Can we talk about Gauntlet rewards...

[VIP0] Kooz

Hello. I'd like to take some time to discuss something that doesn't get discussed enough. While there are many issues with Gauntlet involving the RNG, percentages, etc that have been discussed in detail, I do not see much discussion about the Gauntlet rewards table needing a refresh/revamp. If there is a discussion where this was tackled recently, I did not see it and apologies in advance.

The typical rewards we get from a gauntlet loot box are as follows:
"Basic" loot boxes containing credits/merits (fine)
Streak loot boxes containing chrons (ehh), trainers (boo), components (ehh), equipment (but is it useful?), or gauntlet legendary character (yay!)
Rank loot boxes containing the same as streak loot boxes (but better?)

Early on in playing the Gauntlet, it was a blast! These items and the chance to get the legendary card was fun! Gauntlet was a primary focus of gameplay for a while. After some time, something got tweaked and fewer and fewer useful components and equipment dropped from Gauntlet. Also, with the influx of chrons from voyages and addition of warp 1 for all, trainers and chrons have significantly lost their value. There are times where i completely forget to run gauntlet due to it's lack of providing quality "loot."

I believe the Gauntlet needs a complete overhaul, but more urgently, the loot tables need to be refreshed based on the current game needs. The rewards for playing this feature of the game have not aged well with how the game is currently played. Useful equipment should be falling for crew on my active roster. Honor has become a major type of currency and could drop just like it does in skirmish loot boxes. Other items like Voyage revivals, citations or even super rare crew could be introduced into the table. The current rewards just don't make this mini-game worth spending time and resources on.

Does DB have a plan to update the rewards? If they do, when?

I welcome further input and criticism from DB and the players.

Zetterbeard

I vote that at least 50% of trainers won in gauntlet be changed to honor.

Dirk Gunderson

Zetterbeard wrote: »

I vote that at least 50% of trainers won in gauntlet be changed to honor.

Make it 100% of trainers and set the honor values high enough to allow newer players to be able to buy trainers from the honor hall at a reasonable pace.

WaldoMag

I would say that the better reward boxes should now happen every two than the current three. (However replace some of the trainers with merits)

Peachtree Rex

I mean...all of these items have been discussed at great length since the gauntlet was released. Obviously, players always want better rewards and a better game play experience. The gauntlet simply hasn't been a priority for DB to tweak or change. I would disagree that anything is "urgently" needed. It's just sort of a feature some people have chosen to dislike or ignore and others continue to plug away at.

<TGE> Clifford

You know what my favorite part about all this is?

Gauntlet is giving us items specifically for crew we don't even have.

You know what those items do?

They sit in your inventory, and build up until you have more than 1,000 unique items. And then what happens next? Items start disappearing. The useful items. Your time boosts you paid dil for. Your encoded communiques. Your science experiments.

Oh, but you could use those in the replicator, you say?

But how do I know that I'm putting Weyoun Clone 4's clothing into the replicator when they are visually identical to regular clothing patterns?

So, to recap, this is not just one problem, this is several problems which compound each other.

1. Gauntlet gives you items you can't use.
2. Your inventory has a 1,000 unique item cap, and you get no warning for that, nor can you tell it what to get rid of.
3. You cannot merely use some of these items in the replicator because you cannot see what their name is in the replicator screen.
4. Therefore, the end result is that DB's system automatically takes items you might have actually paid real money for, all because their gauntlet system is calibrated in a way that has a negative impact on the playing experience.

That's my favorite part of all of this.

V.

honor is the master currency now. New stuff like skirmishes/voyages gives it. Let gauntlet give it and I'll play it.

Synthetic Commander

holy crap there's a 1,000 unique item cap in inventory?? Time to clean house!!

Captain Nate

100% agree it needs a revamp. Too many trainers. More than enough replicator rations. I have both coming out the wazoo and they'll never all be used. I'd like something to give more rare items that are in faction stores thus far. Those are always the hang ups.

