If it is so important to take a break in the game then DB should somehow make the events less grindy, or allow the use of macros. But this isnt about that, its about adressing the use of macros. And in this case we get the cheap fix, an irritating pop up.
Am I the only person that completely ends the application every time I close it? I think the longest I've ever actually been in there is probably a few hours, during skirmish events. I probably could have used a break in between.
One, don't lie to us and use (even worse) Nanny State logic to justify your claims. I don't need you to babysit me and try to make all my decisions for me.
Two, this is going to incresae load on the authentication servers, which already have issues.
Three, this is going to lead to less playing by myself, and very likely many others, since DB's auth servers have already started causing issues and I have to leave the app open all day or else may not be able to log back in for extended periods of time once it makes it in.
I'm someone who keeps the game open all the time, almost 24/7 except when I'm sleeping. I anticipate plenty of tickets being sent in for failed voyages because I do wait until 31 AM to recall them. I suppose I'll work on a form letter that I can copy/paste into the body of the tickets because I'm sure I'll need it.
I'm less concerned with the overhang shuttles. Everyone will be effected at the same rate by that, so it's effectively zero sum.
I suppose I need to get used to force closing and restarting the game as I approach 100 AM on voyages. It is only made worse by the fact that starting the game from a full close takes upwards of a full minute on my iPad Air. Not exactly brand new anymore, but not ancient tech, either. Somehow, it loads faster (nearly twice as fast) on my comparatively archaic iPhone 5.
This is not a good attempt at addressing macros. A bad attempt is worse than no attempt. I think I'd prefer some kind of captcha-style popup instead. Give me 5 or 10 crew headshots. Tell me to tap on someone specific. "Tap Picard to continue". Two failures boots you out, two successes keeps you in. Only costs a few seconds and won't foreseeably kill any voyages.
If it is so important to take a break in the game then DB should somehow make the events less grindy, or allow the use of macros. But this isnt about that, its about adressing the use of macros. And in this case we get the cheap fix, an irritating pop up.
I agree complete, the skirmish is extreme time intensive.
We don't need a break pop-up, we need a max time per player in the events.
This will also destroy hangover shuttles for Hybrid events. When you reboot, the game is bugged and you lose bonuses.
It doesn't destroy them, just potentially reduces their effectiveness. Heck do we know that the bonus isn't still there, just the app doesn't show it?.
I've run shuttles still after having to restart due to a crash or my phone deciding to restart the app when running in the background. I still run them. At worst, you still get (at 4k) 800 vp (1600 with doubler) each. I've scored 4k/8k with no bonus crew before during phase 2. I just see it as extra vp that I didn't need to grind for. I take what I can get.
"If it wasn't for autocorrect, we wouldn't have Tuvok on a Giraffe."
My read on this, like many others, is that it's one of several steps being taken to prevent macro use. With that in mind, I'm completely in favour.
I'd also add: as with all new features, there may well be problems in execution, but I don't think it's worth getting bent out of shape before those problems occur if in fact they do at all. I'm all for highlighting issues when they arise, but I'm surprised at the volume of complaint regarding problems that as of right now are entirely hypothetical.
If it is so important to take a break in the game then DB should somehow make the events less grindy, or allow the use of macros. But this isnt about that, its about adressing the use of macros. And in this case we get the cheap fix, an irritating pop up.
While this isn't necessarily wrong, you are talking about massive changes. As far as I'm aware, the public outcry with macros surged during the last skirmish. While DB is not right out saying it, this is pretty obviously something they put in place to help curtail some of the macro use. It is a quick fix, but that is pretty much what everyone has been demanding ... a fix. They will likely be looking at other solutions as well as other long term things, but this is the first step in trying to solve the problem with a relatively simple solution (something to confuse the macro).
People complain that DB doesn't listen or fix things ... well they listened came up with at least one solution (might be others in place less noticeable). Now we have people complaining that DB came up with a solution. I hate to say it, but you can't always have it both ways. They even bothered to tell us that something was changed (and let us figured it out, which I'm fine with too).
"If it wasn't for autocorrect, we wouldn't have Tuvok on a Giraffe."
This will also destroy hangover shuttles for Hybrid events. When you reboot, the game is bugged and you lose bonuses.
This might cause an outcry if the timer is random since some people will be kicked out earlier than others who can send more shuttles with a bonus. So DB should fix the bug (in either way, depending on what behaviour is the actual bug).
