If you bought Monopoly but the box you got had no Monopoly money, you would write Parker brothers and ask them to send you what you paid for yes ?
(Or back to the store you bought it from)
Why is this any different ?
While I don't disagree with all the outrage, your comparison is stupid.
What going on would be more like buying Monopoly, assuming there weren't enough Hotel pieces so you pay for a Hotel Booster pack, then Parker Brothers says "Thanks for being a customer! Here's a free Hotel Booster Pack.
If you bought Monopoly but the box you got had no Monopoly money, you would write Parker brothers and ask them to send you what you paid for yes ?
(Or back to the store you bought it from)
Why is this any different ?
While I don't disagree with all the outrage, your comparison is stupid.
What going on would be more like buying Monopoly, assuming there weren't enough Hotel pieces so you pay for a Hotel Booster pack, then Parker Brothers says "Thanks for being a customer! Here's a free Hotel Booster Pack.
I think an even better comparison would be:
Game gets released and has a DLC you can pay $25 for.
Within a month of game's release, that DLC is released for free to the whole population and anyone who bought the DLC originally was entitled to a 1% refund.
I mean, I'm at the point of not really caring now, so I'm more entertained that someone could make such a poorly thought out decision.
I think the "gift" argument is overlooking the fact that most people would have been less upset if the servers just went down and DB didn't compensate. The compensation was a slap in the face because it was "here is something we told you could not be gotten again without spending cash/honor, after you spent that cash/honor based on our statement."
It's not often you can give something for free as an apology and make it worse, but DB found a way.
Lets get this straight no compensation was necessary for outage. Because everyone experiences an outage. Just because a few chose to keep their superrare for the end does not mean they deserve anything in outages. It was by their own choice they decided to do this.
There are other people who sped voyages up and were planning to use that to move up in rank. They deserve dil. back but that is it.
But there is no way I see the DB gift as a plan for compensation. I believe they were planning this give away and decided to tie it to the outage.
Giving away legendary crew is wrong unless they did not exist before. You cannot say that either Will Scarlett or Mirror Picard did not benefit some and leave others in the dust.
I will give you a guess that there are maybe 3% of the player base that had Will Scarlett FF. That means 3% saw 97% become more competitive. Where as Mirror Picard according to the forum pull, 64% of the players had FF. That means 64% saw 36% become more competitive. When you look at it that way Will Scarlett was much more of a disadvantage to those that had him FF than Mirror Picard,
Yet when you try to explain this to people they think Will Scarlett does not matter. I believe anybody who thinks Will Scarlett does not matter is arguing why Mirror Picard does not matter either.
Get with it people. People pay money for legendaries. As the OP points out they are all valueless. We are giving DB money for something that may not exist tomorrow. But let’s not compound this by DB showing us how valueless they are by just giving everyone one for free, when there will be always somebody who paid money to FF that crew.
I will say again DB should only do this for crew that did not exist. Otherwise, they are better off giving us either legendary citations, legendary behold, premium pulls, or honor.
The Will Scarlett and Mirror Jean-Luc Picard freebie is a slap in the face to those that FF’ed him. And just because you did not have them FF, does not make this right.
Lets get this straight no compensation was necessary for outage. Because everyone experiences an outage. Just because a few chose to keep their superrare for the end does not mean they deserve anything in outages. It was by their own choice they decided to do this.
There are other people who sped voyages up and were planning to use that to move up in rank. They deserve dil. back but that is it.
But there is no way I see the DB gift as a plan for compensation. I believe they were planning this give away and decided to tie it to the outage.
Giving away legendary crew is wrong unless they did not exist before. You cannot say that either Will Scarlett or Mirror Picard did not benefit some and leave others in the dust.
I will give you a guess that there are maybe 3% of the player base that had Will Scarlett FF. That means 3% saw 97% become more competitive. Where as Mirror Picard according to the forum pull, 64% of the players had FF. That means 64% saw 36% become more competitive. When you look at it that way Will Scarlett was much more of a disadvantage to those that had him FF than Mirror Picard,
Yet when you try to explain this to people they think Will Scarlett does not matter. I believe anybody who thinks Will Scarlett does not matter is arguing why Mirror Picard does not matter either.
Get with it people. People pay money for legendaries. As the OP points out they are all valueless. We are giving DB money for something that may not exist tomorrow. But let’s not compound this by DB showing us how valueless they are by just giving everyone one for free, when there will be always somebody who paid money to FF that crew.
I will say again DB should only do this for crew that did not exist. Otherwise, they are better off giving us either legendary citations, legendary behold, premium pulls, or honor.
The Will Scarlett and Mirror Jean-Luc Picard freebie is a slap in the face to those that FF’ed him. And just because you did not have them FF, does not make this right.
Ok, there's a huge fallacy in this argument, that somehow the events are decided on merit.
Will Scarlett gave no one an advantage in anything, he was old crew who wasn't very good to start with and power creep has consigned him to the mostly useless pile as a 1/5. He happens to have a great quote and was perfect for a Christmas giveaway.
Mirror Picard was given away at the end of the event when much of his salient use was now in the past, but going from 4/5 to 5/5 is a significant boost. But the difference he will make in events going forward will be wildly outdone by people who spend on that event and RNG.
Events are all P2W and they are mostly affected by current and not past spending. Galaxies are primarily a chron bidding war and you need the current event crew to lower that cost, a star on Mirror Picard will make little difference.