[DC] Merwinian

I just use the gauntlet as a merit farm these days.

"3. You cannot merely use some of these items in the replicator because you cannot see what their name is in the replicator screen."

Workaround for the issue of single items not having visible names in the replicator: open the replicator menu (assuming you haven't used all your replications for the day). Add any single-copy items whose names you want to know to your fuel list. Fill it up to 100% with some trainers or schems or whatever. Tap Replicate to see the final list, but DO NOT TAP CONFIRM. You can then tap each individual item to see its name, and you can exit that list without replicating anything.

I'm sure we all have inventories clogged up with those little items from low threshold rewards, and character-specific items we've never used. This is one way to help rid oneself of those.

Finnbar

<TGE> WhiteClifford wrote: »

2. Your inventory has a 1,000 unique item cap, and you get no warning for that, nor can you tell it what to get rid of.

Thanks! You just reminded me to check my inventory...
978 items.
20 minutes of scrolling through inventory to try and memorise what could be flushed, and guessing what they were on the replicator screen.
934 items. Good enough for now.


Edit: Merwinian, that is awesome.

eXo | SilverRose (retired)

I totally agree with Kooz on all points. Gauntlet is boring and repetitive. The rewards are... okay, I guess. There's no incentive to play because there's no guarantee that rank or streak will actually improve the rewards. It was a pretty broken system plagued by RNG when it was released, and it's just become worse with time as voyages and other features have been introduced with better rewards.

[DC] Merwinian

It also doesn't help that there are a lot of "ghost items" in one's inventory. Items that you can find in the inventory screen (usually character-specific) but which won't show up in the replicator menu. I've got a few old galaxy event rares in there that I can't rid myself of.

[DC] Merwinian

Also: the workaround is unnecessary for any item with more than one copy. Those can easily be tapped, and their name can be checked in the slider pop-up.

Xanathar

Agreed. For me, the only thing that has value is the Legendary Character. I'm not interested in blue trainers, basic portal pulls, or 2* junk that I could farm in less than a minute if I really wanted it.

Add to that the monotony of constantly facing walls of Suraks and other characters that show up constantly.

When the Gauntlet was introduced, it often dropped useful stuff based on what your characters needed. Now this is the exception rather than the rule.

[VIP0] Kooz

Great points. Inventory management is its own issue and I don’t want the two to be jumbled together. That probably deserves its own separate discussion.

@Peachtree Rex , I disagree. This is an urgent and overdue issue with the game. The rewards table has never been updated with gauntlet with the exception of changing the legendary crew twice. Each time they changed the crew they could have updated the loot. They chose not to.

I forgot to mention basic pulls as someone else brought up. They should also be updated to premium pulls. Since the portal has become so deep, it’s become more likely to pull redundant crew. Having more opportunities to pull quality crew might help improve morale with the ever increasing dud behold with all immortal crew. This would greatly increase interest in gauntlet.

=GBP= Plain Simple Garak

The amount of different component items that drop is far too limited. I have enough 3* interlinks to last me the rest of my life.

eXo | JessAtreides

Agreed. While I tend to cut the gauntlet slack because I like free rewards, they haven't kept up with other changes to the game, such as the addition of honor. So it would be nice to see a refresh that broadens the reward pool. (For the record, I'm always ok with more chrons, but I have more than enough trainers and basic portal pulls, thank you very much. LOL)

Amphistaff

<TGE> WhiteClifford wrote: »

You know what my favorite part about all this is?

Gauntlet is giving us items specifically for crew we don't even have.

You know what those items do?

They sit in your inventory, and build up until you have more than 1,000 unique items. And then what happens next? Items start disappearing. The useful items. Your time boosts you paid dil for. Your encoded communiques. Your science experiments.

Oh, but you could use those in the replicator, you say?

But how do I know that I'm putting Weyoun Clone 4's clothing into the replicator when they are visually identical to regular clothing patterns?

So, to recap, this is not just one problem, this is several problems which compound each other.

