I used to get (almost) every new 5* from the events, but I stopped last year because it's just too much boring grinding for no noticeable gameplay advantage. I can comfortably make a 10 hour voyage even if it's the middle of a faction event, and I don't try for 12 hours because it's too random and I don't like to babysit my voyages. From my point of view, the power creep is small--certainly compared to many other games with more PvP. What little extra stats the new "best" crew gives you just doesn't make much difference, there are plenty of other options. It's probably good for newer players too. They can hope to get some more useful crew, and can forget about collecting the likes of Captain Morgan Bateson, whose third star I lucked into during the latest honor sale.
Since crew retrieval came out, you don't even have to worry that much if you miss some crew you later decide you really want, you can just retrieve it eventually.
Unless you really do want to catch 'em all, in which case, this is going to become a very expensive game.
My main issue is the spacing of the releases. Having them so close together results in a bit of event grind burnout. Especially with the addition of new midweek objective events annoyingly designed to further drain resources.
If they had the same number of top voyagers per year but released more evenly across the calendar, it would be far more palatable, for myself at least.
My main issue is the spacing of the releases. Having them so close together results in a bit of event grind burnout. Especially with the addition of new midweek objective events annoyingly designed to further drain resources.
If they had the same number of top voyagers per year but released more evenly across the calendar, it would be far more palatable, for myself at least.
This is exactly what i mean. I feel like once or twice a month there is a new supremely powerful crew to obtain.
I understand the whales wanting to savagey defend this new format, and im not saying i dont want new powerful crew, but at this point, i feel like tier 10 is not low enough because so many crew that were marginally desirable in beholds are quickly becoming total wastes of time.
Yes, fbb gives incentive to all crew, but at the cost of crew slots and if you want to freeze a low power or aged gold, its gonna cost you 160k honor minimum.
Just saying, i understand whales calling it “whining” but this new pace of tier 1’s rolling out will be a big problem before too long.
Just saying, i understand whales calling it “whining” but this new pace of tier 1’s rolling out will be a big problem before too long.
Earnestly, though, I don't think the size of the problem, if it even is a problem, is that large. It's not as though the new top crew are SO much better than existing ones that the Big Book peeps need to invent a Tier 0 to handle it. The Value Over Replacement Card, if you like, of the new arrivals is not so much that it instantly renders older cards obsolete. If a 1/5 Arex had a voyage total that was 100s more than a 5/5 Gary Seven, or something, I'd agree there was a power creep problem, but that's not what's happening. And on the other hand cards like Vindicta, who with her limitless hammer is clearly designed for FBB, have been released as 4*s anyone can get for a very small effort.
From my point of view there's a point where with enough immortalised golds you can consistently hit 10 hour voyages and staff event shuttles simultaneously, and at that point - which in all honesty does not need more than a few dozen cards in the Tier 1-4 range, really - any improvement to your roster becomes incredibly marginal, so chasing new cards that happen to be Tier 1 becomes purely a matter of choice, just as much as eg selecting a fave character to immortalise all variants of is. That's where I think the disconnect in this thread is, because you're taking as a premise that it's absolutely essential to collect all new Tier 1 crew, but even most of the people who do choose to do that don't really see it that way.
Just saying, i understand whales calling it “whining” but this new pace of tier 1’s rolling out will be a big problem before too long.
Earnestly, though, I don't think the size of the problem, if it even is a problem, is that large. It's not as though the new top crew are SO much better than existing ones that the Big Book peeps need to invent a Tier 0 to handle it. The Value Over Replacement Card, if you like, of the new arrivals is not so much that it instantly renders older cards obsolete. If a 1/5 Arex had a voyage total that was 100s more than a 5/5 Gary Seven, or something, I'd agree there was a power creep problem, but that's not what's happening. And on the other hand cards like Vindicta, who with her limitless hammer is clearly designed for FBB, have been released as 4*s anyone can get for a very small effort.
From my point of view there's a point where with enough immortalised golds you can consistently hit 10 hour voyages and staff event shuttles simultaneously, and at that point - which in all honesty does not need more than a few dozen cards in the Tier 1-4 range, really - any improvement to your roster becomes incredibly marginal, so chasing new cards that happen to be Tier 1 becomes purely a matter of choice, just as much as eg selecting a fave character to immortalise all variants of is. That's where I think the disconnect in this thread is, because you're taking as a premise that it's absolutely essential to collect all new Tier 1 crew, but even most of the people who do choose to do that don't really see it that way.
I dont disagree with what you are saying.
But even at the “modest” incremental increase in stats, eventually (6-12 months?) these new powerful crew will make 14 hr or even 16hr voyages possible. And it will be impossible unless you have those crew. So, the crew that you used for 10 hour voyages will be completely useless except for shuttle events, maybe fbb nodes and perhaps the odd gauntlet.
Today, sure, its a small step up, but at this pace it wont be for long.
Aside from that, i think the question should be asked about why whales want this new fast pace? It dosnt have to do with collecting. It has to do with utility and advantage in the game.