Faction events require depth of crew so yes of the player didn't have Mirror Picard he gets a nice boost, but for the most part an extra star on a character is a very minor deal. RNG is a huge factor in faction events and the tiny advantage that a star gives will be outshone by a lucky streak of shuttles every time.
And again in expeditions current event crew matter enormously and it's just a bidding war with tickets and time.
With the current event structure Will Scarlett will make almost no impact and Mirror Picard may give some new players a small benefit, and in both cases if you're not spending on that event you are not going to beat people who are.
If you bought Monopoly but the box you got had no Monopoly money, you would write Parker brothers and ask them to send you what you paid for yes ?
(Or back to the store you bought it from)
Why is this any different ?
While I don't disagree with all the outrage, your comparison is stupid.
What going on would be more like buying Monopoly, assuming there weren't enough Hotel pieces so you pay for a Hotel Booster pack, then Parker Brothers says "Thanks for being a customer! Here's a free Hotel Booster Pack.
I think an even better comparison would be:
Game gets released and has a DLC you can pay $25 for.
Within a month of game's release, that DLC is released for free to the whole population and anyone who bought the DLC originally was entitled to a 1% refund.
Yes, that's an apt comparison - except that the DLC would have to be something that could stack multiple times (it couldn't be, for example, an extra level or content that could only be applied once).
People chose to spend $25 on a piece of digital content. They paid the $25, so they fulfilled their end of the contract. DB provided the Mirror Picard, so they fulfilled their end of the contract.
Digital content in particular often gets discounted, and relatively often gets given away at no cost through various promotions or compensations. But the fact that it's digital is largely irrelevant, as it's still a straightforward transaction. People who thought mPicard was worth $25 paid $25 and got what they wanted.
I don't understand how this could confuse a Trek fan. Rule of Acquisition #17 clearly applies. Or if one has ever visited Real Life (and from reading some of these comments, it's clear that not everyone on these forums has done so), they should know that prices can go up and down on goods all the time. What they should do is only buy things at a price they are happy with. It's always annoying when we buy items that subsequently drop in price or are given away, but that's what happens. It's grounds for feedback, it's grounds for annoyance - but it's not grounds for some of the most pitiable, cringe-worthy complaints I think I've ever read on the Internet, and it's not grounds for contacting Apple or Google and complaining about a fraudulent transaction.
I'm not a Christian myself, but the parable of the workers in the vineyard seems to apply perfectly here.
Don't get me wrong - I think some of the feedback has been very good. A Legendary Citation would have been better compensation, I agree. And I can sympathize with the annoyance. I would find it annoying, too.
But on these forums over the last couple of days I've suffered through reading through some of the most self-entitled emotive rants, stupefyingly non-analogous analogies, and attempts at statistics that would make a 10-year-old blush. Where's my compensation for all that?
If you bought Monopoly but the box you got had no Monopoly money, you would write Parker brothers and ask them to send you what you paid for yes ?
(Or back to the store you bought it from)
Why is this any different ?
While I don't disagree with all the outrage, your comparison is stupid.
What going on would be more like buying Monopoly, assuming there weren't enough Hotel pieces so you pay for a Hotel Booster pack, then Parker Brothers says "Thanks for being a customer! Here's a free Hotel Booster Pack.
I think an even better comparison would be:
Game gets released and has a DLC you can pay $25 for.
Within a month of game's release, that DLC is released for free to the whole population and anyone who bought the DLC originally was entitled to a 1% refund.
Yes, that's an apt comparison - except that the DLC would have to be something that could stack multiple times (it couldn't be, for example, an extra level or content that could only be applied once).
People chose to spend $25 on a piece of digital content. They paid the $25, so they fulfilled their end of the contract. DB provided the Mirror Picard, so they fulfilled their end of the contract.
Digital content in particular often gets discounted, and relatively often gets given away at no cost through various promotions or compensations. But the fact that it's digital is largely irrelevant, as it's still a straightforward transaction. People who thought mPicard was worth $25 paid $25 and got what they wanted.
I don't understand how this could confuse a Trek fan. Rule of Acquisition #17 clearly applies. Or if one has ever visited Real Life (and from reading some of these comments, it's clear that not everyone on these forums has done so), they should know that prices can go up and down on goods all the time. What they should do is only buy things at a price they are happy with. It's always annoying when we buy items that subsequently drop in price or are given away, but that's what happens. It's grounds for feedback, it's grounds for annoyance - but it's not grounds for some of the most pitiable, cringe-worthy complaints I think I've ever read on the Internet, and it's not grounds for contacting Apple or Google and complaining about a fraudulent transaction.
I'm not a Christian myself, but the parable of the workers in the vineyard seems to apply perfectly here.
Don't get me wrong - I think some of the feedback has been very good. A Legendary Citation would have been better compensation, I agree. And I can sympathize with the annoyance. I would find it annoying, too.
But on these forums over the last couple of days I've suffered through reading through some of the most self-entitled emotive rants, stupefyingly non-analogous analogies, and attempts at statistics that would make a 10-year-old blush. Where's my compensation for all that?
Things get discounted after their novelty wears off. A year? Six months? People were literally spending money on Picard that week.
You say we should buy things at a price we are happy, and I was happy to FF Picard at $25. But I sure had a case of buyer's remorse when one was rewarded for free.
Had DB not "made it right", I would have had severe reservations about making future purchases. That leaves my options at: stop buying or voice my concerns, hoping they change their behavior.
If you bought Monopoly but the box you got had no Monopoly money, you would write Parker brothers and ask them to send you what you paid for yes ?
(Or back to the store you bought it from)
Why is this any different ?
While I don't disagree with all the outrage, your comparison is stupid.