For eyeballed voyages, I will just manually restart in good time. For overhang shuttles, it's a shame but I'll adapt.
And, to be fair, it's not going to stop my enjoyment of the game, and it isn't going to impact my daily life. There are bigger things to complain about.
Fleet Admiral of NCC UK Midlands."Leave any bigotry in your quarters. There's no room for it on the bridge." - J.T. Kirk, 2266
My guess is we won't even notice it. They will make it only trigger on obvious bot mechanics. But they don't want to admit that so we got this vague statement instead.
I approve of this change. This is a legitimate attempt to return everyone to a level playing field. Please keep in mind that this will be a work in progress. Let's help DB with constructive criticism once we see how things go
If, as some people seem to believe, these only pop up if 'bot' behaviour is detected then that's fine with me.
However my experience with DB's programming and solutions leads me to believe it won't be anywhere near that sophisticated.
Forcing people to do restarts, particularly if it's during an event or voyage is a bloody stupid idea - evidenced by the fact that a huge thread full of suggestions to sort the problem didn't include this "solution"
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This will also destroy hangover shuttles for Hybrid events. When you reboot, the game is bugged and you lose bonuses.
This might cause an outcry if the timer is random since some people will be kicked out earlier than others who can send more shuttles with a bonus. So DB should fix the bug (in either way, depending on what behaviour is the actual bug).
It has to be random timer, otherwise you could likely just macro it away as well.
I'm all for it.
The guess who captcha some one above suggested (even better then my color combo version of the same concept) is perfect. Add a small reward.. test me 20 times a day at random intervals. I would love for this to be the "USADA" of Star Trek Timelines. Test me, test me often and gimme a cookie when ur done. I'm a legit player. I want testing.
Need clarification on this:
"To remind players that taking breaks is important, a new pop-up system has been introduced. Players might encounter this pop-up while playing and might be required to restart the game."
To me, that sounds ridiculous
My mother passed away. I don't need a new one online......
"The truth is like a lion; you don't have to defend it. Let it loose; it will defend itself."
Wow an unwanted popup .... such a great idea .... i mean wow .... with the "improved" item build mechanic , this game is becoming a pop-up heaven.... to bad it's the early 2000's .... Before the macro maniacs come out and defend it , this is not the way to protect against macros. This just annoys people ....
OH and PS just as a thanks ill ticket CS every time i get those popups , you know just to spread the joy of it ...
What I find most irritating is that DB never once claimed this is to fight macros. Instead, the reason given is some type of nanny video game state...
What? Many players complained and asked for something, why not take credit? Why make up some BS cover story? What are they hiding?
Now random timers will give advantages to players not kicked out for hybrid events. Best way to prevent macro use is to create games that do not need them!
This will just make smarter macros. Then we will have more irritating measures taken "for our health". Anything that punishes everyone to "fix" the problem is lazy and likely will not work anyway.
The community has expressed concerns about the use of macros in Star Trek Timelines, and I want to address those concerns.
...
Our engineers and designers took the time to assess the situation and looked at how such programs were being used in our game. To discourage attempts to circumvent our efforts we will not provide any details about what is being done to counteract these applications, however we want to stress out that we take this issue seriously and that steps have already been taken to address the situation.
In the case of security, a black box can be useful. If the outside observer doesn't know what is going on, it makes it more difficult to circumvent it. It is obvious this is part of that solution, but they are filing it under "we will not provide any details". There may be other parts at work as well.
As far as I know, no one has seen it at work yet. My apps been logged in all day (minus the brief outage) and I haven't seen anything yet. Let's honestly wait and see how it plays out before grabbing the pitchforks and at least be happy that DB is making an attempt to solve an issue.
"If it wasn't for autocorrect, we wouldn't have Tuvok on a Giraffe."
OH and PS just as a thanks ill ticket CS every time i get those popups , you know just to spread the joy of it ...
Thank you so much for increasing wait time for everyone else with nonsense tickets.
Sisko: What are you gonna learn in the next few months that you haven't already learned in the last 300 years?
Ezri Dax: Oh, how to keep from breaking into tears for no reason...
As someone who has the app open at all times, this may prove mildly irritating. However, if it's to stop people cheating I'm not going to argue. I blame the cheats, not DB.
Agreed! Personally though I would rather they made the events/game less dull/repetitive!!
Endless clicking in Skirmish and Galaxy events are not fun!
