowest- Anbo-jyutsu Kyle Riker (1/5* Lvl 30) 5/29/23Immortalized x-866 5* x184, 4* x 490, 3* x91, 2* x62, and 1* x27Most recent Immortal - Tearful Janeway 4* 5/25/23Current non-event project- Improving my Science base skill. Retrieval Project- Mestral 1/5*
  • W.W. CarlisleW.W. Carlisle ✭✭✭✭✭
    I've been teaching leaving players for years. I don't mind.
    Merge how? My fleet's full. It's just mostly new players. There are only about a dozen long time players. We have more players joining FBB by the week. They just aren't doing much yet. I'm waiting and guiding. I've got about thirty players on the current boss. Some of them haven't managed 1m damage yet. They are trying. I've got several asking about tips, ships, crew, tactics... I do what I can. One of my best up and comers does a great job figuring out nodes and making suggestions, which is normally my job when I'm online. He's doing about 30m a day now with the boost from the event.
    We need Artifact schematics. That's what we need. Twenty people doing 92.5 mill each will take out the boss after nodes. More need less. Thirty would need to just over 61m each. That could be doable. Forty is 46.25m. Fifty is 30.7m. We peck it to death like ducks. We just need a better bill.
    W.W. CarlislePlayed since January 20, 2019Captain Level- 99 (May 9, 2022)VIP 14Crew Quarters: 485/485Most recent/Lowest- Anbo-jyutsu Kyle Riker (1/5* Lvl 30) 5/29/23Immortalized x-866 5* x184, 4* x 490, 3* x91, 2* x62, and 1* x27Most recent Immortal - Tearful Janeway 4* 5/25/23Current non-event project- Improving my Science base skill. Retrieval Project- Mestral 1/5*
  • Why such a hurry?
    My fleet is doing one UNM each day and we are fine with that. I will reach bridge lvl 24 next week and I think before there is coming a new boss I will be at lvl 30. By the way, I enjoy solving nodes, trying to find the right crew without wasting too much valor. Thats the only fun with bossfights imo.

    Are there already captains who reached bridge lvl 30? I think some are close already and soon there will come the first complains that we need a new boss, who will maybe come in 12 months or they just add another 10 bridgelevels........
  • Seven ConstanzaSeven Constanza ✭✭✭✭
    I’m on bridge level 25, expect to hit 26 sometime next week. After I hit the end I’ll be happy collecting the honor and solving nodes. I’m sure there are others who are past where I am at the moment.
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