So, if you play that out for a year, do you really think that puts the game in a better place? A place where you compete for a new tier 1 thats going to be completely phased out by a better card in the near future? In my opinion it gets to a point where making the choice to spend game resources to acquire a crew is basically a game of chance, and you are betting on how quickly the game devs will change the parameters of the attributs that you considered when making your decision to acquire and immortalize.
Listen i want new powerful crew, a few years ago it seemed like we got 3 or 4 tier 1 a year. We are more than double if not quadruple that now
For kicks, i took a look at tier 1 and tier 2 in the bigbook.app.
Tier 1: all 5 released in past three months.
Tier 2: 11 of the 20 released in 2022, 3 in 2021. Exceptions are locutus from 2017, red angel from 2020, caretaker from 2018 (gauntlet exclusives) spork from 2021, a fuse card, braxton and gary seven, previously best in game.
That pacing of tier 1 and tier 2 being essentially replaced or overpowered every 6 minths is excessive.
That means a brand new tier 1 will be tier 3 or worse by the time it hits the portal.
In retrospect, i should have looked at that data first. The answer to my question in the thread title is blatantly obvious.
Again.
7 From Events.
4 From Pack.
1 is a fuse from and Event and Pack crew (both in portal)
Furthermore:
2 are giveaways.
1 is an Achievement.
1 is from Boss Battles.
3 are Gauntlet (4 if you include Locutus)
1 is a Mega Event crew
No one’s holding a gun to your head to get these.
Of the three event crew in the top 5:
Two have medium collection value and strong voyage use.
The best of the three has the strongest voyage value, is a great event crew, has some Arena utility and is of a beloved character.
A made an effort to get Spock. Vedela I picked up because I was bored that weekend and Acting Tier 1 Arex is being overrated by Big Book. I expect a Tier One crew to be good in at least two areas of the game and he is not.
Again.
7 From Events.
4 From Pack.
1 is a fuse from and Event and Pack crew (both in portal)
Furthermore:
2 are giveaways.
1 is an Achievement.
1 is from Boss Battles.
3 are Gauntlet (4 if you include Locutus)
1 is a Mega Event crew
No one’s holding a gun to your head to get these.
Of the three event crew in the top 5:
Two have medium collection value and strong voyage use.
The best of the three has the strongest voyage value, is a great event crew, has some Arena utility and is of a beloved character.
A made an effort to get Spock. Vedela I picked up because I was bored that weekend and Acting Tier 1 Arex is being overrated by Big Book. I expect a Tier One crew to be good in at least two areas of the game and he is not.
They could have come from wrg apology emails for all that i care.
16 of the 25 most powerful crew in the game were released in the past 9 months. If you want to say that its a good thing, you can definitely do that.
Regardless, it makes it clear that “best in the game” is a fleeting thing, and it might be a better strategy to avoid new crew all together until you have about 2,000,000 honor and an honor sale handy so that you can target the next 15 tier 1’s and that way, you can have the best crew in the game for 3 months.
Then you can do it all over again.
Back to my original question, are you disputing that tier 1 is a fast moving target?
Again.
7 From Events.
4 From Pack.
1 is a fuse from and Event and Pack crew (both in portal)
Furthermore:
2 are giveaways.
1 is an Achievement.
1 is from Boss Battles.
3 are Gauntlet (4 if you include Locutus)
1 is a Mega Event crew
No one’s holding a gun to your head to get these.
Of the three event crew in the top 5:
Two have medium collection value and strong voyage use.
The best of the three has the strongest voyage value, is a great event crew, has some Arena utility and is of a beloved character.
A made an effort to get Spock. Vedela I picked up because I was bored that weekend and Acting Tier 1 Arex is being overrated by Big Book. I expect a Tier One crew to be good in at least two areas of the game and he is not.
They could have come from wrg apology emails for all that i care.
16 of the 25 most powerful crew in the game were released in the past 9 months. If you want to say that its a good thing, you can definitely do that.
Regardless, it makes it clear that “best in the game” is a fleeting thing, and it might be a better strategy to avoid new crew all together until you have about 2,000,000 honor and an honor sale handy so that you can target the next 15 tier 1’s and that way, you can have the best crew in the game for 3 months.
Then you can do it all over again.
Back to my original question, are you disputing that tier 1 is a fast moving target?
Power creep happens. You keep on acting like this is a new thing. Best in game is always a fleeting thing. I remember feeling like a was a total boss for having the Borg Queen. This has been going on for the past 6 years.
The bigger question is what kind of hoops do you have to jump through to get those top 25/50/100 crew (I made some new goalposts just for you)?
There are multiple paths to getting quality crew in game and that’s what actually matters. Hawt new voyager will net me an extra couple of minutes some of the time and gets me 2* components I don’t need. Strategically spending quantum, saving honour, playing the gauntlet and manipulating my event resources gets me multiple crew for a variety of in game purposes.
To answer your question: You’re creating new drama for a very old question.
This post isn’t here to satisfy you, it’s here for everyone else.
Again.
7 From Events.
4 From Pack.
1 is a fuse from and Event and Pack crew (both in portal)
Furthermore:
2 are giveaways.