What going on would be more like buying Monopoly, assuming there weren't enough Hotel pieces so you pay for a Hotel Booster pack, then Parker Brothers says "Thanks for being a customer! Here's a free Hotel Booster Pack.
I think an even better comparison would be:
Game gets released and has a DLC you can pay $25 for.
Within a month of game's release, that DLC is released for free to the whole population and anyone who bought the DLC originally was entitled to a 1% refund.
This has happened in the past - I just can't remember which game it was. And when the pack was made free, the company retroactively refunded anyone who originally paid for it - on their own accord. No outcry from the public, no pitchforks needed. man, i wish i could remember which game it was...
I say again, Scarlett was a completely different thing. I didn't complain in the least even though I had bought him a year ago and immortalized him two weeks later. Scarlett is so long ago, and everyone can get him with a little luck in normal portals now. I'm not in the slightest angry at DB for giving everyone a free Scarlett Worf ... it was more meant as a little "Christmas" and "Merry Man" joke and I giggled actually.
Mirror Picard however ... wasn't smart, because he was the main featured crew of the current event (meaning he won't be in the regular portal for half a year) and those who cited or DYS'd the last star on him had an advantage over those who didn't, and that's fair. Getting everyone the last star out for free turned fair into unfair.
I'm pretty sure none of the Mega Event crew have ever been added to the portal, which makes it even more tempting for people to want to FF with Honor or Money
I think I have actually seen Borg Queen in a Be-Gold and wasn't aware how valuable she was ... or was that in a pack with Locutus?
She was in the Borg pack, yes. Mega event characters have not been exclusive to mega events. There was no reason to think that would change with Mirror Picard, but give people a chance to whine and complain and they will always do it.
She was in the Borg pack, yes. Mega event characters have not been exclusive to mega events. There was no reason to think that would change with Mirror Picard, but give people a chance to whine and complain and they will always do it.
The Borg Queen has yet to appear in the main circulation despite all of this time. Being featured in a random Borg pack for a few days is hardly the same as her being available from any random Portal pull. For the pack, you had to spend Dilithium, so unless you had Dilithium stacking up due to Achievement awards, you had to spend money to get her. That is still a far cry from DB sending a 1/5 Borg Queen (example) to every single player as "compensation" immediately after the Borg Mega-event ended and after they made it clear getting her last star would be impossible otherwise.
There are three ways to do something; the right way, the wrong way, and the Janeway.
She was in the Borg pack, yes. Mega event characters have not been exclusive to mega events. There was no reason to think that would change with Mirror Picard, but give people a chance to whine and complain and they will always do it.
The Borg Queen has yet to appear in the main circulation despite all of this time. Being featured in a random Borg pack for a few days is hardly the same as her being available from any random Portal pull. For the pack, you had to spend Dilithium, so unless you had Dilithium stacking up due to Achievement awards, you had to spend money to get her. That is still a far cry from DB sending a 1/5 Borg Queen (example) to every single player as "compensation" immediately after the Borg Mega-event ended and after they made it clear getting her last star would be impossible otherwise.
Your chances of getting a specific 5* from the general pool are almost nil. Of course she was available in a themed pack and of course you would have to spend dilithium. That's how you get any 5* that you want. The point is that she was available outside of the event, just like Picard is right now.
Not to mention, DB has gone out of its way to emphasize that mega event crew cannot be fully fused from free. One of the prior mega events, the wording was vague and DB verified that mega event crew cannot be fully fused for free.
She was in the Borg pack, yes. Mega event characters have not been exclusive to mega events. There was no reason to think that would change with Mirror Picard, but give people a chance to whine and complain and they will always do it.
The Borg Queen has yet to appear in the main circulation despite all of this time. Being featured in a random Borg pack for a few days is hardly the same as her being available from any random Portal pull. For the pack, you had to spend Dilithium, so unless you had Dilithium stacking up due to Achievement awards, you had to spend money to get her. That is still a far cry from DB sending a 1/5 Borg Queen (example) to every single player as "compensation" immediately after the Borg Mega-event ended and after they made it clear getting her last star would be impossible otherwise.
Your chances of getting a specific 5* from the general pool are almost nil. Of course she was available in a themed pack and of course you would have to spend dilithium. That's how you get any 5* that you want. The point is that she was available outside of the event, just like Picard is right now.
Again, not the same thing. She also appeared months after she premiered, so there was a good period of time between the event and her reappearance in a themed pack. Picard was just in the event and then given to everyone for free within an hour or two of it ending.
There are three ways to do something; the right way, the wrong way, and the Janeway.
She was in the Borg pack, yes. Mega event characters have not been exclusive to mega events. There was no reason to think that would change with Mirror Picard, but give people a chance to whine and complain and they will always do it.
The Borg Queen has yet to appear in the main circulation despite all of this time. Being featured in a random Borg pack for a few days is hardly the same as her being available from any random Portal pull. For the pack, you had to spend Dilithium, so unless you had Dilithium stacking up due to Achievement awards, you had to spend money to get her. That is still a far cry from DB sending a 1/5 Borg Queen (example) to every single player as "compensation" immediately after the Borg Mega-event ended and after they made it clear getting her last star would be impossible otherwise.
Your chances of getting a specific 5* from the general pool are almost nil. Of course she was available in a themed pack and of course you would have to spend dilithium. That's how you get any 5* that you want. The point is that she was available outside of the event, just like Picard is right now.