1. Gauntlet gives you items you can't use.
2. Your inventory has a 1,000 unique item cap, and you get no warning for that, nor can you tell it what to get rid of.
3. You cannot merely use some of these items in the replicator because you cannot see what their name is in the replicator screen.
4. Therefore, the end result is that DB's system automatically takes items you might have actually paid real money for, all because their gauntlet system is calibrated in a way that has a negative impact on the playing experience.

That's my favorite part of all of this.

A note on the replicator issue: Once you have 100% fuel in there and click Replicate it brings up a screen showing all the junk you put in there. From there you can click on an item to see what its name is so you don't accidentally throw away the wrong item.

Quit Game

They could just oh I don't know remove the item limit. I mean come on... Why is it even a thing? Crew slot limit? Fine but item limits? No, thanks. And then they make it a real pain to get rid of said items to stay within the limit. At least with crew, you know which crew will be dismissed and you get a 7 day grace period. With items, you get no such thing.

Bylo Band

For me, The Gauntlet is a different source of frustration. If I had a dollar for every two "bout" winning streak I had ended by Bartender Guinan, Mirror Flox, or various Legendary Picards (Locutus and Mirror being the most common) I could retire. As a new player, I often feel my job in The Gauntlet is to consolidate trophies from players even worse off than I am and hold them for the advanced players to come take at their leisure.

I'm making progress every day and over time I've become less of a mark in The Gauntlet, but it is really frustrating to go into it every two days knowing I really have no chance, and no clear path to improve. For my point zero two dollars' worth, if anything in The Gauntlet gets adjusted/corrected, I'd be more in favor of a system whereby players are better grouped together based on crew/captain level, or at least give players the option to choose a division like in The Arena.

At that point, I definitely think a reward overhaul would be in order, but also necessary as you'd want to reward the advanced players more for balling out in the upper tier. I think that would be a win-win-win as advanced players get what they want, newer players get the chance to not be punching bags, and DB wins because more players are satisfied/happy/content.

eXo | SilverRose (retired)

So, as a lot of people know, DB beta tested the gauntlet back before it went live. I was one of those beta testers. While I no longer, sadly, have the google doc link in my inbox since the switch to the new forums, my initial impression remains the same: this feature punishes players through RNG and is largely unrewarding.

I was initially very frustrated that placement did not guarantee results of any measure. The RNG mechanism meant that no matter how many rounds you played or how many wins you had, you had no guarantee of being rewarded for your effort.

The first gauntlet gold was Locutus. When I saw that in the beta test, I literally wrote "I will ice britches to get Locutus because I want him." Minus an 'r' there. But, as I came to see, even icing britches didn't guarantee I'd get him. I have bought many a gauntlet, my friends. My Locutus is still not fully fused. My Guinan is 3/5 only through DYS. I have yet to get a Caretaker, even despite playing every day and ranking pretty high each time. And that was a problem that we, the beta testers, foresaw being a problem even from day 0.

I also run a VIP0 and a baby beluga account and so I am not advocating for a pay to win system. What I was then and am now advocating for is a win to reward system. If you rank highly, you should get better stuff. If you maintain a long streak, you should get better stuff. But actually get that stuff -- not some RNG chance for it. The natural evolution is that those who use money to get that stuff will fall back so that others can get it too, much like we see in rerun events. That structure lets everyone compete for a bite at the apple and removes the utter randomness from reward boxes and streak prizes.

I really don't understand why the gauntlet was pushed live as-is. A lot of other beta testers (DB had us compile our feedback in a google doc, so we all read it) were equally frustrated by how RNG-driven it was. Mainly, it seemed like DB was focused on our feedback related to the tutorial explanation and any proofreading guidance we could give.

I thought it was fun but pretty frustrating and broken when it was originally pushed live. Age has not changed that opinion at all. If anything, it's made it worse. At first, the rewards seemed fair. Now that other mechanisms, like voyages, have been put into place, they are very small in comparison. I feel like DB should more broadly assess the role that RNG has to play in many of its game mechanisms, but barring that, should at least assess the gauntlet reward table to make it more current (i.e. including honor, which is conspicuously missing).