1 is an Achievement.
1 is from Boss Battles.
3 are Gauntlet (4 if you include Locutus)
1 is a Mega Event crew
No one’s holding a gun to your head to get these.
Of the three event crew in the top 5:
Two have medium collection value and strong voyage use.
The best of the three has the strongest voyage value, is a great event crew, has some Arena utility and is of a beloved character.
A made an effort to get Spock. Vedela I picked up because I was bored that weekend and Acting Tier 1 Arex is being overrated by Big Book. I expect a Tier One crew to be good in at least two areas of the game and he is not.
They could have come from wrg apology emails for all that i care.
16 of the 25 most powerful crew in the game were released in the past 9 months. If you want to say that its a good thing, you can definitely do that.
Regardless, it makes it clear that “best in the game” is a fleeting thing, and it might be a better strategy to avoid new crew all together until you have about 2,000,000 honor and an honor sale handy so that you can target the next 15 tier 1’s and that way, you can have the best crew in the game for 3 months.
Then you can do it all over again.
Back to my original question, are you disputing that tier 1 is a fast moving target?
Power creep happens. You keep on acting like this is a new thing. Best in game is always a fleeting thing. I remember feeling like a was a total boss for having the Borg Queen. This has been going on for the past 6 years.
The bigger question is what kind of hoops do you have to jump through to get those top 25/50/100 crew (I made some new goalposts just for you)?
There are multiple paths to getting quality crew in game and that’s what actually matters. Hawt new voyager will net me an extra couple of minutes some of the time and gets me 2* components I don’t need. Strategically spending quantum, saving honour, playing the gauntlet and manipulating my event resources gets me multiple crew for a variety of in game purposes.
To answer your question: You’re creating new drama for a very old question.
This post isn’t here to satisfy you, it’s here for everyone else.
???
None of what you just said amounts to anything more than you going for broke trying to hush me.
There is absolutely no question that the rate of “power creep”, to use your preferred word, is leaps and bounds beyond anything ever seen in the games history.
It is absolutely a fast moving target, you can argue that you like it if you want, but to deny it is just silly.
Again.
7 From Events.
4 From Pack.
1 is a fuse from and Event and Pack crew (both in portal)
Furthermore:
2 are giveaways.
1 is an Achievement.
1 is from Boss Battles.
3 are Gauntlet (4 if you include Locutus)
1 is a Mega Event crew
No one’s holding a gun to your head to get these.
Of the three event crew in the top 5:
Two have medium collection value and strong voyage use.
The best of the three has the strongest voyage value, is a great event crew, has some Arena utility and is of a beloved character.
A made an effort to get Spock. Vedela I picked up because I was bored that weekend and Acting Tier 1 Arex is being overrated by Big Book. I expect a Tier One crew to be good in at least two areas of the game and he is not.
They could have come from wrg apology emails for all that i care.
16 of the 25 most powerful crew in the game were released in the past 9 months. If you want to say that its a good thing, you can definitely do that.
Regardless, it makes it clear that “best in the game” is a fleeting thing, and it might be a better strategy to avoid new crew all together until you have about 2,000,000 honor and an honor sale handy so that you can target the next 15 tier 1’s and that way, you can have the best crew in the game for 3 months.
Then you can do it all over again.
Back to my original question, are you disputing that tier 1 is a fast moving target?
Power creep happens. You keep on acting like this is a new thing. Best in game is always a fleeting thing. I remember feeling like a was a total boss for having the Borg Queen. This has been going on for the past 6 years.
The bigger question is what kind of hoops do you have to jump through to get those top 25/50/100 crew (I made some new goalposts just for you)?
There are multiple paths to getting quality crew in game and that’s what actually matters. Hawt new voyager will net me an extra couple of minutes some of the time and gets me 2* components I don’t need. Strategically spending quantum, saving honour, playing the gauntlet and manipulating my event resources gets me multiple crew for a variety of in game purposes.
To answer your question: You’re creating new drama for a very old question.
This post isn’t here to satisfy you, it’s here for everyone else.
???
None of what you just said amounts to anything more than you going for broke trying to hush me.
There is absolutely no question that the rate of “power creep”, to use your preferred word, is leaps and bounds beyond anything ever seen in the games history.
It is absolutely a fast moving target, you can argue that you like it if you want, but to deny it is just silly.
No one is trying to silence you. Pushback against your opinions is not hushing you.
You’re going to have to a strenuous analysis of crew releases over the past several years to get the answer you want. Great claims require great evidence.
In the mean time you have several paths to obtaining and levelling high quality crew.
Now I’m going to go check on my Fleet’s boss battle. I will doubtlessly use my Mirror Bashir who is of more value than Acting Tier 1 Arex.
A consideration in all this is how you determine the best crew. Frankly, raw voyage stats only matter up to a certain point. Number of collections or potential collections matters. Gauntlet matters to some. Ship ability is currently more important than ever before. Event possibilities is important. Likability of the character is important.
I don't care what the big book ranks a crew. It all only matters to a certain point. I'm happy I've reached that. I hope you all can, too.