Again, not the same thing. She also appeared months after she premiered, so there was a good period of time between the event and her reappearance in a themed pack. Picard was just in the event and then given to everyone for free within an hour or two of it ending.
Ok, we're making progress here. You understand that previous mega event characters may be available after the conclusion of the event. Can we also conclude that Picard may be available after the event? Yes, he is right now as a matter of fact.
If you rush to complete a character that may be available in the future then you run the risk of getting that same character at some point in time. Whether it is 2 days after the event or 2 years after the event, the result is exactly the same.
If I had 5/5 Merry Worf, I wouldn't hate on DB for giving him away. It's a nice gesture and unfortunately I made a bad decision. Oh well, move on.
Things get discounted after their novelty wears off. A year? Six months? People were literally spending money on Picard that week.
Eh? Things can be discounted before they've even been released. It's common to be able to pre-order digital content with a 10-20% discount. There's no statute of limitations on when products can be discounted. Indeed, I've seen software given away for free around release date, like $15 Darkwood: https://www.reddit.com/r/GameDeals/comments/6w38c3/acidwizardstudio_**tsk tsk**_darkwood_full_game_free/ (quite a good game, by the way).
And with stackable content like mPicard, there are benefits to having extra copies.
Don't get me wrong, though - I do think giving away mPicard was a poor decision by DB, and a Legendary Citation would have made much more sense.
You say we should buy things at a price we are happy, and I was happy to FF Picard at $25. But I sure had a case of buyer's remorse when one was rewarded for free.
Yes. I feel the same way when I buy something at 75% off, only to see it at an even deeper discount before I've had a chance to use it. It's a normal part of buying things, but it's annoying when it happens!
Things get discounted after their novelty wears off. A year? Six months? People were literally spending money on Picard that week.
Eh? Things can be discounted before they've even been released. It's common to be able to pre-order digital content with a 10-20% discount. There's no statute of limitations on when products can be discounted. Indeed, I've seen software given away for free around release date, like $15 Darkwood: https://www.reddit.com/r/GameDeals/comments/6w38c3/acidwizardstudio_**tsk tsk**_darkwood_full_game_free/ (quite a good game, by the way).
And with stackable content like mPicard, there are benefits to having extra copies.
Don't get me wrong, though - I do think giving away mPicard was a poor decision by DB, and a Legendary Citation would have made much more sense.
You say we should buy things at a price we are happy, and I was happy to FF Picard at $25. But I sure had a case of buyer's remorse when one was rewarded for free.
Yes. I feel the same way when I buy something at 75% off, only to see it at an even deeper discount before I've had a chance to use it. It's a normal part of buying things, but it's annoying when it happens!
In other words it **tsk tsk**, and just live with things that **tsk tsk**? Thats the gist I'm getting from ya.
She was in the Borg pack, yes. Mega event characters have not been exclusive to mega events. There was no reason to think that would change with Mirror Picard, but give people a chance to whine and complain and they will always do it.
The Borg Queen has yet to appear in the main circulation despite all of this time. Being featured in a random Borg pack for a few days is hardly the same as her being available from any random Portal pull. For the pack, you had to spend Dilithium, so unless you had Dilithium stacking up due to Achievement awards, you had to spend money to get her. That is still a far cry from DB sending a 1/5 Borg Queen (example) to every single player as "compensation" immediately after the Borg Mega-event ended and after they made it clear getting her last star would be impossible otherwise.
Your chances of getting a specific 5* from the general pool are almost nil. Of course she was available in a themed pack and of course you would have to spend dilithium. That's how you get any 5* that you want. The point is that she was available outside of the event, just like Picard is right now.
Again, not the same thing. She also appeared months after she premiered, so there was a good period of time between the event and her reappearance in a themed pack. Picard was just in the event and then given to everyone for free within an hour or two of it ending.
Ok, we're making progress here. You understand that previous mega event characters may be available after the conclusion of the event. Can we also conclude that Picard may be available after the event? Yes, he is right now as a matter of fact.
If you rush to complete a character that may be available in the future then you run the risk of getting that same character at some point in time. Whether it is 2 days after the event or 2 years after the event, the result is exactly the same.
If I had 5/5 Merry Worf, I wouldn't hate on DB for giving him away. It's a nice gesture and unfortunately I made a bad decision. Oh well, move on.
You are not getting it. DB had established that Mega-event exclusive 5*s would not be readily available to obtain after the events concluded, so you would have to spend money or Honor to get the last star or be stuck with a 4/5 for an extended period of time until they so happened to appear in a themed pack or finally placed in general circulation way after the fact. All other event crew are held back for a few months or so prior to being placed in that circulation, but it is understood by those that spend money to obtain them one way or another when their premiere event is live that eventually they would be readily available in any sort of Portal pull come time. No one whines when their immortal 5* crew from X event a few months prior gets added to the main circulation because that is what happens on a normal basis.
With Mega-event exclusive 5*'s, DB made it specifically clear that during the month the event takes place is the only time you can obtain said crew on a guaranteed basis. They operate differently from normal event crew in that manner. We know that eventually they, too, will appear again for purchase, but outside of the Mega-event themed pack that appears right after the month wraps up, said crew will not be available for a long while. You still have to pay for them in that pack and hope the RNG is good to you with that in order to obtain a crew that was essentially free for four weeks straight. The same would happen should they have appeared months down the line in another themed pack.
With this instance, a fifth Picard was granted for free for seemingly no good reason at all, ultimately going against what they have advertised since May Mega-event exclusive 5* crew would be. Will Scarlet was out for a year already and was already readily available in circulation for several months, which is why if any complaining about that was done, it was done by people who will literally complain about everything under the sun and will never be happy about anything if it does not fit their personal narrative.
