Should Weak Old Crew Be Updated?

BigDaddyTaylor, CPT. (SJ)

Power creep is real. Should older crew that should be great (Defiant Word, Dark Ages McCoy) be updated with better stats?

Doug Jones' Locker

No

I think that’s opening Pandora’s box. If we’re re-jiggering stats, relative stat levels can really only be determined by how much you like a character. Should Sisko have higher DIP than Picard or no? What about differing power levels for different versions of the same card? I say leave well enough alone - it’d only upset people.

Bob [FW]

DB should start retiring old crew from the portal then give them a stat boost when they are immortalized.

TP do better!! ~Colli~ (PoF)

Yes

Karr’s rarity should be changed to 3* cause his stats are absolute trash. Give everyone who had him some consolation for having the worst 4* Crew.

•§ë• Captain Tatem

No

Not updated, but at reduced cost to acquire.

Ikrit

Yes

SPOOOOON wrote: »

I think that’s opening Pandora’s box. If we’re re-jiggering stats, relative stat levels can really only be determined by how much you like a character. Should Sisko have higher DIP than Picard or no? What about differing power levels for different versions of the same card? I say leave well enough alone - it’d only upset people.

I think a way around that might be to increase all stats by a flat amount or percentage for all crew below a certain stat threshold. For example, you could increase Rakal Troi's base by 10% but her prof by only 5% (or not at all). So instead of giving her 50 more base med and only 20 more base cmd, all stats are raised by either the same flat or percent amount (her base and prof are roughly equal for all 3 skills). It also maintains the stat distribution (though a flat amount messes with the ratios, and a percent amount messes with the difference).

Lt. Gambol

I would like to see a mechanism for improving maxxed crew, perhaps medals, commendations, diplomas, etc. Give each crew an experience bar and a number of slots / bars or whatever to fill. You could throw all kinds of goodies into the Dabo wheel, events, etc. Being able to slowly improve older crew to their new stat threshold would be fun.

Capt Ajamm

No

I do think they should be added to threshold rewards like Dancing Uhura, or packs @lowered cost

Travis S McClain

Yes

I'd love to see old crew adjusted for inflation. There are lots of favorites of mine who seldom see any action because the math just isn't in their favor. "Unification" is one my top Spock stories, for instance, and despite his bizarre bowlegged stance and ridiculously difficult equipment requirements, I was thrilled when I finally got him. He's been frozen for ages, though, because he just isn't a strong enough contributor anymore.

That said, I don't have many thoughts about the "right" way such an undertaking ought to be conducted. I'm not keen on adding upgrade features like medals, because any pragmatic player would just use them on their top crew, which wouldn't address the matter at hand.

SPOOOOON wrote: »

I think that’s opening Pandora’s box. If we’re re-jiggering stats, relative stat levels can really only be determined by how much you like a character. Should Sisko have higher DIP than Picard or no? What about differing power levels for different versions of the same card? I say leave well enough alone - it’d only upset people.

The proposal as I understand it doesn't suggest realigning skills to more appropriately match anyone, and how much anyone likes a character is immaterial. Just to compensate for power creep that has made a lot of older crew obsolete. If a Sisko had a higher DIP than a Picard, that should remain in place. Rather, that Sisko and Picard should both have their DIP stats augmented so that they're worth using instead of freezing.

One possible means of deciding who to tweak might be to simply audit the numbers and boost the lowest percentile so they're more in line with the next highest percentile.

Bobkyou

No

Power creep exists in gaming to keep things from ending. Without stronger crew trickling in, gamers who play for the game rather than the characters will be less inclined to buy card packs or participate in events. That equals less revenue for DB, which shortens the game's lifespan.

Wundigore

No

People invest money to get certain crew based on usefulness. Rebalancing will devalue recent purchases and disincentiviize new ones.

