Personally, I learnt during the dawn of digital music that accumulation for the sake of accumulation totally dilutes any emotional impact that collecting things has on me.
I'm collecting cards for the sake of collection. I don't even know who most of these characters are half the time. It's just something to do! I set myself little challenges but the RNG nature (or if you want to call that something else - gambling) makes these frustrating as they are largely out of my control. I've made my peace with 'The Grind' which was a big deal. Realising I don't have the time or patience to tiptap away enabled me to enjoy events and the game a little more.
Nevertheless, I enjoy my fleet interactions the most (excellent bunch) and the episodes. I wish we had more of them, that they were released on a regular basis and that they were harder to complete. I also wish we had a lot more of other stuff too.
I also wish it were easier to complete our 5* cards but therein lies one of the paradoxes of the game.
Gosh. It's easy to write a lot once you get started...
*EDIT - my biggest bugbear is having to pay merits to defrost my crew.
*EDIT - my biggest bugbear is having to pay merits to defrost my crew.
Agreed. I do not like having to pay merits to thaw my own crew either. I can even remember when it was first introduced... after so many merits, it started charging dilithium. I acknowledge that progress has been made in this area, but it's still foolish imho.
“A committee is a cul-de-sac, down which good ideas are lured and quietly strangled.” —Mark TwainMEMBER: [BoB] Barrel of Bloodwine... We are recruiting and putting the “curv” in scurvy! Best Event Finish: #3 Honor Debt: Inconceivable...Honor Bank Account: Slowly building...
I've been openly struggling with engagement with the game for a while - even going so far as to try developing player resources to try to come up with a new way to engage with it.
But, at the end of the day, I'm bored. STT has largely been the same lather, rinse, event, repeat for years now. We get new cards twice a week. We sometimes get a new collection or free surprise that drums up some excitement for a bit, and then it's back to the usual pattern of things. I would classify these as "snacks," and it sounds like most everyone is waiting for a "meal" -- a new episode, game mode (like gauntlet or voyages), or event type. Even the mini event was a source of temporary excitement as players built charts detailing the rewards, levels... it gave us something to dig into, and we needed it.
Essentially, we haven't had a meal in about two years now, and the people can only subsist on snacks for so long.
The number one weakness I've always seen with this game is the communication, or lack thereof. Early on, DBTPWRG set a pretty high bar with direct player engagement through having a regular game stream, actively listening to feedback and developing solutions around problem areas (cadet missions and the cyro vault were later adds to address player concerns), and even having employees chat with us on discord or Line chats to get our pulse for the game. Over time, all of those forms of engagement have eroded such that people here are aggressively linking to a 1+ hour player stream because that's the only insight into the game we get now. It's nice that Ben talks to the 10F guys, but it's not an official channel, and we need an official channel.
People heavily criticized Erin Prince's streams and messages, but it was something. It was nice to know that there was a vision for the future of the game and a meal would come at some point. I'm not entirely convinced that there will be one now, despite the mention on the player stream.
I'm still hanging in there for now, but I'm not sure if I'll last if the game is going to consist only of an endless opportunity to buy things and play the same old events.
For the record, only Idol is in 10F (though the door is open if Auto and Stars want to join). We don't have any sort of special access, we just have Idol, which is certainly great by itself.
The event hub was the most recent addition. I was kind of hoping something else would happen with that or at least be announced this week. Something to show a little more would be done with it. Or the overdue portal update. Or an announcement that the update is behind because they have something else going on with It.
Basically, even the "snacks" are becoming less frequent. The next big thing I remember being teased involves some sort of new currency. That should be what, Q1 of 2021? That could be 4.5 months away. I kind of think we need something sooner than that. And if it's another cataclysm, the rewards will need to be good. There was talk of not doing dilithium. That will only work if the rewards are pretty good.
Roughly 3 weeks ago, I was urging patience with the devs and recognizing their accomplishments over the past 2.5 years. It's been a quiet, uneventful 3 weeks. There was an update to the game - version 7.6.2 - where some tool was removed. Does anyone know what tool that was? Is it leading to some new thing? I'm thinking the communication part of @eXo | SilverRose 's post is probably the one that I would most like to see addressed.
It would be very remiss of me not to acknowledge the important quantum of progress that occurred yesterday - and I for one both thank and congratulate all at WRTP for this. Kudos to all involved.
I speak of the expansion of the number of tiers in future campaigns from 100 to 120 on a trail basis. This welcome addition will hopefully boost both dilithium stocks and prove to be a very welcome source of additional citations for players with both super rare and legendary level crew to upgrade.
I hope this small additional QoL measure works well, continues to be a part of the game that helps sustain long term daily player interest, and represents the start of an enduring evolution of this gaming experience so many long for so very much.
It would be very remiss of me not to acknowledge the important quantum of progress that occurred yesterday - and I for one both thank and congratulate all at WRTP for this. Kudos to all involved.
I speak of the expansion of the number of tiers in future campaigns from 100 to 120 on a trail basis. This welcome addition will hopefully boost both dilithium stocks and prove to be a very welcome source of additional citations for players with both super rare and legendary level crew to upgrade.
I hope this small additional QoL measure works well, continues to be a part of the game that helps sustain long term daily player interest, and represents the start of an enduring evolution of this gaming experience so many long for so very much.
While I appreciate that you are trying to find ways to both say something positive and keep this thread alive, I don't think that these types of changes are the changes the game needs. All this change is going to do is force marginal people to engage with events that they would otherwise have skipped or just stop doing campaigns altogether. I would consider this change both burdensome to players and not particularly helpful in terms of genuine engagement.
Consider this test: How does this change affect someone's need to use a spreadsheet? I say it this way because I acknowledge that many in the community use other peoples spreadsheets. In this instance it changes nothing, the game has not been made deeper in any way. This is FOMO engagement as opposed to high quality engagement. I'm not one of those who think that this type of engagement is a negative on its own, but I do hate to see people trumpet this form of iteration as a 'good thing'.
I do not think games are made better by giving more rewards, though I think people like getting more free stuff, and at best this is all this is. At worst this is going to push some people away from the game and for others increase the tedium of the game during events.