I dont think i need to do an exhaustive review of crew releases when at the mere mention if “hey do you think this pace is too fast now?” There is stainch defense if the current release regime by all the whales.
Suffice it to say i know now that this argument is falling completely ipon deaf ears as the majority of the forum people seem to be whales and enjoy having new shiny ferraris to buy.
Again, im not trying to chop the block from under you. But this pace is going to lead to burn out, in my opinion. And it wont remedy any of the deflating fleet numbers.
My VIP number is in my sig. I've been playing the game since April 2016. And I'm not shocked that you're unwilling to any work to back up your claims. I've seen this rodeo before.
The game has been doing events for 1x 5* and 1x 4* almost every week for years. Almost every week there's also one new 1x 5* or 1x 4* through a pack. Every other month the game gives you a 4x 5* through mega events and has been for years.
WRG's innovation is periodically giving away a 4x 5* and some of its equipment. Maybe twice per year. THOSE MONSTERS!!!!!!
You're working under the assumption that people get crew based solely on power. Substantial amounts of players will just get crew because they like it. No one is being forced to get anything. You've also done a pretty poor job defining what power is. Sure Bigbook does a pretty good job of presenting a variety of stats. It also heavily weights Voyage power over other game elements and it doesn't weight Boss Battle effectiveness at all.
Here's a comparison:
Acting Tier One Arex
Voyage: Beast
Gauntlet: Adequate
Event: Poor
Shuttle: Good
Collections: 3 (with some more potential)
Arena: Poor
Boss Battles: Poor (Big Book: good in Arena doesn't mean good in Boss Battles)
Tier 5 Man Scotty
Voyage: Trash
Gauntlet: Trash
Event: Beast
Shuttles: Beast
Collections: 2
Arena: Excellent
Boss Battles: Beast
Event crew vs what is effectively a giveaway at 1/5. 3/5 Will take some work.
Notice that Arex is only really great in one area of the game whereas Scotty is excellent in 4 of them (although there's some overlap in those areas).
WHAT YOU THINK IS HAPPENING: "This is too much! I just spent a lot of money on this new car because it goes 0 to 60 in 3.2 seconds, has a top speed of 146 MPH, and has a 2.1L engine and now they just released a newer version that goes 0 to 60 in 3.1 seconds with a top speed of 148 MPH and a 2.2L engine, this is too much! How do they expect us to keep up?! Something needs to change, this is unfair to the average consumer, only rich people can afford to have the best car."
WHAT PEOPLE ARE TELLING YOU: "You bought a good car that can get you to the grocery store, to and from work, and your kids home from band practice. Good job picking such a fine machine, it will serve you well and do everything you need from it. When you are ready to replace your car in the future there will be many new models with upgraded features that will enhance your driving experience."
In my opinion, you are not getting the replies you want in this thread for the following reasons:
1. You are making claims you are unwilling to backup with facts. I have made the same mistake in the past. The difference between you and I is I realized this mistake, apologized, and then worked to gather the facts. You are not conversing with random internet people here, you are conversing with Star Trek fans. There is a greater percentage of people here who are scientists, computer programmers, statisticians, etc than the average population and they will challenge you when you make a claim like this, not because they are being mean but because they are actually interested in what you are saying but require evidence.
2. You are using a fictional and arbitrary unit of measure as the basis for your claim. Similar to the concept of "Honor Debt" that I have argued against many times, there is no such thing as "Tier 1". As others have said previously in this thread, what makes a card good to me is probably different than most people, and you know what, nobody is wrong. For example, some friends and I did extensive testing and we have essentially "proved" that Variance is bad so we avoid cards with Variance. In case you are confused about what Variance is it is a fictional and somewhat arbitrary unit of measure I had a hand in introducing to the community, and using my Variance-avoidance system I have hit so many 12 hour voyages I've lost count. But you know what, there are people out there doing the exact opposite and they are probably hitting 12 hour voyage also, so which of us is wrong? I am happy, they are happy, everyone is happy.
3. You appear to be stereotyping people negatively and using that to dismiss their points, and as you are seeing that is not really a good practice when asking those around you a question you want answered. Not everyone is a whale, and being a whale is not a bad thing. I've managed to have countless discussions on this forum with people who both agreed and disagreed with me and I have done so each time without ever once speculating on their spending or using their spending as a reason to discount or disregard their opinions. If you are truly interested in leading a discussion I would recommend that you cease this practice and treat discussion points on their merits.
If it helps, think of acquiring new cards like a checkpoint in a game like Super Mario Maker. A check point functions as a permanent raising of your floor, and locks in place your progress forever. In Super Mario Maker you can lose a dozen lives on a difficult section but once you gain a checkpoint you will never have to do that section again, any future lives lost will restart you back to the checkpoint not the start of the level. In STT if you are consistently hitting 85-86% on your event shuttles and over the course of a few months you get some fancy new cards that raise your even shuttles to 88-89%, the introduction of even newer cards that are slightly stronger is not cause for alarm, it does not harm you. Failing to get those new cards will not drop your shuttles back to 85-86%, your progress is permanent. The same goes for voyage strength. It takes people a long time to hit 8 hour voyages consistently, and eventually people work up to 10 hour voyages. It took me a long time to get to 10 hour voyages but thanks to recent cards we have several newer players in our fleet who are already pushing for 10 hour voyages much faster than I got there, and that is a VERY good thing.