Yes, we understand that Picard would eventually have been available in other packs sometime in the future, but that is not what we are complaining about. The principal of the matter is that DB completely went against their word that has been established for eight months now and screwed over many players, from the "whales" to those who are free-to-play and every type of player in between.
There are three ways to do something; the right way, the wrong way, and the Janeway.
Things get discounted after their novelty wears off. A year? Six months? People were literally spending money on Picard that week.
Eh? Things can be discounted before they've even been released. It's common to be able to pre-order digital content with a 10-20% discount. There's no statute of limitations on when products can be discounted. Indeed, I've seen software given away for free around release date, like $15 Darkwood: https://www.reddit.com/r/GameDeals/comments/6w38c3/acidwizardstudio_**tsk tsk**_darkwood_full_game_free/ (quite a good game, by the way).
And with stackable content like mPicard, there are benefits to having extra copies.
Don't get me wrong, though - I do think giving away mPicard was a poor decision by DB, and a Legendary Citation would have made much more sense.
You say we should buy things at a price we are happy, and I was happy to FF Picard at $25. But I sure had a case of buyer's remorse when one was rewarded for free.
Yes. I feel the same way when I buy something at 75% off, only to see it at an even deeper discount before I've had a chance to use it. It's a normal part of buying things, but it's annoying when it happens!
In other words it *hugs*, and just live with things that *hugs*? Thats the gist I'm getting from ya.
Not quite just "live with things". I don't mind the feedback DB have been getting. It's important to be critical, and for customers to explain what will and won't affect their purchasing decisions.
It's just some of the utter ridiculousness in some (possibly most, I haven't been counting!) of the posts, as if they'd been written by people who have no idea how money works, have no idea how buying things works, and also don't seem to understand that they're dealing with humans and think it's OK to be rude in their demands and their tickets.
Err... let me try to produce a more sensible reaction!
Grrr! DB just gave away mPicard to everybody! JUST LAST WEEK I SPENT $25 TO FF HIM!!! I could have saved $25 if I'd just waited!!! I'm totally kicking myself!
Hey, DB, there must be lots of people in my position! We're clearly big spenders on Timelines, if we're spending $25 on a single character. Given the other problems Timelines has had over the past few weeks as well, would it be at all possible to trade this extra Picard card that we don't need for 50K honor instead? Please? It would be really appreciated!
Instead, there are people threatening to report DB for fraud, because those people gave DB $25 for a copy of Mirror Picard, and DB gave them a copy of Mirror Picard. People who abuse customer protections like that make things more expensive for the financially-responsible.
Things get discounted after their novelty wears off. A year? Six months? People were literally spending money on Picard that week.
Eh? Things can be discounted before they've even been released. It's common to be able to pre-order digital content with a 10-20% discount. There's no statute of limitations on when products can be discounted. Indeed, I've seen software given away for free around release date, like $15 Darkwood: https://www.reddit.com/r/GameDeals/comments/6w38c3/acidwizardstudio_**tsk tsk**_darkwood_full_game_free/ (quite a good game, by the way).
And with stackable content like mPicard, there are benefits to having extra copies.
Don't get me wrong, though - I do think giving away mPicard was a poor decision by DB, and a Legendary Citation would have made much more sense.
You say we should buy things at a price we are happy, and I was happy to FF Picard at $25. But I sure had a case of buyer's remorse when one was rewarded for free.
Yes. I feel the same way when I buy something at 75% off, only to see it at an even deeper discount before I've had a chance to use it. It's a normal part of buying things, but it's annoying when it happens!
In other words it *hugs*, and just live with things that *hugs*? Thats the gist I'm getting from ya.
Not quite just "live with things". I don't mind the feedback DB have been getting. It's important to be critical, and for customers to explain what will and won't affect their purchasing decisions.
It's just some of the utter ridiculousness in some (possibly most, I haven't been counting!) of the posts, as if they'd been written by people who have no idea how money works, have no idea how buying things works, and also don't seem to understand that they're dealing with humans and think it's OK to be rude in their demands and their tickets.
Err... let me try to produce a more sensible reaction!
Grrr! DB just gave away mPicard to everybody! JUST LAST WEEK I SPENT $25 TO FF HIM!!! I could have saved $25 if I'd just waited!!! I'm totally kicking myself!
Hey, DB, there must be lots of people in my position! We're clearly big spenders on Timelines, if we're spending $25 on a single character. Given the other problems Timelines has had over the past few weeks as well, would it be at all possible to trade this extra Picard card that we don't need for 50K honor instead? Please? It would be really appreciated!
Instead, there are people threatening to report DB for fraud, because those people gave DB $25 for a copy of Mirror Picard, and DB gave them a copy of Mirror Picard. People who abuse customer protections like that make things more expensive for the financially-responsible.
I agree some moderation should be in effect, however moderation has never led to change here.
The fights Lethfold and others put forth just to get DB to give us any advanced notice of events was pretty epic. Though that was a long simmer that kinda blew. (We used to find out about events well, on Wednesday when the pic and rewards table was posted in game... this was about a year or so ago)
Hitting up the fraud piece, not even going to touch that.
Though I was advocating negative reviews of the games in the stores if movement in the right direction is not seen. I may still advocate that depending on how things go for the next few events. And though fraud protection usage is what some are advocating does not mean others or even the majority are doing so.
Most folks are just venting their varying degrees of anger or frustration and in many cases deciding to boycott spending for now.