Jim
I hope I don't sound foolish here, but do players use macros on Galaxy events? I don't see how it would work since the missions rotate randomly. I would like to see skirmishes work the same way. I just don't know what they should randomize and how much effort (time) it would take devs to implement the change.
For now, I plan to restart my app at noon (Eastern time) and see how it goes from there.
Love the ideas and feedback in this thread. I didn't make the cut for Brofleet (by a long shot) but I was with them in spirit.
As someone who has the app open at all times, this may prove mildly irritating. However, if it's to stop people cheating I'm not going to argue. I blame the cheats, not DB.
Agreed! Personally though I would rather they made the events/game less dull/repetitive!!
Endless clicking in Skirmish and Galaxy events are not fun!
Jim
I hope I don't sound foolish here, but do players use macros on Galaxy events? I don't see how it would work since the missions rotate randomly. I would like to see skirmishes work the same way. I just don't know what they should randomize and how much effort (time) it would take devs to implement the change.
For now, I plan to restart my app at noon (Eastern time) and see how it goes from there.
Love the ideas and feedback in this thread. I didn't make the cut for Brofleet (by a long shot) but I was with them in spirit.
There was a YouTube video linked of someone doing it posted here on the forums, 100% feasible.
As someone who has the app open at all times, this may prove mildly irritating. However, if it's to stop people cheating I'm not going to argue. I blame the cheats, not DB.
Agreed! Personally though I would rather they made the events/game less dull/repetitive!!
Endless clicking in Skirmish and Galaxy events are not fun!
Jim
I hope I don't sound foolish here, but do players use macros on Galaxy events? I don't see how it would work since the missions rotate randomly. I would like to see skirmishes work the same way. I just don't know what they should randomize and how much effort (time) it would take devs to implement the change.
For now, I plan to restart my app at noon (Eastern time) and see how it goes from there.
Love the ideas and feedback in this thread. I didn't make the cut for Brofleet (by a long shot) but I was with them in spirit.
Let's see if this popup even shows up. I doubt keeping the game active will trigger it. I'm sure they're checking activity and if it looks like you're not playing like a human for X minutes/hours that will trigger the popup.
I hope I don't sound foolish here, but do players use macros on Galaxy events? I don't see how it would work since the missions rotate randomly.
There was a YouTube video linked of someone doing it posted here on the forums, 100% feasible.
Eh, I think maybe more like 0.3% feasible.
You would be mistaken, but ok.
It's something that's already been argued not only "to death" but all the way across the river Styx and down into Hades. So let's just agree to disagree on this one.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing. ~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
Comments
Or it was bugged and you weren't meant to keep bonuses.
It's an admirable step on DBs part, lets see how it works before slamming it for things it may or may not do.
Thanks for thinking of that. I'm fine with a change though if everyone is impacted equally.
Two, this is going to incresae load on the authentication servers, which already have issues.
Three, this is going to lead to less playing by myself, and very likely many others, since DB's auth servers have already started causing issues and I have to leave the app open all day or else may not be able to log back in for extended periods of time once it makes it in.
I'm less concerned with the overhang shuttles. Everyone will be effected at the same rate by that, so it's effectively zero sum.
I suppose I need to get used to force closing and restarting the game as I approach 100 AM on voyages. It is only made worse by the fact that starting the game from a full close takes upwards of a full minute on my iPad Air. Not exactly brand new anymore, but not ancient tech, either. Somehow, it loads faster (nearly twice as fast) on my comparatively archaic iPhone 5.
This is not a good attempt at addressing macros. A bad attempt is worse than no attempt. I think I'd prefer some kind of captcha-style popup instead. Give me 5 or 10 crew headshots. Tell me to tap on someone specific. "Tap Picard to continue". Two failures boots you out, two successes keeps you in. Only costs a few seconds and won't foreseeably kill any voyages.
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I agree complete, the skirmish is extreme time intensive.
We don't need a break pop-up, we need a max time per player in the events.
Play long and restart
Live long and prosper
It doesn't destroy them, just potentially reduces their effectiveness. Heck do we know that the bonus isn't still there, just the app doesn't show it?.
I've run shuttles still after having to restart due to a crash or my phone deciding to restart the app when running in the background. I still run them. At worst, you still get (at 4k) 800 vp (1600 with doubler) each. I've scored 4k/8k with no bonus crew before during phase 2. I just see it as extra vp that I didn't need to grind for. I take what I can get.