I know I've completely skipped several events over the years, and more in recent times. Faction events in particular are a total pain to get going if you're not that pushed about them. Some are going to hate doing those low quality early tiers of Galaxy events just to get those accolades that they used to get anyway. It's not about rewards, it's about cost of time and attention versus reward, and this is all low quality nonsense.
For those that are engaged this will make almost no difference, but for those that are just hanging in there waiting for the train to arrive at new development city, this might encourage them to stop waiting.
It would be very remiss of me not to acknowledge the important quantum of progress that occurred yesterday - and I for one both thank and congratulate all at WRTP for this. Kudos to all involved.
I speak of the expansion of the number of tiers in future campaigns from 100 to 120 on a trail basis. This welcome addition will hopefully boost both dilithium stocks and prove to be a very welcome source of additional citations for players with both super rare and legendary level crew to upgrade.
I hope this small additional QoL measure works well, continues to be a part of the game that helps sustain long term daily player interest, and represents the start of an enduring evolution of this gaming experience so many long for so very much.
While I appreciate that you are trying to find ways to both say something positive and keep this thread alive, I don't think that these types of changes are the changes the game needs. All this change is going to do is force marginal people to engage with events that they would otherwise have skipped or just stop doing campaigns altogether. I would consider this change both burdensome to players and not particularly helpful in terms of genuine engagement.
Consider this test: How does this change affect someone's need to use a spreadsheet? I say it this way because I acknowledge that many in the community use other peoples spreadsheets. In this instance it changes nothing, the game has not been made deeper in any way. This is FOMO engagement as opposed to high quality engagement. I'm not one of those who think that this type of engagement is a negative on its own, but I do hate to see people trumpet this form of iteration as a 'good thing'.
I do not think games are made better by giving more rewards, though I think people like getting more free stuff, and at best this is all this is. At worst this is going to push some people away from the game and for others increase the tedium of the game during events.
I know I've completely skipped several events over the years, and more in recent times. Faction events in particular are a total pain to get going if you're not that pushed about them. Some are going to hate doing those low quality early tiers of Galaxy events just to get those accolades that they used to get anyway. It's not about rewards, it's about cost of time and attention versus reward, and this is all low quality nonsense.
For those that are engaged this will make almost no difference, but for those that are just hanging in there waiting for the train to arrive at new development city, this might encourage them to stop waiting.
While I agree with you on the core problem that the game needs something really new and fresh to me this is a unnecessarily negative comment. Yes, the extended campaign does nothing to the game's depth. But it does zero harm.
If someone is at the point of being annoyed by freebies (which - as always - noone is forced to get) it is time to say goodbye to a game. Easy as that.
The free (!) extension of the campaign is literally nothing to complain about.
Wir, die Mirror Tribbles [MiT] haben freie Plätze zu vergeben. Kein Zwang und kein Stress, dafür aber Spaß, Discord und eine nette, hilfsbereite Gemeinschaft, incl. voll ausgebauter Starbase und täglich 700 ISM.
This extension is a win-win for almost everyone. TP will get a few more players to pay for the premium track, thus increasing their revenue. And the players that were already going to pay, get additional citations, which is the biggest thing players seek. And those that were on the fence, may spend money just to get additional citations. The only ones unaffected by this are those that refuse to spend money.
I think this was a good move and TP will see positive results from it.
While I appreciate that you are trying to find ways to both say something positive and keep this thread alive, I don't think that these types of changes are the changes the game needs. All this change is going to do is force marginal people to engage with events that they would otherwise have skipped or just stop doing campaigns altogether. I would consider this change both burdensome to players and not particularly helpful in terms of genuine engagement.
I think "burdensome" is a step too far. I haven't done the math, but getting a few more accolades easily from events plus the ~5-day safety net we previously had should make it a doddle. A very easy extra super-rare citation - thank you!
Otherwise, I think you're right - this doesn't address any of the game problems. Someone saying that this is "literally" nothing to complain about is literally incorrect - the time spent on this could have been spent on much-needed long-overdue heavily-requested improvements. My knee-jerk reaction was: two lego citates for $10? Bargain! But... for what? The game development has taken a nasty turn, far more mercenary than before. The new team doesn't seem to understand the game or put the player first. And players are still dropping out in their hundreds: we lose ~1,000 people from the Admiral Arena every week, currently. The game is slowly dying, so why put $10 into a game that seems likely to shut down before the end of 2021?
The extra super-rare citation is nice (thanks again!), but let's see some actual, positive game changes, please!
@Thurthorad, if a player is already so disaffected that they can’t get up the energy to send a couple waves of event shuttles each day or craft a handful of recipes over multiple days, then I’d argue they are not really playing the game anyway and they are not the target audience for the campaign extension.
Is this “deep” game development? Of course not. Is this a way to engage players that already play regularly but could perhaps be converted into even more dedicated players that (might) spend a bit more because they are more engaged? I’d say that’s the company’s goal, and that’s fine.
As a more general point, I don’t think I understand what type of game development you’re seeking that would simultaneously enhance your engagement with the game while somehow not adding to the “burdensome” aspects of time/attention needed to play. Every new feature they add will require attention, and almost certainly will be amenable to spreadsheet number-crunching to maximize performance for those that seek such things.
While I appreciate that you are trying to find ways to both say something positive and keep this thread alive, I don't think that these types of changes are the changes the game needs. All this change is going to do is force marginal people to engage with events that they would otherwise have skipped or just stop doing campaigns altogether. I would consider this change both burdensome to players and not particularly helpful in terms of genuine engagement.
I think "burdensome" is a step too far. I haven't done the math, but getting a few more accolades easily from events plus the ~5-day safety net we previously had should make it a doddle. A very easy extra super-rare citation - thank you!
Otherwise, I think you're right - this doesn't address any of the game problems. Someone saying that this is "literally" nothing to complain about is literally incorrect - the time spent on this could have been spent on much-needed long-overdue heavily-requested improvements. My knee-jerk reaction was: two lego citates for $10? Bargain! But... for what? The game development has taken a nasty turn, far more mercenary than before. The new team doesn't seem to understand the game or put the player first. And players are still dropping out in their hundreds: we lose ~1,000 people from the Admiral Arena every week, currently. The game is slowly dying, so why put $10 into a game that seems likely to shut down before the end of 2021?