McCaptainface

Yes

For someone who only buys a monthly card and usually finishes around the 1500-5000 mark in events receiving new (bar mega event characters all of 5*s I have FF/FE) 5* crew is a rarity. My first two 5* cards i won were Captain Sisko and Enterprise E Picard both of which over the past year and a bit of playing I have only manged to get them up to 3/5* FE. There is now nearly no point to having these cards, with power creep of even 4* neither of them make it into my top 10 of either DIP or CMD making them near enough worthless. They are just taking up space, along with 32 other 1-3/5*s I currently have. With so many more 5*s been added (2 or more a week) the likely hood of me ever FF them in a pack is getting slimmer and slimmer . I would like to see the older 5*s especially to be updated.

Travis S McClain

Yes

Bobkyou wrote: »

Power creep exists in gaming to keep things from ending. Without stronger crew trickling in, gamers who play for the game rather than the characters will be less inclined to buy card packs or participate in events. That equals less revenue for DB, which shortens the game's lifespan.

I'm not a gamer in general, so I'm entirely too uninformed to speak to whatever has been established about this as an overall trend or effect. I can't even speak for any other Timelines players. What I can say is that I hit a point near the end of last year where I had strong enough crew that I could afford to disregard stats and remain able to do everything I wanted to do. That, in turn, afforded me the luxury of selecting and keeping only the crew I wanted to have. It'd be nice if I could also get some mileage out of those crew members that I like. I'd be more eager to chase down some of those now-obsolete cards if they became more useful. Whether enough others share that sentiment to make it a worthwhile business decision for DB isn't for me to say, or even to know. I'm just a player with his own wish list, not a business consultant for the company.

Banjo1012

I’m not going to vote but I will put my two cents in. It’s ALOT harder to immortalize the older legendaries that you can only get out of the portal versus ones you can win copies of or buy copies of in events.

Pallidyne

I dunno

Travis S McClain wrote: »

Bobkyou wrote: »

Power creep exists in gaming to keep things from ending. Without stronger crew trickling in, gamers who play for the game rather than the characters will be less inclined to buy card packs or participate in events. That equals less revenue for DB, which shortens the game's lifespan.

I'm not a gamer in general, so I'm entirely too uninformed to speak to whatever has been established about this as an overall trend or effect. I can't even speak for any other Timelines players. What I can say is that I hit a point near the end of last year where I had strong enough crew that I could afford to disregard stats and remain able to do everything I wanted to do. That, in turn, afforded me the luxury of selecting and keeping only the crew I wanted to have. It'd be nice if I could also get some mileage out of those crew members that I like. I'd be more eager to chase down some of those now-obsolete cards if they became more useful. Whether enough others share that sentiment to make it a worthwhile business decision for DB isn't for me to say, or even to know. I'm just a player with his own wish list, not a business consultant for the company.

Some games do reworks like that, but usually it's a select few of the older characters at a time, but then it also follows that they then nerf other characters either then or at other times. Imagine our recurring skin stretcher getting 10% knocked off his Eng to 'balance the game' 6 weeks after the mega ended. That's the kinda crap some games pull that do 'balance updates'.

We've been very fortunate not to have folks jiggling the scales around the nerf/buff dance much in this game. (Yes there have been nerfs but VERY few in comparison to other games.)

But that being said, minor buffs might not be a bad thing. I dunno.

An across the board thing, though, I think would be bad simply because that would really make the demand for some of the newer characters that much less.

Ivanstone

Yes

I get the argument against not changing anything. However, some older crew are exceptionally poor. Captain Scott and Dr Chapel come to mind. Single skill crew should not be a thing.

Yateball

Yes

I said yes, but it's mostly just Captain Scott that I think desperately needs a refresh

Commander Sinclair

No

Ikrit wrote: »

SPOOOOON wrote: »

I think that’s opening Pandora’s box. If we’re re-jiggering stats, relative stat levels can really only be determined by how much you like a character. Should Sisko have higher DIP than Picard or no? What about differing power levels for different versions of the same card? I say leave well enough alone - it’d only upset people.

I think a way around that might be to increase all stats by a flat amount or percentage for all crew below a certain stat threshold. For example, you could increase Rakal Troi's base by 10% but her prof by only 5% (or not at all). So instead of giving her 50 more base med and only 20 more base cmd, all stats are raised by either the same flat or percent amount (her base and prof are roughly equal for all 3 skills). It also maintains the stat distribution (though a flat amount messes with the ratios, and a percent amount messes with the difference).