You seem to paint folks with an issue with this with a pretty broad brush whether intentionally or not, and frankly, it feels like your methodology is stoking the fire rather than combatting it.
Don't flag Mr. Kite's post because you don't agree with it. Flagging is for spam, not a dislike button.
I would agree if this was just an opinion but the post is basically a troll. Many forums will flag and remove trolling posts
I think your definition of trolling is unnecessarily broad. Trolling is not merely stating something that a lot of people have already stated the opposite of, which is what the OP was. It was given from the get-go as an opinion, and an "unpopular" one, at that — and it was not abusive nor did it sling personal insults — so it is a far cry from overt trolling, whether or not you agree with what was said.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing. ~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
Don't flag Mr. Kite's post because you don't agree with it. Flagging is for spam, not a dislike button.
I would agree if this was just an opinion but the post is basically a troll. Many forums will flag and remove trolling posts
I think your definition of trolling is unnecessarily broad. Trolling is not merely stating something that a lot of people have already stated the opposite of, which is what the OP was. It was given from the get-go as an opinion, and an "unpopular" one, at that — and it was not abusive nor did it sling personal insults — so it is a far cry from overt trolling, whether or not you agree with what was said.
Its borderline, looking at the subject line. Was it intended to give voice to an unpopular decision or to incite a response? Its somewhere in the grey area.
Don't flag Mr. Kite's post because you don't agree with it. Flagging is for spam, not a dislike button.
I would agree if this was just an opinion but the post is basically a troll. Many forums will flag and remove trolling posts
I think your definition of trolling is unnecessarily broad. Trolling is not merely stating something that a lot of people have already stated the opposite of, which is what the OP was. It was given from the get-go as an opinion, and an "unpopular" one, at that — and it was not abusive nor did it sling personal insults — so it is a far cry from overt trolling, whether or not you agree with what was said.
Its borderline, looking at the subject line. Was it intended to give voice to an unpopular decision or to incite a response? Its somewhere in the grey area.
Who knows, besides the OP? Perhaps it was a little of both. But even if it was, as you call it, borderline, the flag option really shouldn't be used for posts like that, but rather for two things only: spam and abuse. Neither of which were employed by the OP in that post. I feel like it's a slippery slope when people start coming up with their own definitions of which posts are "trolling", as suddenly it's open season on anyone who voices an unpopular opinion.
One particular post of mine (which I won't dredge up now, but it stirred up a lot of responses) got 5 flags from people who apparently thought I was trolling. However, due to the subject in question, I actually wear those flags as a badge of honor. ;-)
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing. ~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
She was in the Borg pack, yes. Mega event characters have not been exclusive to mega events. There was no reason to think that would change with Mirror Picard, but give people a chance to whine and complain and they will always do it.
The Borg Queen has yet to appear in the main circulation despite all of this time. Being featured in a random Borg pack for a few days is hardly the same as her being available from any random Portal pull. For the pack, you had to spend Dilithium, so unless you had Dilithium stacking up due to Achievement awards, you had to spend money to get her. That is still a far cry from DB sending a 1/5 Borg Queen (example) to every single player as "compensation" immediately after the Borg Mega-event ended and after they made it clear getting her last star would be impossible otherwise.
Your chances of getting a specific 5* from the general pool are almost nil. Of course she was available in a themed pack and of course you would have to spend dilithium. That's how you get any 5* that you want. The point is that she was available outside of the event, just like Picard is right now.
Again, not the same thing. She also appeared months after she premiered, so there was a good period of time between the event and her reappearance in a themed pack. Picard was just in the event and then given to everyone for free within an hour or two of it ending.
Ok, we're making progress here. You understand that previous mega event characters may be available after the conclusion of the event. Can we also conclude that Picard may be available after the event? Yes, he is right now as a matter of fact.
If you rush to complete a character that may be available in the future then you run the risk of getting that same character at some point in time. Whether it is 2 days after the event or 2 years after the event, the result is exactly the same.
If I had 5/5 Merry Worf, I wouldn't hate on DB for giving him away. It's a nice gesture and unfortunately I made a bad decision. Oh well, move on.
You are not getting it. DB had established that Mega-event exclusive 5*s would not be readily available to obtain after the events concluded, so you would have to spend money or Honor to get the last star or be stuck with a 4/5 for an extended period of time until they so happened to appear in a themed pack or finally placed in general circulation way after the fact. All other event crew are held back for a few months or so prior to being placed in that circulation, but it is understood by those that spend money to obtain them one way or another when their premiere event is live that eventually they would be readily available in any sort of Portal pull come time. No one whines when their immortal 5* crew from X event a few months prior gets added to the main circulation because that is what happens on a normal basis.
With Mega-event exclusive 5*'s, DB made it specifically clear that during the month the event takes place is the only time you can obtain said crew on a guaranteed basis. They operate differently from normal event crew in that manner. We know that eventually they, too, will appear again for purchase, but outside of the Mega-event themed pack that appears right after the month wraps up, said crew will not be available for a long while. You still have to pay for them in that pack and hope the RNG is good to you with that in order to obtain a crew that was essentially free for four weeks straight. The same would happen should they have appeared months down the line in another themed pack.
With this instance, a fifth Picard was granted for free for seemingly no good reason at all, ultimately going against what they have advertised since May Mega-event exclusive 5* crew would be. Will Scarlet was out for a year already and was already readily available in circulation for several months, which is why if any complaining about that was done, it was done by people who will literally complain about everything under the sun and will never be happy about anything if it does not fit their personal narrative.