The extra super-rare citation is nice (thanks again!), but let's see some actual, positive game changes, please!
Maybe because there are different people involved? Adding tiers to the campaign takes some thought and planning by designers, then a configuration change when the campaign and events are setup. A new event or game mode takes engineering resources to build those new features. Ben has hinted at something new that is in the works, but has been delayed because of COVID. So while the engineering team is busy finishing work on that new feature, other employees added this as something extra for everyone. Seems like a win/win to me.
While I appreciate that you are trying to find ways to both say something positive and keep this thread alive, I don't think that these types of changes are the changes the game needs. All this change is going to do is force marginal people to engage with events that they would otherwise have skipped or just stop doing campaigns altogether. I would consider this change both burdensome to players and not particularly helpful in terms of genuine engagement.
I largely concur. It is tinkering at the edge of the edge of the issue, but at this juncture, it is nonetheless welcome tinkering, in my view.
Consider this test: How does this change affect someone's need to use a spreadsheet? I say it this way because I acknowledge that many in the community use other peoples spreadsheets. In this instance it changes nothing, the game has not been made deeper in any way. This is FOMO engagement as opposed to high quality engagement. I'm not one of those who think that this type of engagement is a negative on its own, but I do hate to see people trumpet this form of iteration as a 'good thing'.
The value for me, as someone who buys the Campaign card more often than not is to accelerate crew development. At the moment I have almost 300 legendaries in active crew slots that require those citations. This metric will tick boxes for some in similar circumstances. It is not, however a solution as to what to do with them, when and if they are all immortalised.
I do not think games are made better by giving more rewards, though I think people like getting more free stuff, and at best this is all this is. At worst this is going to push some people away from the game and for others increase the tedium of the game during events.
I absolutely agree that this measure improves the underlying crippling issues the game suffers.
It is however, I believe, an indication that a need for change has been acknowledged, and that some small incremental action has been now been taken. Is this intended as an appetiser for further change? I believe it is, and welcome that change, while acknowledging a dearth of work remains, and dwindling time in which to effect it, given the rate of player attrition. I hope it is successful, and that its success encourages deeper, more radical action to engage the issues identified above on this thread.
I know I've completely skipped several events over the years, and more in recent times. Faction events in particular are a total pain to get going if you're not that pushed about them. Some are going to hate doing those low quality early tiers of Galaxy events just to get those accolades that they used to get anyway. It's not about rewards, it's about cost of time and attention versus reward, and this is all low quality nonsense.
Perhaps. Personally I'm not quite at that level of pained disaffection myself yet - give me until the start of 2021 and I may well be right up there with you. I would however take a view that change is to be welcomed, and if it not incremental, it risks alienating a large segment of the consumer or FTP base that is happy and engaged as things currently stand. However, if such efforts at incremental change are not supported, then I'd counter that the desperately needed more radical deeper reform will never be undertaken.
For those that are engaged this will make almost no difference, but for those that are just hanging in there waiting for the train to arrive at new development city, this might encourage them to stop waiting.
I'm prepared, within the timescales I set out out the beginning of this thread, to engage with WRTP and subsequently adjudicate the success or otherwise of this small measure, and all measures put forward in this vein, with an open mind.
Adding tiers to the campaign takes some thought and planning by designers...
Huh, perhaps I misunderstood - I thought they'd just copy-pasted the last 20 tiers again. In that case, I'm looking forward to seeing how thoughtful and well-planned the new tiers are!
Still, even if it had just been a copy-paste, even just those two hours would have been enough to extend the insufficient immortalization and gauntlet achievements, as well as adding standard collection extensions to those collections whose numbers are now seriously outdated. Ridiculously simple additions, and increasingly ridiculous that they have yet to be added.
As a more general point, I don’t think I understand what type of game development you’re seeking that would simultaneously enhance your engagement with the game while somehow not adding to the “burdensome” aspects of time/attention needed to play. Every new feature they add will require attention, and almost certainly will be amenable to spreadsheet number-crunching to maximize performance for those that seek such things.
I think this is an important aspect of game additions to consider. An average mobile game can only request a certain amount of time from its users until exhaustion hits. If playing through all the features takes several hours per day, not to mention events, people get annoyed and quit the game altogether. It happened to me in more than one game that it all became too much when brand new content was added and I stopped playing it.
Maybe it would be a good idea to abandon a time consuming feature for a new one?
For me ironically the ad warps are the most time consuming and exhausting things. I used to try to max them out for all the cadet missions, after a while reducing it to only Thursdays and Saturdays. But still this is very time consuming throughout these day and therefore annoying. If the possibility to ad-warp cadet missions was removed it would take away quite some pressure from my perfection-seeking self. Of course I could simple skip them like I do on other days but I feel like not playing the game properly if I do.
And the next-best thing to remove would be the Arena and Gauntlet, the latter also being very time consuming. To me the best thing would be to replace them with vastly improved versions of themselves, with better rewards plus fresh and interesting mechanics.
Wir, die Mirror Tribbles [MiT] haben freie Plätze zu vergeben. Kein Zwang und kein Stress, dafür aber Spaß, Discord und eine nette, hilfsbereite Gemeinschaft, incl. voll ausgebauter Starbase und täglich 700 ISM.
OK, first off I want to say that I misunderstood the announcement, I assumed that the last 20 campaign nodes had been moved, not replicated. So the premium pack now contains 2 Legendary citations and the non-premium track contains 2 purple citations. That is a big adjustment, and I think I have a better idea of why people care more about it than I expected. An extra legendary citations is *a lot* more stuff.
I'm not sure how to feel about this to be honest. I kinda feel that easy access to citations is a part of the problem that has made the game so stale. Despite spending 4 citations on the latest event Data, I still have nearly 20 in reserve.
This also follows the 'discounting to keep us spending' model, rather than 'investing in the game to make it better' model of development. The former being a sign that they're just milking what's left of the player base, and the latter being an attempt to reacquire some older players.
We have yet to see how many accolades will be available during events. If there are a lot, this may yet be a QoL improvement, if it makes campaigns easier to complete.
@Thurthorad, if a player is already so disaffected that they can’t get up the energy to send a couple waves of event shuttles each day or craft a handful of recipes over multiple days, then I’d argue they are not really playing the game anyway and they are not the target audience for the campaign extension.