There's little incentive to play gauntlet aside from a chance at the featured gold and to gain merits. While those are fine, daily play should also be more rewarded IMO.

Cam Taliis

ByloBand wrote: »

For my point zero two dollars' worth, if anything in The Gauntlet gets adjusted/corrected, I'd be more in favor of a system whereby players are better grouped together based on crew/captain level, or at least give players the option to choose a division like in The Arena.

At that point, I definitely think a reward overhaul would be in order, but also necessary as you'd want to reward the advanced players more for balling out in the upper tier. I think that would be a win-win-win as advanced players get what they want, newer players get the chance to not be punching bags, and DB wins because more players are satisfied/happy/content.

This is exactly what I was thinking. I find it very strange that even if you only have a handful of SRs you get thrown in with Kahless, Mirror Picard, Guinan etc.
It would work better if there were different divisions so that newer players can be more than a trophy farm. They don't necessarily have to be open to compete simultaneously, they could also set it up that you progress through divisions and you can be promoted or demoted based on your ranking.

Quit Game

eXo | SilverRose wrote: »

So, as a lot of people know, DB beta tested the gauntlet back before it went live. I was one of those beta testers. While I no longer, sadly, have the google doc link in my inbox since the switch to the new forums, my initial impression remains the same: this feature punishes players through RNG and is largely unrewarding.

I was initially very frustrated that placement did not guarantee results of any measure. The RNG mechanism meant that no matter how many rounds you played or how many wins you had, you had no guarantee of being rewarded for your effort.

The first gauntlet gold was Locutus. When I saw that in the beta test, I literally wrote "I will ice britches to get Locutus because I want him." Minus an 'r' there. But, as I came to see, even icing britches didn't guarantee I'd get him. I have bought many a gauntlet, my friends. My Locutus is still not fully fused. My Guinan is 3/5 only through DYS. I have yet to get a Caretaker, even despite playing every day and ranking pretty high each time. And that was a problem that we, the beta testers, foresaw being a problem even from day 0.

I also run a VIP0 and a baby beluga account and so I am not advocating for a pay to win system. What I was then and am now advocating for is a win to reward system. If you rank highly, you should get better stuff. If you maintain a long streak, you should get better stuff. But actually get that stuff -- not some RNG chance for it. The natural evolution is that those who use money to get that stuff will fall back so that others can get it too, much like we see in rerun events. That structure lets everyone compete for a bite at the apple and removes the utter randomness from reward boxes and streak prizes.

I really don't understand why the gauntlet was pushed live as-is. A lot of other beta testers (DB had us compile our feedback in a google doc, so we all read it) were equally frustrated by how RNG-driven it was. Mainly, it seemed like DB was focused on our feedback related to the tutorial explanation and any proofreading guidance we could give.

I thought it was fun but pretty frustrating and broken when it was originally pushed live. Age has not changed that opinion at all. If anything, it's made it worse. At first, the rewards seemed fair. Now that other mechanisms, like voyages, have been put into place, they are very small in comparison. I feel like DB should more broadly assess the role that RNG has to play in many of its game mechanisms, but barring that, should at least assess the gauntlet reward table to make it more current (i.e. including honor, which is conspicuously missing).

There's little incentive to play gauntlet aside from a chance at the featured gold and to gain merits. While those are fine, daily play should also be more rewarded IMO.

They could start by removing all the trainers from gauntlet or drastically reduce the amount dropped from the voyages because this is just ridiculous. No one needs the blue trainers anyways.

Aldude

I'm sure all of the blue trainers and bad equipment would be great for newer players. I certainly thought they were useful. But voyages do make it easy to get these items now.
I've never liked the rewards system, mainly around ranks 7-10. The number of times I ended up with 3 vaults instead of 7 chests... The 3 vaults were always useless.