Like every single person who has replied to this thread I will add my voice to the growing chorus proclaiming that what you are perceiving is not only not a problem it is actually a good thing, and that the concerns expressed in this thread appear to me to be a case of FOMO. If you miss a few cards everything will be OK, The Sun will still rise tomorrow.
Actually, as several Star Trek fans will undoubtedly point out, The Sun does not actually rise, the Earth's rotation just makes it seem that way.
Thanks bylo band. As you pointed iut people have different ways of calculating value on crew. Ehether its tier 1, top voyager, best stats, etc.
Im just going to drop it though. I dont have confidence that even if i looked at all crew releases for the past 6 years that anything i presented wouldnt be subject to the same retort that the only known ranking system is not relevant on its own.
So, people here will be happier for me to drop it, and i will be happier too, because i really dont need to convince any of you of anything.
I dont think i need to do an exhaustive review of crew releases when at the mere mention if “hey do you think this pace is too fast now?” There is stainch defense if the current release regime by all the whales.
Suffice it to say i know now that this argument is falling completely ipon deaf ears as the majority of the forum people seem to be whales and enjoy having new shiny ferraris to buy.
Again, im not trying to chop the block from under you. But this pace is going to lead to burn out, in my opinion. And it wont remedy any of the deflating fleet numbers.
You've probably spent more money on this game than I have. Stop assuming everyone who disagrees with you is a whale. Just because you dislike the release pace doesn't mean others have to. And it certainly doesn't mean everyone who likes the schedule is a whale outspending you.
I dont think i need to do an exhaustive review of crew releases when at the mere mention if “hey do you think this pace is too fast now?” There is stainch defense if the current release regime by all the whales.
Suffice it to say i know now that this argument is falling completely ipon deaf ears as the majority of the forum people seem to be whales and enjoy having new shiny ferraris to buy.
Again, im not trying to chop the block from under you. But this pace is going to lead to burn out, in my opinion. And it wont remedy any of the deflating fleet numbers.
You've probably spent more money on this game than I have. Stop assuming everyone who disagrees with you is a whale. Just because you dislike the release pace doesn't mean others have to. And it certainly doesn't mean everyone who likes the schedule is a whale outspending you.
I said i was going to drop it, Avitrek.
Whats with the last kick on my way out the door? (Speaking of this thread, not the forum)
Thanks bylo band. As you pointed iut people have different ways of calculating value on crew. Ehether its tier 1, top voyager, best stats, etc.
Im just going to drop it though. I dont have confidence that even if i looked at all crew releases for the past 6 years that anything i presented wouldnt be subject to the same retort that the only known ranking system is not relevant on its own. [emphasis added]
So, people here will be happier for me to drop it, and i will be happier too, because i really dont need to convince any of you of anything.
Thanks for an entertaining thread! 🖖
One minor quibble: There are other known ranking systems, e.g. the CAB (STT) Power Ratings Tool. It That system, as well as many other helpful community resources, may be found in the Ready Room. Some of those are listed for quick reference in the following thread, maintained by @Captain Idol .
Is this normal for most games that have a half-way decent creative team? Yes.
IS it aggravating to have to keep waiting for a lucky Portal drop to get someone who was all the rage when introduced, and is now like Tier Three or lower? Personal experience would imply VERY aggravating.
But, that is just the game. Any game, really. Just be thankful we don't have to fight for a brand-new game component that is integral to a game, only to have to then buy "Upgrade Components" to Upgrade it three times for it to BARELY do what it should be designed to do when released. People that play a certain GlitchEye game know what I mean.
Why was Vicki not expelled from Greendale after she literally stabbed Pierce in the face with a pencil?!?!?
We have joked a few times recently that WRG must be trying to reverse engineer our weights to release more high tier crew $$ Ben has said he'd love something like the BB grades in game and they've asked for a plain text file of our tiers before to look at. Makes sense for a company to try to make the product they're selling as appealing to everyone as they can.
I won't bother signal boosting people saying false/incorrect stuff in this thread, but as a reminder you can set custom tier weights at the bottom of the Overall page. Ship rating has been adjusted a handful of times since FBB released and will continue to be as the meta changes with each boss.
Voyages are weighted highest (for legendary crew) for a variety of reasons (frequency of use, quality of rewards, number of relevant crew, etc) and so most of the new high tier ratings are a result of heavy voyage rank creep after years of bupkis. But I commend WRG for doing better on traits. Every top shelf name to come out this year aside from Enterprise Pike has at least four relevant (non-HFS/racial) traits. That boosts AM chances, event chances, collection chances, FBB appearances, gauntlet crit, etc.
I agree the pace is a lot faster now. Much more strong crew is coming after the cold winter of 2021.