I'd also add: as with all new features, there may well be problems in execution, but I don't think it's worth getting bent out of shape before those problems occur if in fact they do at all. I'm all for highlighting issues when they arise, but I'm surprised at the volume of complaint regarding problems that as of right now are entirely hypothetical.
While this isn't necessarily wrong, you are talking about massive changes. As far as I'm aware, the public outcry with macros surged during the last skirmish. While DB is not right out saying it, this is pretty obviously something they put in place to help curtail some of the macro use. It is a quick fix, but that is pretty much what everyone has been demanding ... a fix. They will likely be looking at other solutions as well as other long term things, but this is the first step in trying to solve the problem with a relatively simple solution (something to confuse the macro).
People complain that DB doesn't listen or fix things ... well they listened came up with at least one solution (might be others in place less noticeable). Now we have people complaining that DB came up with a solution. I hate to say it, but you can't always have it both ways. They even bothered to tell us that something was changed (and let us figured it out, which I'm fine with too).
This might cause an outcry if the timer is random since some people will be kicked out earlier than others who can send more shuttles with a bonus. So DB should fix the bug (in either way, depending on what behaviour is the actual bug).
For eyeballed voyages, I will just manually restart in good time. For overhang shuttles, it's a shame but I'll adapt.
And, to be fair, it's not going to stop my enjoyment of the game, and it isn't going to impact my daily life. There are bigger things to complain about.
However my experience with DB's programming and solutions leads me to believe it won't be anywhere near that sophisticated.
Forcing people to do restarts, particularly if it's during an event or voyage is a bloody stupid idea - evidenced by the fact that a huge thread full of suggestions to sort the problem didn't include this "solution"
https://forum.disruptorbeam.com/stt/discussion/5023/qh-the-oldest-fleet-in-timelines-l91-starbase-daily-targets-met
It has to be random timer, otherwise you could likely just macro it away as well.
I'm all for it.
The guess who captcha some one above suggested (even better then my color combo version of the same concept) is perfect. Add a small reward.. test me 20 times a day at random intervals. I would love for this to be the "USADA" of Star Trek Timelines. Test me, test me often and gimme a cookie when ur done. I'm a legit player. I want testing.
My mother passed away. I don't need a new one online......
OH and PS just as a thanks ill ticket CS every time i get those popups , you know just to spread the joy of it ...
What? Many players complained and asked for something, why not take credit? Why make up some BS cover story? What are they hiding?
Now random timers will give advantages to players not kicked out for hybrid events. Best way to prevent macro use is to create games that do not need them!
This will just make smarter macros. Then we will have more irritating measures taken "for our health". Anything that punishes everyone to "fix" the problem is lazy and likely will not work anyway.
And as far as taking credit ... they are. There is a whole post.
In the case of security, a black box can be useful. If the outside observer doesn't know what is going on, it makes it more difficult to circumvent it. It is obvious this is part of that solution, but they are filing it under "we will not provide any details". There may be other parts at work as well.
As far as I know, no one has seen it at work yet. My apps been logged in all day (minus the brief outage) and I haven't seen anything yet. Let's honestly wait and see how it plays out before grabbing the pitchforks and at least be happy that DB is making an attempt to solve an issue.
Thank you so much for increasing wait time for everyone else with nonsense tickets.
Ezri Dax: Oh, how to keep from breaking into tears for no reason...
I hope I don't sound foolish here, but do players use macros on Galaxy events? I don't see how it would work since the missions rotate randomly. I would like to see skirmishes work the same way. I just don't know what they should randomize and how much effort (time) it would take devs to implement the change.
For now, I plan to restart my app at noon (Eastern time) and see how it goes from there.
Love the ideas and feedback in this thread. I didn't make the cut for Brofleet (by a long shot) but I was with them in spirit.
There was a YouTube video linked of someone doing it posted here on the forums, 100% feasible.
I hope I don't sound foolish here, but do players use macros on Galaxy events? I don't see how it would work since the missions rotate randomly. I would like to see skirmishes work the same way. I just don't know what they should randomize and how much effort (time) it would take devs to implement the change.
For now, I plan to restart my app at noon (Eastern time) and see how it goes from there.
Love the ideas and feedback in this thread. I didn't make the cut for Brofleet (by a long shot) but I was with them in spirit.
Eh, I think maybe more like 0.3% feasible.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
You would be mistaken, but ok.
It's something that's already been argued not only "to death" but all the way across the river Styx and down into Hades. So let's just agree to disagree on this one.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"