Yes, we understand that Picard would eventually have been available in other packs sometime in the future, but that is not what we are complaining about. The principal of the matter is that DB completely went against their word that has been established for eight months now and screwed over many players, from the "whales" to those who are free-to-play and every type of player in between.
They have been and are available. You are wrong.
I didn't realize that this matter had a principal. Hopefully he/she is better than the one I had in high school.
Why I am wasting my time giving my opinion is beyond me, but here we go.
Timelines crashes or bugs more than any game I have ever played (apart from GTA Online but that is connection rather than bugs). I am not frustrated because it crashes because they say sorry with useful stuff. Yes, I pay to play.
I had a 4/5 Picard, now he's 5/5. I was happy with that gift too.
What does frustrate me is the general Star Trek gaming experience. We never get good games. If you compare Star Trek games across all platform to Star Wars, let's say, we are sorely behind in quality and stability. Compare Star Trek Online to Battlefront, there is no comparison.
Timelines crashes and bugs, but it should. It's a Star Trek game. We can't expect anything else.
Don't flag Mr. Kite's post because you don't agree with it. Flagging is for spam, not a dislike button.
I would agree if this was just an opinion but the post is basically a troll. Many forums will flag and remove trolling posts
I think your definition of trolling is unnecessarily broad. Trolling is not merely stating something that a lot of people have already stated the opposite of, which is what the OP was. It was given from the get-go as an opinion, and an "unpopular" one, at that — and it was not abusive nor did it sling personal insults — so it is a far cry from overt trolling, whether or not you agree with what was said.
Trolling doesn't have to be offensive and any post which is designed to wind people up and annoy is a troll.
The original poster has posted an unpopular opinion to wind people up and then stepped back from the debate. This is clear trolling behaviour (usually a troll will only return occasionally to stoke the debate).
The fact that you can't see that this is a troll just shows that the original poster knows what he is doing
Comments
While I don't disagree with all the outrage, your comparison is stupid.
What going on would be more like buying Monopoly, assuming there weren't enough Hotel pieces so you pay for a Hotel Booster pack, then Parker Brothers says "Thanks for being a customer! Here's a free Hotel Booster Pack.
I think an even better comparison would be:
Game gets released and has a DLC you can pay $25 for.
Within a month of game's release, that DLC is released for free to the whole population and anyone who bought the DLC originally was entitled to a 1% refund.
I think the "gift" argument is overlooking the fact that most people would have been less upset if the servers just went down and DB didn't compensate. The compensation was a slap in the face because it was "here is something we told you could not be gotten again without spending cash/honor, after you spent that cash/honor based on our statement."
It's not often you can give something for free as an apology and make it worse, but DB found a way.
There are other people who sped voyages up and were planning to use that to move up in rank. They deserve dil. back but that is it.
But there is no way I see the DB gift as a plan for compensation. I believe they were planning this give away and decided to tie it to the outage.
Giving away legendary crew is wrong unless they did not exist before. You cannot say that either Will Scarlett or Mirror Picard did not benefit some and leave others in the dust.
I will give you a guess that there are maybe 3% of the player base that had Will Scarlett FF. That means 3% saw 97% become more competitive. Where as Mirror Picard according to the forum pull, 64% of the players had FF. That means 64% saw 36% become more competitive. When you look at it that way Will Scarlett was much more of a disadvantage to those that had him FF than Mirror Picard,
Yet when you try to explain this to people they think Will Scarlett does not matter. I believe anybody who thinks Will Scarlett does not matter is arguing why Mirror Picard does not matter either.
Get with it people. People pay money for legendaries. As the OP points out they are all valueless. We are giving DB money for something that may not exist tomorrow. But let’s not compound this by DB showing us how valueless they are by just giving everyone one for free, when there will be always somebody who paid money to FF that crew.
I will say again DB should only do this for crew that did not exist. Otherwise, they are better off giving us either legendary citations, legendary behold, premium pulls, or honor.
The Will Scarlett and Mirror Jean-Luc Picard freebie is a slap in the face to those that FF’ed him. And just because you did not have them FF, does not make this right.
Ok, there's a huge fallacy in this argument, that somehow the events are decided on merit.
Will Scarlett gave no one an advantage in anything, he was old crew who wasn't very good to start with and power creep has consigned him to the mostly useless pile as a 1/5. He happens to have a great quote and was perfect for a Christmas giveaway.
Mirror Picard was given away at the end of the event when much of his salient use was now in the past, but going from 4/5 to 5/5 is a significant boost. But the difference he will make in events going forward will be wildly outdone by people who spend on that event and RNG.
Events are all P2W and they are mostly affected by current and not past spending. Galaxies are primarily a chron bidding war and you need the current event crew to lower that cost, a star on Mirror Picard will make little difference.
Faction events require depth of crew so yes of the player didn't have Mirror Picard he gets a nice boost, but for the most part an extra star on a character is a very minor deal. RNG is a huge factor in faction events and the tiny advantage that a star gives will be outshone by a lucky streak of shuttles every time.
And again in expeditions current event crew matter enormously and it's just a bidding war with tickets and time.
With the current event structure Will Scarlett will make almost no impact and Mirror Picard may give some new players a small benefit, and in both cases if you're not spending on that event you are not going to beat people who are.
Yes, that's an apt comparison - except that the DLC would have to be something that could stack multiple times (it couldn't be, for example, an extra level or content that could only be applied once).
People chose to spend $25 on a piece of digital content. They paid the $25, so they fulfilled their end of the contract. DB provided the Mirror Picard, so they fulfilled their end of the contract.