But that's not bad, most crew have high stats but are mostly in the same pool.
It keeps the people 'happy'
I don't look at the tiers at all. I have found that lower tiers are sometimes better.
For me the rank in their combo is more important than their tier.
A top 5 ENG/DIP can be a tier 6 crew.
Adira Tal is 2nd best ENG/DIP voyage crew and is tier 6...
Don't focus that much on the tier system. It's polluted by the so many DIP - CMD - SEC crew.
Comments
Since crew retrieval came out, you don't even have to worry that much if you miss some crew you later decide you really want, you can just retrieve it eventually.
Unless you really do want to catch 'em all, in which case, this is going to become a very expensive game.
If they had the same number of top voyagers per year but released more evenly across the calendar, it would be far more palatable, for myself at least.
This is exactly what i mean. I feel like once or twice a month there is a new supremely powerful crew to obtain.
I understand the whales wanting to savagey defend this new format, and im not saying i dont want new powerful crew, but at this point, i feel like tier 10 is not low enough because so many crew that were marginally desirable in beholds are quickly becoming total wastes of time.
Yes, fbb gives incentive to all crew, but at the cost of crew slots and if you want to freeze a low power or aged gold, its gonna cost you 160k honor minimum.
Just saying, i understand whales calling it “whining” but this new pace of tier 1’s rolling out will be a big problem before too long.
Earnestly, though, I don't think the size of the problem, if it even is a problem, is that large. It's not as though the new top crew are SO much better than existing ones that the Big Book peeps need to invent a Tier 0 to handle it. The Value Over Replacement Card, if you like, of the new arrivals is not so much that it instantly renders older cards obsolete. If a 1/5 Arex had a voyage total that was 100s more than a 5/5 Gary Seven, or something, I'd agree there was a power creep problem, but that's not what's happening. And on the other hand cards like Vindicta, who with her limitless hammer is clearly designed for FBB, have been released as 4*s anyone can get for a very small effort.
From my point of view there's a point where with enough immortalised golds you can consistently hit 10 hour voyages and staff event shuttles simultaneously, and at that point - which in all honesty does not need more than a few dozen cards in the Tier 1-4 range, really - any improvement to your roster becomes incredibly marginal, so chasing new cards that happen to be Tier 1 becomes purely a matter of choice, just as much as eg selecting a fave character to immortalise all variants of is. That's where I think the disconnect in this thread is, because you're taking as a premise that it's absolutely essential to collect all new Tier 1 crew, but even most of the people who do choose to do that don't really see it that way.
I dont disagree with what you are saying.
But even at the “modest” incremental increase in stats, eventually (6-12 months?) these new powerful crew will make 14 hr or even 16hr voyages possible. And it will be impossible unless you have those crew. So, the crew that you used for 10 hour voyages will be completely useless except for shuttle events, maybe fbb nodes and perhaps the odd gauntlet.
Today, sure, its a small step up, but at this pace it wont be for long.
Aside from that, i think the question should be asked about why whales want this new fast pace? It dosnt have to do with collecting. It has to do with utility and advantage in the game.
So, if you play that out for a year, do you really think that puts the game in a better place? A place where you compete for a new tier 1 thats going to be completely phased out by a better card in the near future? In my opinion it gets to a point where making the choice to spend game resources to acquire a crew is basically a game of chance, and you are betting on how quickly the game devs will change the parameters of the attributs that you considered when making your decision to acquire and immortalize.
Listen i want new powerful crew, a few years ago it seemed like we got 3 or 4 tier 1 a year. We are more than double if not quadruple that now
Tier 1: all 5 released in past three months.
Tier 2: 11 of the 20 released in 2022, 3 in 2021. Exceptions are locutus from 2017, red angel from 2020, caretaker from 2018 (gauntlet exclusives) spork from 2021, a fuse card, braxton and gary seven, previously best in game.
That pacing of tier 1 and tier 2 being essentially replaced or overpowered every 6 minths is excessive.
That means a brand new tier 1 will be tier 3 or worse by the time it hits the portal.
In retrospect, i should have looked at that data first. The answer to my question in the thread title is blatantly obvious.
7 From Events.
4 From Pack.
1 is a fuse from and Event and Pack crew (both in portal)
Furthermore:
2 are giveaways.
1 is an Achievement.
1 is from Boss Battles.
3 are Gauntlet (4 if you include Locutus)
1 is a Mega Event crew
No one’s holding a gun to your head to get these.
Of the three event crew in the top 5:
Two have medium collection value and strong voyage use.
The best of the three has the strongest voyage value, is a great event crew, has some Arena utility and is of a beloved character.
A made an effort to get Spock. Vedela I picked up because I was bored that weekend and Acting Tier 1 Arex is being overrated by Big Book. I expect a Tier One crew to be good in at least two areas of the game and he is not.
They could have come from wrg apology emails for all that i care.
16 of the 25 most powerful crew in the game were released in the past 9 months. If you want to say that its a good thing, you can definitely do that.