I have been lucky with gold crew - 2 locutus, 4 Guinan and 1 Caretaker.
But to be honest I play mainly for merits. It annoys me when I'm sitting at 670 merits, and thinking "ooh, I can get a merit pull soon"... Only to find that I'm always getting credits and it takes the day before my first merit drop... But that's a bad run of RNG for you!

Cam Taliis

Never mind, I made a mistake.

Raijinmeister

<TGE> WhiteClifford wrote: »

You know what my favorite part about all this is?

Gauntlet is giving us items specifically for crew we don't even have.

You know what those items do?

They sit in your inventory, and build up until you have more than 1,000 unique items. And then what happens next? Items start disappearing. The useful items. Your time boosts you paid dil for. Your encoded communiques. Your science experiments.

Oh, but you could use those in the replicator, you say?

But how do I know that I'm putting Weyoun Clone 4's clothing into the replicator when they are visually identical to regular clothing patterns?

So, to recap, this is not just one problem, this is several problems which compound each other.

1. Gauntlet gives you items you can't use.
2. Your inventory has a 1,000 unique item cap, and you get no warning for that, nor can you tell it what to get rid of.
3. You cannot merely use some of these items in the replicator because you cannot see what their name is in the replicator screen.
4. Therefore, the end result is that DB's system automatically takes items you might have actually paid real money for, all because their gauntlet system is calibrated in a way that has a negative impact on the playing experience.

That's my favorite part of all of this.

THIS!

[FF] Frylock IBOL17

yes, remove trainers, add honor.
HTFG, trainers are useles long term. As long as you run shuttles, you *have* trainers. I have thousands of each kind, and I spend them regularly.

Aldude

My reform preference would be:
Streak of 1,4,7 etc. A credit box. Always credits.
Streak of 2,5,8 etc. A merit box. Always merits.
Streak of 3,6 and the lower ranks: gauntlet box. You will find: up to 2* items that you can actually equip, 25-100 honour, 1-5 basic portal pulls, 20-40 chrons, 3-5* trainers (yes, I said it), jackpot.
Streak of 9,12 and mid ranks: gauntlet chest. You will find: 3* items that you can actually equip, 100-200 honour, 1-5 2* portal pulls, 40-100 chrons, jackpot.
Streak of 15,18, 21 etc. And high ranks: Gauntlet crate. You will find: 4* items that you can actually equip, 200-300 honour, 1-5 3* portal pulls, jackpot,
Top 10: 5* items that you can actually equip, 1 4* portal pull, 50 dilithium, jackpot

Not saying those specifically, but something that will make getting 3 gauntlet vaults more appealing than 7 crates.

Peachtree Rex

Aldude wrote: »

My reform preference would be:
Streak of 1,4,7 etc. A credit box. Always credits.
Streak of 2,5,8 etc. A merit box. Always merits.
Streak of 3,6 and the lower ranks: gauntlet box. You will find: up to 2* items that you can actually equip, 25-100 honour, 1-5 basic portal pulls, 20-40 chrons, 3-5* trainers (yes, I said it), jackpot.
Streak of 9,12 and mid ranks: gauntlet chest. You will find: 3* items that you can actually equip, 100-200 honour, 1-5 2* portal pulls, 40-100 chrons, jackpot.
Streak of 15,18, 21 etc. And high ranks: Gauntlet crate. You will find: 4* items that you can actually equip, 200-300 honour, 1-5 3* portal pulls, jackpot,
Top 10: 5* items that you can actually equip, 1 4* portal pull, 50 dilithium, jackpot

Not saying those specifically, but something that will make getting 3 gauntlet vaults more appealing than 7 crates.

The fact that you can't get trainers from gauntlet vaults makes 3 of them far more appealing for me vs 7 crates.

DraftedMcCoy

Im so tired of the gauntlet, I play everyday, place decent and the Caretaker never drops. Revamping the rewards structure would really freshen it up