I think there are a lot of players currently in this category who may be fans of one or two shows who participate when a character they like comes up. They otherwise login twice a day to push their campaign forward. I would go as far as to say that nearly all of the active players I know are in this category. Mostly we are in a holding pattern, waiting for this development that's been promised to happen. If the campaign doesn't interest them they may blow off an entire month. I certainly don't buy the campaign until I've completed it and I'll only strive to complete it if I like the legendary. 2 Legendary citations might change that calculus, I don't know.
As a more general point, I don’t think I understand what type of game development you’re seeking that would simultaneously enhance your engagement with the game while somehow not adding to the “burdensome” aspects of time/attention needed to play. Every new feature they add will require attention, and almost certainly will be amenable to spreadsheet number-crunching to maximize performance for those that seek such things.
There's a difference between time spent in a game doing fun stuff and time spent doing makework. This is a classic mobile game issue, where developers want to keep you in the game by giving you tasks to do. I would hope that at this stage most of you can tell that that's not proper gameplay. So development that leads to an expansion of the actual gameplay is not burdensome, because it makes the game deeper and more fun.
I think this is an important aspect of game additions to consider. An average mobile game can only request a certain amount of time from its users until exhaustion hits. If playing through all the features takes several hours per day, not to mention events, people get annoyed and quit the game altogether. It happened to me in more than one game that it all became too much when brand new content was added and I stopped playing it.
Maybe it would be a good idea to abandon a time consuming feature for a new one?
I think that this might be ideal. I've long wanted Voyages 2.0 which uses more crew or frozen crew. I've suggested deep space voyages which use frozen crew and are a daily interaction. The core issue is that the game doesn't really use deep rosters, so anything that can be done to address this is a plus.
I think that this might be ideal. I've long wanted Voyages 2.0 which uses more crew or frozen crew. I've suggested deep space voyages which use frozen crew and are a daily interaction. The core issue is that the game doesn't really use deep rosters, so anything that can be done to address this is a plus.
/signed
Speaking of voyages... they are too time consuming as well. Having to interact with them every 2 hours and permanently towards the end to max them is too much.
I would prefer to send them, have them go as long as they can (the game tells me upfront like Datacore how long this will be) and after the crew returned they cannot be used for voyages for the rest of the week as they need to recover from all their adventures. Then the next best team could go on a voyage, ideally also freezer crew, agreed. This would utilize deep rosters as well as remove boring micromanagement.
Wir, die Mirror Tribbles [MiT] haben freie Plätze zu vergeben. Kein Zwang und kein Stress, dafür aber Spaß, Discord und eine nette, hilfsbereite Gemeinschaft, incl. voll ausgebauter Starbase und täglich 700 ISM.
And the next-best thing to remove would be the Arena and Gauntlet, the latter also being very time consuming. To me the best thing would be to replace them with vastly improved versions of themselves, with better rewards plus fresh and interesting mechanics.
This isn't completely what is related to this thread or what you're suggesting, but reading your comment just got me real excited about the idea of doing a "season" that alternates between arena and gauntlet -- only one at a time, and maybe come up with some sort of season-long ranking reward structure on top of it too.
It would be very remiss of me not to acknowledge the important quantum of progress that occurred yesterday - and I for one both thank and congratulate all at WRTP for this. Kudos to all involved.
I speak of the expansion of the number of tiers in future campaigns from 100 to 120 on a trail basis. This welcome addition will hopefully boost both dilithium stocks and prove to be a very welcome source of additional citations for players with both super rare and legendary level crew to upgrade.
I hope this small additional QoL measure works well, continues to be a part of the game that helps sustain long term daily player interest, and represents the start of an enduring evolution of this gaming experience so many long for so very much.
While I appreciate that you are trying to find ways to both say something positive and keep this thread alive, I don't think that these types of changes are the changes the game needs. All this change is going to do is force marginal people to engage with events that they would otherwise have skipped or just stop doing campaigns altogether. I would consider this change both burdensome to players and not particularly helpful in terms of genuine engagement.
Consider this test: How does this change affect someone's need to use a spreadsheet? I say it this way because I acknowledge that many in the community use other peoples spreadsheets. In this instance it changes nothing, the game has not been made deeper in any way. This is FOMO engagement as opposed to high quality engagement. I'm not one of those who think that this type of engagement is a negative on its own, but I do hate to see people trumpet this form of iteration as a 'good thing'.
I do not think games are made better by giving more rewards, though I think people like getting more free stuff, and at best this is all this is. At worst this is going to push some people away from the game and for others increase the tedium of the game during events.
I know I've completely skipped several events over the years, and more in recent times. Faction events in particular are a total pain to get going if you're not that pushed about them. Some are going to hate doing those low quality early tiers of Galaxy events just to get those accolades that they used to get anyway. It's not about rewards, it's about cost of time and attention versus reward, and this is all low quality nonsense.
For those that are engaged this will make almost no difference, but for those that are just hanging in there waiting for the train to arrive at new development city, this might encourage them to stop waiting.
While I agree with you on the core problem that the game needs something really new and fresh to me this is a unnecessarily negative comment. Yes, the extended campaign does nothing to the game's depth. But it does zero harm.
If someone is at the point of being annoyed by freebies (which - as always - noone is forced to get) it is time to say goodbye to a game. Easy as that.
The free (!) extension of the campaign is literally nothing to complain about.
On one hand, it is more freebies. On the other hand, it's a marketing ploy to get more people to purchase the premium campaign, and also encourage existing/new premium campaign purchasers to increase their VIP level to 14 to ensure they clear the 20 new levels.
This is hardly a selfless act done for no reason other than to reward a loyal player base. This is a calculated move to increase sales revenue, while adding value for those who already make the purchase in question. I wonder if the recent string of terrible 2-skill campaign 5* caused a decrease in premium campaign purchases, so this is an attempt to at the very least restore the lost revenue of recent campaigns?
It would be very remiss of me not to acknowledge the important quantum of progress that occurred yesterday - and I for one both thank and congratulate all at WRTP for this. Kudos to all involved.