Regardless, it makes it clear that “best in the game” is a fleeting thing, and it might be a better strategy to avoid new crew all together until you have about 2,000,000 honor and an honor sale handy so that you can target the next 15 tier 1’s and that way, you can have the best crew in the game for 3 months.
Then you can do it all over again.
Back to my original question, are you disputing that tier 1 is a fast moving target?
Power creep happens. You keep on acting like this is a new thing. Best in game is always a fleeting thing. I remember feeling like a was a total boss for having the Borg Queen. This has been going on for the past 6 years.
The bigger question is what kind of hoops do you have to jump through to get those top 25/50/100 crew (I made some new goalposts just for you)?
There are multiple paths to getting quality crew in game and that’s what actually matters. Hawt new voyager will net me an extra couple of minutes some of the time and gets me 2* components I don’t need. Strategically spending quantum, saving honour, playing the gauntlet and manipulating my event resources gets me multiple crew for a variety of in game purposes.
To answer your question: You’re creating new drama for a very old question.
This post isn’t here to satisfy you, it’s here for everyone else.
None of what you just said amounts to anything more than you going for broke trying to hush me.
There is absolutely no question that the rate of “power creep”, to use your preferred word, is leaps and bounds beyond anything ever seen in the games history.
It is absolutely a fast moving target, you can argue that you like it if you want, but to deny it is just silly.
Thank you
No one is trying to silence you. Pushback against your opinions is not hushing you.
You’re going to have to a strenuous analysis of crew releases over the past several years to get the answer you want. Great claims require great evidence.
In the mean time you have several paths to obtaining and levelling high quality crew.
Now I’m going to go check on my Fleet’s boss battle. I will doubtlessly use my Mirror Bashir who is of more value than Acting Tier 1 Arex.
I don't care what the big book ranks a crew. It all only matters to a certain point. I'm happy I've reached that. I hope you all can, too.
Live long and prosper.
Suffice it to say i know now that this argument is falling completely ipon deaf ears as the majority of the forum people seem to be whales and enjoy having new shiny ferraris to buy.
Again, im not trying to chop the block from under you. But this pace is going to lead to burn out, in my opinion. And it wont remedy any of the deflating fleet numbers.
The game has been doing events for 1x 5* and 1x 4* almost every week for years. Almost every week there's also one new 1x 5* or 1x 4* through a pack. Every other month the game gives you a 4x 5* through mega events and has been for years.
WRG's innovation is periodically giving away a 4x 5* and some of its equipment. Maybe twice per year. THOSE MONSTERS!!!!!!
You're working under the assumption that people get crew based solely on power. Substantial amounts of players will just get crew because they like it. No one is being forced to get anything. You've also done a pretty poor job defining what power is. Sure Bigbook does a pretty good job of presenting a variety of stats. It also heavily weights Voyage power over other game elements and it doesn't weight Boss Battle effectiveness at all.
Here's a comparison:
Acting Tier One Arex
Voyage: Beast
Gauntlet: Adequate
Event: Poor
Shuttle: Good
Collections: 3 (with some more potential)
Arena: Poor
Boss Battles: Poor (Big Book: good in Arena doesn't mean good in Boss Battles)
Tier 5 Man Scotty
Voyage: Trash
Gauntlet: Trash
Event: Beast
Shuttles: Beast
Collections: 2
Arena: Excellent
Boss Battles: Beast
Event crew vs what is effectively a giveaway at 1/5. 3/5 Will take some work.
Notice that Arex is only really great in one area of the game whereas Scotty is excellent in 4 of them (although there's some overlap in those areas).
WHAT YOU THINK IS HAPPENING:
"This is too much! I just spent a lot of money on this new car because it goes 0 to 60 in 3.2 seconds, has a top speed of 146 MPH, and has a 2.1L engine and now they just released a newer version that goes 0 to 60 in 3.1 seconds with a top speed of 148 MPH and a 2.2L engine, this is too much! How do they expect us to keep up?! Something needs to change, this is unfair to the average consumer, only rich people can afford to have the best car."
WHAT PEOPLE ARE TELLING YOU:
"You bought a good car that can get you to the grocery store, to and from work, and your kids home from band practice. Good job picking such a fine machine, it will serve you well and do everything you need from it. When you are ready to replace your car in the future there will be many new models with upgraded features that will enhance your driving experience."
In my opinion, you are not getting the replies you want in this thread for the following reasons:
1. You are making claims you are unwilling to backup with facts. I have made the same mistake in the past. The difference between you and I is I realized this mistake, apologized, and then worked to gather the facts. You are not conversing with random internet people here, you are conversing with Star Trek fans. There is a greater percentage of people here who are scientists, computer programmers, statisticians, etc than the average population and they will challenge you when you make a claim like this, not because they are being mean but because they are actually interested in what you are saying but require evidence.