I think this is why we got starbases for boosts - to avoid having to go back on characters & re-stat.

Travis S McClain

Yes

Commander Sinclair wrote: »

Ikrit wrote: »

SPOOOOON wrote: »

I think that’s opening Pandora’s box. If we’re re-jiggering stats, relative stat levels can really only be determined by how much you like a character. Should Sisko have higher DIP than Picard or no? What about differing power levels for different versions of the same card? I say leave well enough alone - it’d only upset people.

I think a way around that might be to increase all stats by a flat amount or percentage for all crew below a certain stat threshold. For example, you could increase Rakal Troi's base by 10% but her prof by only 5% (or not at all). So instead of giving her 50 more base med and only 20 more base cmd, all stats are raised by either the same flat or percent amount (her base and prof are roughly equal for all 3 skills). It also maintains the stat distribution (though a flat amount messes with the ratios, and a percent amount messes with the difference).

I think this is why we got starbases for boosts - to avoid having to go back on characters & re-stat.

The problem with that being the approach is that those bonuses also inflate the newer crew who have stronger stats already, so the gap remains just as wide as before.

Zetterbeard

No

No.

Tossing old 5* crew into thresholds of new events would suffice.

HaBlack

No

Zetterbeard wrote: »

No.

Tossing old 5* crew into thresholds of new events would suffice.

this

Bob [FW]

Yateball wrote: »

I said yes, but it's mostly just Captain Scott that I think desperately needs a refresh

I still use Captain Scott in the Arena and find him incredibly useful!

DavideBooks

No

People beat me to it. You can't change once it is all set, but make old crew MUCH easier to obtain.

Captain_Who

No

No! Don't go retroactively decking with stats. You open that pandora's box and new crew can get nerfed, nothing is reliable, and everybody gets pissed.

Just retire old crew and make separate portals. Every other CCG has seasons, series, and new packs that include only cards from certain release dates. Certainly some ideas from other successful games can be implemented. Right? Bueller?

(HGH)Apollo

Yes

Yes give them better stats but not as good as current crew stats. Give them an inbetween boost. Do it once a month for those that are two years old that month. Give people something to look forward to.

Captain_Who

No

If you need old crew to be boosted, update the way bonus crew work. Give like a flat 1500 or 2000 point boost for matching traits or matching characters. Allow boosts to be stacked. Update traits on old crew.

Dippy

I dunno

I am not in favor of reworking a character's base stats just to bring them up to snuff with newer crew, but perhaps there could be a mechanism added to increase older crews stats by adding new equipment upgrade paths. I would be happy to put the work in to build additional 5* equipment for a favorite older crew to put them on the same level as some of the newer additions. I think that would also be more satisfying from a game play standpoint than just opening the game and all my old crew have been strengthened.

Mirror Cartman

Yes

Power creep is important in games like this. It helps newer players to be competitive, and gives a reason for older players to compete.

(HGH)Apollo wrote: »

Yes give them better stats but not as good as current crew stats. Give them an inbetween boost.

Give them a medium inbetween boost when re-released in packs. Give them a high inbetween boost, and a trait review when used as main event crew.

Everyones a winner. DB sell more packs, and more event packs. Older players get their crew made useful again, Newer players get more useful crew from the events and packs.

Matt_Decker

No

What's done is done. As much as I would love to see my older crew suddenly become stronger (and I've got a lot of them), this would have terrible implications for the ecosystem of the game. Newer players need a way to come to par with long time players, and power creep is one of the ways this happens. Without it, no one would join the game, or they would quickly leave once they realize they can never climb the ranks without spending big bucks.

Webberoni

No

Older/weaker cards should be 'retired', which could perhaps see them (ie: 4* and 5*) added to the loot tables for standard pulls and voyages.

PompeyMagnus

Yes

Yes, but only for some of the older, more egregiously weak 4*s, like Sela. I wouldn't go back and re-stat all the old 4*s, but certainly some of the older, more prominent characters that have been left in the dust stat-wise.