I speak of the expansion of the number of tiers in future campaigns from 100 to 120 on a trail basis. This welcome addition will hopefully boost both dilithium stocks and prove to be a very welcome source of additional citations for players with both super rare and legendary level crew to upgrade.
I hope this small additional QoL measure works well, continues to be a part of the game that helps sustain long term daily player interest, and represents the start of an enduring evolution of this gaming experience so many long for so very much.
While I appreciate that you are trying to find ways to both say something positive and keep this thread alive, I don't think that these types of changes are the changes the game needs. All this change is going to do is force marginal people to engage with events that they would otherwise have skipped or just stop doing campaigns altogether. I would consider this change both burdensome to players and not particularly helpful in terms of genuine engagement.
Consider this test: How does this change affect someone's need to use a spreadsheet? I say it this way because I acknowledge that many in the community use other peoples spreadsheets. In this instance it changes nothing, the game has not been made deeper in any way. This is FOMO engagement as opposed to high quality engagement. I'm not one of those who think that this type of engagement is a negative on its own, but I do hate to see people trumpet this form of iteration as a 'good thing'.
I do not think games are made better by giving more rewards, though I think people like getting more free stuff, and at best this is all this is. At worst this is going to push some people away from the game and for others increase the tedium of the game during events.
I know I've completely skipped several events over the years, and more in recent times. Faction events in particular are a total pain to get going if you're not that pushed about them. Some are going to hate doing those low quality early tiers of Galaxy events just to get those accolades that they used to get anyway. It's not about rewards, it's about cost of time and attention versus reward, and this is all low quality nonsense.
For those that are engaged this will make almost no difference, but for those that are just hanging in there waiting for the train to arrive at new development city, this might encourage them to stop waiting.
While I agree with you on the core problem that the game needs something really new and fresh to me this is a unnecessarily negative comment. Yes, the extended campaign does nothing to the game's depth. But it does zero harm.
If someone is at the point of being annoyed by freebies (which - as always - noone is forced to get) it is time to say goodbye to a game. Easy as that.
The free (!) extension of the campaign is literally nothing to complain about.
On one hand, it is more freebies. On the other hand, it's a marketing ploy to get more people to purchase the premium campaign, and also encourage existing/new premium campaign purchasers to increase their VIP level to 14 to ensure they clear the 20 new levels.
This is hardly a selfless act done for no reason other than to reward a loyal player base. This is a calculated move to increase sales revenue, while adding value for those who already make the purchase in question. I wonder if the recent string of terrible 2-skill campaign 5* caused a decrease in premium campaign purchases, so this is an attempt to at the very least restore the lost revenue of recent campaigns?
It's clearly an attempt to increase sales. The announcement saying they are "trying something new" is clear that they want to try something and see how it performs. But what's wrong with that? I was not going to buy the campaign in its original form. With the second citation I'm now much more likely to buy it. If I buy it, it's not because I was tricked into anything. I'll buy it because I think the extra rewards are making the campaign worth the $10 while I didn't think the initial rewards were worth $10. So TP increased the value in the campaign, I made an informed decision based on that new value to give them $10. They come away with an extra $10 from me, and I come away with a 4/5 kirk, 2 5* citations, and all the other goodies. If I'm happy with that transaction and so is TP, it's a win-win.
The only thing they will be looking out for is if this change makes me less likely to buy other offers or future campaigns without the extra tiers. That's why they said they're trying it and not making it a permanent change.
Oh, and if I don't buy the campaign, I still benefit from the extra 4* citation they are giving away for free.
An awesome is not enough - that is brilliant Penguin. 😂😂😂
It's not my only project to try and keep me interested. For Interference Part One, I always choose option C and destroy the substance, and have been doing for years. I'm hoping that if I do it enough times, I'll eventually glass the planet and will remove the dilemma from my voyages altogether!
I think that the messages posted here are free gold to the developers of this game, and that WRTP ought to thank all that have contributed in the spirit of betterment of this game.
I gave the 120 round campaign a shot, as did many here. FWIW I approve of this development, and would have liked to have seen it continue. Sadly, it proved too little and too late for this particular player.
I've said goodbye to my fleet-mates earlier this week, and left behind a largely awesome bunch of supportive and humorous people, people I have come to appreciate, from all 'corners' of this blue marble. People who have held faith with this product, and continue to do so, in the dwindling hope of something new. For so long, they and they alone, have been the only motivation I had to continue the drudge which this game has sadly been allowed to become.
I have already done so by email, but I would also like to state it on record here, that the Customer Service agents responsible for handling player issues, are amongst some of the best with whom I have ever interacted. To a person, they deserve respect, thanks, and stupendous end-of-year bonus packages for their unfailing help and interest.
And you - I wish you all well in your STT adventures, people. Happy, healthy and safe holidays to one and all.
I think that the messages posted here are free gold to the developers of this game, and that WRTP ought to thank all that have contributed in the spirit of betterment of this game.
I gave the 120 round campaign a shot, as did many here. FWIW I approve of this development, and would have liked to have seen it continue. Sadly, it proved too little and too late for this particular player.
I've said goodbye to my fleet-mates earlier this week, and left behind a largely awesome bunch of supportive and humorous people, people I have come to appreciate, from all 'corners' of this blue marble. People who have held faith with this product, and continue to do so, in the dwindling hope of something new. For so long, they and they alone, have been the only motivation I had to continue the drudge which this game has sadly been allowed to become.
I have already done so by email, but I would also like to state it on record here, that the Customer Service agents responsible for handling player issues, are amongst some of the best with whom I have ever interacted. To a person, they deserve respect, thanks, and stupendous end-of-year bonus packages for their unfailing help and interest.
And you - I wish you all well in your STT adventures, people. Happy, healthy and safe holidays to one and all.
LLAP.
Oomox
-- Hailing frequencies are closed --
If only you had been this gracious in your recent response in this thread earlier today.
Judging from your unnecessary rudeness there, as well as a great deal of negativity in this one, you seem to have a great deal of negative energy going around. I sincerely hope that your time away from this game, whether permanent or temporary, allows you to find happiness that you clearly currently lack.
At the risk of moving this thread back towards its intended target, the game has gone stale. The current offers are good, yet because TP has done nothing to advance the game in 9 months, I am struggling to justify the expense. I fear that TP is milking current players until an inevitable shutdown, making any spending futile (in a time where many are struggling with money issues).