2. You are using a fictional and arbitrary unit of measure as the basis for your claim. Similar to the concept of "Honor Debt" that I have argued against many times, there is no such thing as "Tier 1". As others have said previously in this thread, what makes a card good to me is probably different than most people, and you know what, nobody is wrong. For example, some friends and I did extensive testing and we have essentially "proved" that Variance is bad so we avoid cards with Variance. In case you are confused about what Variance is it is a fictional and somewhat arbitrary unit of measure I had a hand in introducing to the community, and using my Variance-avoidance system I have hit so many 12 hour voyages I've lost count. But you know what, there are people out there doing the exact opposite and they are probably hitting 12 hour voyage also, so which of us is wrong? I am happy, they are happy, everyone is happy.
3. You appear to be stereotyping people negatively and using that to dismiss their points, and as you are seeing that is not really a good practice when asking those around you a question you want answered. Not everyone is a whale, and being a whale is not a bad thing. I've managed to have countless discussions on this forum with people who both agreed and disagreed with me and I have done so each time without ever once speculating on their spending or using their spending as a reason to discount or disregard their opinions. If you are truly interested in leading a discussion I would recommend that you cease this practice and treat discussion points on their merits.
If it helps, think of acquiring new cards like a checkpoint in a game like Super Mario Maker. A check point functions as a permanent raising of your floor, and locks in place your progress forever. In Super Mario Maker you can lose a dozen lives on a difficult section but once you gain a checkpoint you will never have to do that section again, any future lives lost will restart you back to the checkpoint not the start of the level. In STT if you are consistently hitting 85-86% on your event shuttles and over the course of a few months you get some fancy new cards that raise your even shuttles to 88-89%, the introduction of even newer cards that are slightly stronger is not cause for alarm, it does not harm you. Failing to get those new cards will not drop your shuttles back to 85-86%, your progress is permanent. The same goes for voyage strength. It takes people a long time to hit 8 hour voyages consistently, and eventually people work up to 10 hour voyages. It took me a long time to get to 10 hour voyages but thanks to recent cards we have several newer players in our fleet who are already pushing for 10 hour voyages much faster than I got there, and that is a VERY good thing.
Like every single person who has replied to this thread I will add my voice to the growing chorus proclaiming that what you are perceiving is not only not a problem it is actually a good thing, and that the concerns expressed in this thread appear to me to be a case of FOMO. If you miss a few cards everything will be OK, The Sun will still rise tomorrow.
Actually, as several Star Trek fans will undoubtedly point out, The Sun does not actually rise, the Earth's rotation just makes it seem that way.
Im just going to drop it though. I dont have confidence that even if i looked at all crew releases for the past 6 years that anything i presented wouldnt be subject to the same retort that the only known ranking system is not relevant on its own.
So, people here will be happier for me to drop it, and i will be happier too, because i really dont need to convince any of you of anything.
You've probably spent more money on this game than I have. Stop assuming everyone who disagrees with you is a whale. Just because you dislike the release pace doesn't mean others have to. And it certainly doesn't mean everyone who likes the schedule is a whale outspending you.
I said i was going to drop it, Avitrek.
Whats with the last kick on my way out the door? (Speaking of this thread, not the forum)
Perhaps YOU should also drop it. Thanks.
One minor quibble: There are other known ranking systems, e.g. the CAB (STT) Power Ratings Tool. It That system, as well as many other helpful community resources, may be found in the Ready Room. Some of those are listed for quick reference in the following thread, maintained by @Captain Idol .
https://forum.wickedrealmgames.com/stt/discussion/15799/guides-and-tips-resources-and-help-for-players-updated-2022-06-26-fleet-boss-battle-tools/p1
Is this normal for most games that have a half-way decent creative team? Yes.
IS it aggravating to have to keep waiting for a lucky Portal drop to get someone who was all the rage when introduced, and is now like Tier Three or lower? Personal experience would imply VERY aggravating.
But, that is just the game. Any game, really. Just be thankful we don't have to fight for a brand-new game component that is integral to a game, only to have to then buy "Upgrade Components" to Upgrade it three times for it to BARELY do what it should be designed to do when released. People that play a certain GlitchEye game know what I mean.
I won't bother signal boosting people saying false/incorrect stuff in this thread, but as a reminder you can set custom tier weights at the bottom of the Overall page. Ship rating has been adjusted a handful of times since FBB released and will continue to be as the meta changes with each boss.
Voyages are weighted highest (for legendary crew) for a variety of reasons (frequency of use, quality of rewards, number of relevant crew, etc) and so most of the new high tier ratings are a result of heavy voyage rank creep after years of bupkis. But I commend WRG for doing better on traits. Every top shelf name to come out this year aside from Enterprise Pike has at least four relevant (non-HFS/racial) traits. That boosts AM chances, event chances, collection chances, FBB appearances, gauntlet crit, etc.
But that's not bad, most crew have high stats but are mostly in the same pool.
It keeps the people 'happy'
I don't look at the tiers at all. I have found that lower tiers are sometimes better.
For me the rank in their combo is more important than their tier.
A top 5 ENG/DIP can be a tier 6 crew.
Adira Tal is 2nd best ENG/DIP voyage crew and is tier 6...
Don't focus that much on the tier system. It's polluted by the so many DIP - CMD - SEC crew.
Edit: My spelling and grammar is terrible, sorry.