I appreciate Oomox’s and SilverRose’s comments and fear they may be the first of many. May they (and anyone else who leaves the game) do well in whatever they choose to spend their time on.
Fleet Leaderboards would be nice from Tilting Point vs. getting stuff nobody ever asked for on our screens IMHO. Thx
I am going to take a guess and say the reason for Klingon Marauders crushing every faction event this year was in response to Yamamoto declaring themselves the greatest fleet of 2019.
I find it really frustrating that we're losing players like SilverRose and Oomox just days/hours before the mini-event. Finally we're going to get some use out of the Event Hub button, and I'm really looking forward to the new prizes after the dilfest last time (yes, I know it won't be dil again!), but because TP have kept it a surprise and not made more announcements about it apart from the initial reveal, they've missed the chance to hook players into sticking around for just one more week.
Personally, I have been feeling the fatigue a lot during the current nega-event. I genuinely didn't think I'd last until the end of the month, and then being the latest victim of Lorca's bullying wasn't doing much for me either. But getting so much support from the community (thank you for the PMs!) and seeing most people decry his bad behavior has been surprisingly... inspiring! Ironically, his attempt to force me off the forums has shown me that there are still lots of good people here, and I am now gung-ho about sticking around, being more active, and making it to the next Convergence Day event!
I have traditionally treated myself to an extra $10 or $25 offer for Christmas on Timelines. This year is a little different, as the game hasn't earned any of my money for over six months, but make tomorrow's mini-event a humzinger, TP, and I may go for a campaign/monthly card/$10 offer combo to show my support!
Comments
I'm collecting cards for the sake of collection. I don't even know who most of these characters are half the time. It's just something to do! I set myself little challenges but the RNG nature (or if you want to call that something else - gambling) makes these frustrating as they are largely out of my control. I've made my peace with 'The Grind' which was a big deal. Realising I don't have the time or patience to tiptap away enabled me to enjoy events and the game a little more.
Nevertheless, I enjoy my fleet interactions the most (excellent bunch) and the episodes. I wish we had more of them, that they were released on a regular basis and that they were harder to complete. I also wish we had a lot more of other stuff too.
I also wish it were easier to complete our 5* cards but therein lies one of the paradoxes of the game.
Gosh. It's easy to write a lot once you get started...
*EDIT - my biggest bugbear is having to pay merits to defrost my crew.
Agreed. I do not like having to pay merits to thaw my own crew either. I can even remember when it was first introduced... after so many merits, it started charging dilithium. I acknowledge that progress has been made in this area, but it's still foolish imho.
I've been openly struggling with engagement with the game for a while - even going so far as to try developing player resources to try to come up with a new way to engage with it.
But, at the end of the day, I'm bored. STT has largely been the same lather, rinse, event, repeat for years now. We get new cards twice a week. We sometimes get a new collection or free surprise that drums up some excitement for a bit, and then it's back to the usual pattern of things. I would classify these as "snacks," and it sounds like most everyone is waiting for a "meal" -- a new episode, game mode (like gauntlet or voyages), or event type. Even the mini event was a source of temporary excitement as players built charts detailing the rewards, levels... it gave us something to dig into, and we needed it.
Essentially, we haven't had a meal in about two years now, and the people can only subsist on snacks for so long.
The number one weakness I've always seen with this game is the communication, or lack thereof. Early on, DBTPWRG set a pretty high bar with direct player engagement through having a regular game stream, actively listening to feedback and developing solutions around problem areas (cadet missions and the cyro vault were later adds to address player concerns), and even having employees chat with us on discord or Line chats to get our pulse for the game. Over time, all of those forms of engagement have eroded such that people here are aggressively linking to a 1+ hour player stream because that's the only insight into the game we get now. It's nice that Ben talks to the 10F guys, but it's not an official channel, and we need an official channel.
People heavily criticized Erin Prince's streams and messages, but it was something. It was nice to know that there was a vision for the future of the game and a meal would come at some point. I'm not entirely convinced that there will be one now, despite the mention on the player stream.
I'm still hanging in there for now, but I'm not sure if I'll last if the game is going to consist only of an endless opportunity to buy things and play the same old events.
The people are hungry. Feed us.
Proud Former Officer of The Gluten Empire
Retired 12-14-20. So long, and thanks for all the cat pics!
The event hub was the most recent addition. I was kind of hoping something else would happen with that or at least be announced this week. Something to show a little more would be done with it. Or the overdue portal update. Or an announcement that the update is behind because they have something else going on with It.
Basically, even the "snacks" are becoming less frequent. The next big thing I remember being teased involves some sort of new currency. That should be what, Q1 of 2021? That could be 4.5 months away. I kind of think we need something sooner than that. And if it's another cataclysm, the rewards will need to be good. There was talk of not doing dilithium. That will only work if the rewards are pretty good.
Roughly 3 weeks ago, I was urging patience with the devs and recognizing their accomplishments over the past 2.5 years. It's been a quiet, uneventful 3 weeks. There was an update to the game - version 7.6.2 - where some tool was removed. Does anyone know what tool that was? Is it leading to some new thing? I'm thinking the communication part of @eXo | SilverRose 's post is probably the one that I would most like to see addressed.
We are the Burnham. Lower your shields and surrender your ships. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own.
It would be very remiss of me not to acknowledge the important quantum of progress that occurred yesterday - and I for one both thank and congratulate all at WRTP for this. Kudos to all involved.
I speak of the expansion of the number of tiers in future campaigns from 100 to 120 on a trail basis. This welcome addition will hopefully boost both dilithium stocks and prove to be a very welcome source of additional citations for players with both super rare and legendary level crew to upgrade.
I hope this small additional QoL measure works well, continues to be a part of the game that helps sustain long term daily player interest, and represents the start of an enduring evolution of this gaming experience so many long for so very much.
While I appreciate that you are trying to find ways to both say something positive and keep this thread alive, I don't think that these types of changes are the changes the game needs. All this change is going to do is force marginal people to engage with events that they would otherwise have skipped or just stop doing campaigns altogether. I would consider this change both burdensome to players and not particularly helpful in terms of genuine engagement.
Consider this test: How does this change affect someone's need to use a spreadsheet? I say it this way because I acknowledge that many in the community use other peoples spreadsheets. In this instance it changes nothing, the game has not been made deeper in any way. This is FOMO engagement as opposed to high quality engagement. I'm not one of those who think that this type of engagement is a negative on its own, but I do hate to see people trumpet this form of iteration as a 'good thing'.
I do not think games are made better by giving more rewards, though I think people like getting more free stuff, and at best this is all this is. At worst this is going to push some people away from the game and for others increase the tedium of the game during events.
I know I've completely skipped several events over the years, and more in recent times. Faction events in particular are a total pain to get going if you're not that pushed about them. Some are going to hate doing those low quality early tiers of Galaxy events just to get those accolades that they used to get anyway. It's not about rewards, it's about cost of time and attention versus reward, and this is all low quality nonsense.
For those that are engaged this will make almost no difference, but for those that are just hanging in there waiting for the train to arrive at new development city, this might encourage them to stop waiting.
While I agree with you on the core problem that the game needs something really new and fresh to me this is a unnecessarily negative comment. Yes, the extended campaign does nothing to the game's depth. But it does zero harm.
If someone is at the point of being annoyed by freebies (which - as always - noone is forced to get) it is time to say goodbye to a game. Easy as that.
The free (!) extension of the campaign is literally nothing to complain about.
I think this was a good move and TP will see positive results from it.
Otherwise, I think you're right - this doesn't address any of the game problems. Someone saying that this is "literally" nothing to complain about is literally incorrect - the time spent on this could have been spent on much-needed long-overdue heavily-requested improvements. My knee-jerk reaction was: two lego citates for $10? Bargain! But... for what? The game development has taken a nasty turn, far more mercenary than before. The new team doesn't seem to understand the game or put the player first. And players are still dropping out in their hundreds: we lose ~1,000 people from the Admiral Arena every week, currently. The game is slowly dying, so why put $10 into a game that seems likely to shut down before the end of 2021?
The extra super-rare citation is nice (thanks again!), but let's see some actual, positive game changes, please!
Is this “deep” game development? Of course not. Is this a way to engage players that already play regularly but could perhaps be converted into even more dedicated players that (might) spend a bit more because they are more engaged? I’d say that’s the company’s goal, and that’s fine.
As a more general point, I don’t think I understand what type of game development you’re seeking that would simultaneously enhance your engagement with the game while somehow not adding to the “burdensome” aspects of time/attention needed to play. Every new feature they add will require attention, and almost certainly will be amenable to spreadsheet number-crunching to maximize performance for those that seek such things.
Maybe because there are different people involved? Adding tiers to the campaign takes some thought and planning by designers, then a configuration change when the campaign and events are setup. A new event or game mode takes engineering resources to build those new features. Ben has hinted at something new that is in the works, but has been delayed because of COVID. So while the engineering team is busy finishing work on that new feature, other employees added this as something extra for everyone. Seems like a win/win to me.
I largely concur. It is tinkering at the edge of the edge of the issue, but at this juncture, it is nonetheless welcome tinkering, in my view.
The value for me, as someone who buys the Campaign card more often than not is to accelerate crew development. At the moment I have almost 300 legendaries in active crew slots that require those citations. This metric will tick boxes for some in similar circumstances. It is not, however a solution as to what to do with them, when and if they are all immortalised.
I absolutely agree that this measure improves the underlying crippling issues the game suffers.
It is however, I believe, an indication that a need for change has been acknowledged, and that some small incremental action has been now been taken. Is this intended as an appetiser for further change? I believe it is, and welcome that change, while acknowledging a dearth of work remains, and dwindling time in which to effect it, given the rate of player attrition. I hope it is successful, and that its success encourages deeper, more radical action to engage the issues identified above on this thread.
Perhaps. Personally I'm not quite at that level of pained disaffection myself yet - give me until the start of 2021 and I may well be right up there with you. I would however take a view that change is to be welcomed, and if it not incremental, it risks alienating a large segment of the consumer or FTP base that is happy and engaged as things currently stand. However, if such efforts at incremental change are not supported, then I'd counter that the desperately needed more radical deeper reform will never be undertaken.
I'm prepared, within the timescales I set out out the beginning of this thread, to engage with WRTP and subsequently adjudicate the success or otherwise of this small measure, and all measures put forward in this vein, with an open mind.
Still, even if it had just been a copy-paste, even just those two hours would have been enough to extend the insufficient immortalization and gauntlet achievements, as well as adding standard collection extensions to those collections whose numbers are now seriously outdated. Ridiculously simple additions, and increasingly ridiculous that they have yet to be added.
I think this is an important aspect of game additions to consider. An average mobile game can only request a certain amount of time from its users until exhaustion hits. If playing through all the features takes several hours per day, not to mention events, people get annoyed and quit the game altogether. It happened to me in more than one game that it all became too much when brand new content was added and I stopped playing it.
Maybe it would be a good idea to abandon a time consuming feature for a new one?
For me ironically the ad warps are the most time consuming and exhausting things. I used to try to max them out for all the cadet missions, after a while reducing it to only Thursdays and Saturdays. But still this is very time consuming throughout these day and therefore annoying. If the possibility to ad-warp cadet missions was removed it would take away quite some pressure from my perfection-seeking self. Of course I could simple skip them like I do on other days but I feel like not playing the game properly if I do.
And the next-best thing to remove would be the Arena and Gauntlet, the latter also being very time consuming. To me the best thing would be to replace them with vastly improved versions of themselves, with better rewards plus fresh and interesting mechanics.
I'm not sure how to feel about this to be honest. I kinda feel that easy access to citations is a part of the problem that has made the game so stale. Despite spending 4 citations on the latest event Data, I still have nearly 20 in reserve.
This also follows the 'discounting to keep us spending' model, rather than 'investing in the game to make it better' model of development. The former being a sign that they're just milking what's left of the player base, and the latter being an attempt to reacquire some older players.
We have yet to see how many accolades will be available during events. If there are a lot, this may yet be a QoL improvement, if it makes campaigns easier to complete.
I think there are a lot of players currently in this category who may be fans of one or two shows who participate when a character they like comes up. They otherwise login twice a day to push their campaign forward. I would go as far as to say that nearly all of the active players I know are in this category. Mostly we are in a holding pattern, waiting for this development that's been promised to happen. If the campaign doesn't interest them they may blow off an entire month. I certainly don't buy the campaign until I've completed it and I'll only strive to complete it if I like the legendary. 2 Legendary citations might change that calculus, I don't know.
There's a difference between time spent in a game doing fun stuff and time spent doing makework. This is a classic mobile game issue, where developers want to keep you in the game by giving you tasks to do. I would hope that at this stage most of you can tell that that's not proper gameplay. So development that leads to an expansion of the actual gameplay is not burdensome, because it makes the game deeper and more fun.
I think that this might be ideal. I've long wanted Voyages 2.0 which uses more crew or frozen crew. I've suggested deep space voyages which use frozen crew and are a daily interaction. The core issue is that the game doesn't really use deep rosters, so anything that can be done to address this is a plus.
Speaking of voyages... they are too time consuming as well. Having to interact with them every 2 hours and permanently towards the end to max them is too much.
I would prefer to send them, have them go as long as they can (the game tells me upfront like Datacore how long this will be) and after the crew returned they cannot be used for voyages for the rest of the week as they need to recover from all their adventures. Then the next best team could go on a voyage, ideally also freezer crew, agreed. This would utilize deep rosters as well as remove boring micromanagement.
This isn't completely what is related to this thread or what you're suggesting, but reading your comment just got me real excited about the idea of doing a "season" that alternates between arena and gauntlet -- only one at a time, and maybe come up with some sort of season-long ranking reward structure on top of it too.
On one hand, it is more freebies. On the other hand, it's a marketing ploy to get more people to purchase the premium campaign, and also encourage existing/new premium campaign purchasers to increase their VIP level to 14 to ensure they clear the 20 new levels.
This is hardly a selfless act done for no reason other than to reward a loyal player base. This is a calculated move to increase sales revenue, while adding value for those who already make the purchase in question. I wonder if the recent string of terrible 2-skill campaign 5* caused a decrease in premium campaign purchases, so this is an attempt to at the very least restore the lost revenue of recent campaigns?
It's clearly an attempt to increase sales. The announcement saying they are "trying something new" is clear that they want to try something and see how it performs. But what's wrong with that? I was not going to buy the campaign in its original form. With the second citation I'm now much more likely to buy it. If I buy it, it's not because I was tricked into anything. I'll buy it because I think the extra rewards are making the campaign worth the $10 while I didn't think the initial rewards were worth $10. So TP increased the value in the campaign, I made an informed decision based on that new value to give them $10. They come away with an extra $10 from me, and I come away with a 4/5 kirk, 2 5* citations, and all the other goodies. If I'm happy with that transaction and so is TP, it's a win-win.
The only thing they will be looking out for is if this change makes me less likely to buy other offers or future campaigns without the extra tiers. That's why they said they're trying it and not making it a permanent change.
Oh, and if I don't buy the campaign, I still benefit from the extra 4* citation they are giving away for free.
Time to move on up to the legendaries!
(That's a month or two back, she's up to 12/5 now!)
Another thing I've taken to doing is rewriting the narratives in voyages, which is quite challenging given our limited parameters:
It's not my only project to try and keep me interested. For Interference Part One, I always choose option C and destroy the substance, and have been doing for years. I'm hoping that if I do it enough times, I'll eventually glass the planet and will remove the dilemma from my voyages altogether!
No luck so far...
I think that the messages posted here are free gold to the developers of this game, and that WRTP ought to thank all that have contributed in the spirit of betterment of this game.
I gave the 120 round campaign a shot, as did many here. FWIW I approve of this development, and would have liked to have seen it continue. Sadly, it proved too little and too late for this particular player.
I've said goodbye to my fleet-mates earlier this week, and left behind a largely awesome bunch of supportive and humorous people, people I have come to appreciate, from all 'corners' of this blue marble. People who have held faith with this product, and continue to do so, in the dwindling hope of something new. For so long, they and they alone, have been the only motivation I had to continue the drudge which this game has sadly been allowed to become.
I have already done so by email, but I would also like to state it on record here, that the Customer Service agents responsible for handling player issues, are amongst some of the best with whom I have ever interacted. To a person, they deserve respect, thanks, and stupendous end-of-year bonus packages for their unfailing help and interest.
And you - I wish you all well in your STT adventures, people. Happy, healthy and safe holidays to one and all.
LLAP.
Oomox
-- Hailing frequencies are closed --
If only you had been this gracious in your recent response in this thread earlier today.
Judging from your unnecessary rudeness there, as well as a great deal of negativity in this one, you seem to have a great deal of negative energy going around. I sincerely hope that your time away from this game, whether permanent or temporary, allows you to find happiness that you clearly currently lack.
LLAP
I appreciate Oomox’s and SilverRose’s comments and fear they may be the first of many. May they (and anyone else who leaves the game) do well in whatever they choose to spend their time on.
I am going to take a guess and say the reason for Klingon Marauders crushing every faction event this year was in response to Yamamoto declaring themselves the greatest fleet of 2019.
I find it really frustrating that we're losing players like SilverRose and Oomox just days/hours before the mini-event. Finally we're going to get some use out of the Event Hub button, and I'm really looking forward to the new prizes after the dilfest last time (yes, I know it won't be dil again!), but because TP have kept it a surprise and not made more announcements about it apart from the initial reveal, they've missed the chance to hook players into sticking around for just one more week.
Personally, I have been feeling the fatigue a lot during the current nega-event. I genuinely didn't think I'd last until the end of the month, and then being the latest victim of Lorca's bullying wasn't doing much for me either. But getting so much support from the community (thank you for the PMs!) and seeing most people decry his bad behavior has been surprisingly... inspiring! Ironically, his attempt to force me off the forums has shown me that there are still lots of good people here, and I am now gung-ho about sticking around, being more active, and making it to the next Convergence Day event!
I have traditionally treated myself to an extra $10 or $25 offer for Christmas on Timelines. This year is a little different, as the game hasn't earned any of my money for over six months, but make tomorrow's mini-event a humzinger, TP, and I may go for a campaign/monthly card/$10 offer combo to show my support!