Digital content in particular often gets discounted, and relatively often gets given away at no cost through various promotions or compensations. But the fact that it's digital is largely irrelevant, as it's still a straightforward transaction. People who thought mPicard was worth $25 paid $25 and got what they wanted.
I don't understand how this could confuse a Trek fan. Rule of Acquisition #17 clearly applies. Or if one has ever visited Real Life (and from reading some of these comments, it's clear that not everyone on these forums has done so), they should know that prices can go up and down on goods all the time. What they should do is only buy things at a price they are happy with. It's always annoying when we buy items that subsequently drop in price or are given away, but that's what happens. It's grounds for feedback, it's grounds for annoyance - but it's not grounds for some of the most pitiable, cringe-worthy complaints I think I've ever read on the Internet, and it's not grounds for contacting Apple or Google and complaining about a fraudulent transaction.
I'm not a Christian myself, but the parable of the workers in the vineyard seems to apply perfectly here.
Don't get me wrong - I think some of the feedback has been very good. A Legendary Citation would have been better compensation, I agree. And I can sympathize with the annoyance. I would find it annoying, too.
But on these forums over the last couple of days I've suffered through reading through some of the most self-entitled emotive rants, stupefyingly non-analogous analogies, and attempts at statistics that would make a 10-year-old blush. Where's my compensation for all that?
Things get discounted after their novelty wears off. A year? Six months? People were literally spending money on Picard that week.
You say we should buy things at a price we are happy, and I was happy to FF Picard at $25. But I sure had a case of buyer's remorse when one was rewarded for free.
Had DB not "made it right", I would have had severe reservations about making future purchases. That leaves my options at: stop buying or voice my concerns, hoping they change their behavior.
This has happened in the past - I just can't remember which game it was. And when the pack was made free, the company retroactively refunded anyone who originally paid for it - on their own accord. No outcry from the public, no pitchforks needed. man, i wish i could remember which game it was...
She was in the Borg pack, yes. Mega event characters have not been exclusive to mega events. There was no reason to think that would change with Mirror Picard, but give people a chance to whine and complain and they will always do it.
The Borg Queen has yet to appear in the main circulation despite all of this time. Being featured in a random Borg pack for a few days is hardly the same as her being available from any random Portal pull. For the pack, you had to spend Dilithium, so unless you had Dilithium stacking up due to Achievement awards, you had to spend money to get her. That is still a far cry from DB sending a 1/5 Borg Queen (example) to every single player as "compensation" immediately after the Borg Mega-event ended and after they made it clear getting her last star would be impossible otherwise.
DB: Do Better.
Member of Starship Trista.
Your chances of getting a specific 5* from the general pool are almost nil. Of course she was available in a themed pack and of course you would have to spend dilithium. That's how you get any 5* that you want. The point is that she was available outside of the event, just like Picard is right now.
Again, not the same thing. She also appeared months after she premiered, so there was a good period of time between the event and her reappearance in a themed pack. Picard was just in the event and then given to everyone for free within an hour or two of it ending.
DB: Do Better.
Member of Starship Trista.
Ok, we're making progress here. You understand that previous mega event characters may be available after the conclusion of the event. Can we also conclude that Picard may be available after the event? Yes, he is right now as a matter of fact.
If you rush to complete a character that may be available in the future then you run the risk of getting that same character at some point in time. Whether it is 2 days after the event or 2 years after the event, the result is exactly the same.
If I had 5/5 Merry Worf, I wouldn't hate on DB for giving him away. It's a nice gesture and unfortunately I made a bad decision. Oh well, move on.
And with stackable content like mPicard, there are benefits to having extra copies.
Don't get me wrong, though - I do think giving away mPicard was a poor decision by DB, and a Legendary Citation would have made much more sense.
Yes. I feel the same way when I buy something at 75% off, only to see it at an even deeper discount before I've had a chance to use it. It's a normal part of buying things, but it's annoying when it happens!
In other words it **tsk tsk**, and just live with things that **tsk tsk**? Thats the gist I'm getting from ya.
You are not getting it. DB had established that Mega-event exclusive 5*s would not be readily available to obtain after the events concluded, so you would have to spend money or Honor to get the last star or be stuck with a 4/5 for an extended period of time until they so happened to appear in a themed pack or finally placed in general circulation way after the fact. All other event crew are held back for a few months or so prior to being placed in that circulation, but it is understood by those that spend money to obtain them one way or another when their premiere event is live that eventually they would be readily available in any sort of Portal pull come time. No one whines when their immortal 5* crew from X event a few months prior gets added to the main circulation because that is what happens on a normal basis.
With Mega-event exclusive 5*'s, DB made it specifically clear that during the month the event takes place is the only time you can obtain said crew on a guaranteed basis. They operate differently from normal event crew in that manner. We know that eventually they, too, will appear again for purchase, but outside of the Mega-event themed pack that appears right after the month wraps up, said crew will not be available for a long while. You still have to pay for them in that pack and hope the RNG is good to you with that in order to obtain a crew that was essentially free for four weeks straight. The same would happen should they have appeared months down the line in another themed pack.
With this instance, a fifth Picard was granted for free for seemingly no good reason at all, ultimately going against what they have advertised since May Mega-event exclusive 5* crew would be. Will Scarlet was out for a year already and was already readily available in circulation for several months, which is why if any complaining about that was done, it was done by people who will literally complain about everything under the sun and will never be happy about anything if it does not fit their personal narrative.
Yes, we understand that Picard would eventually have been available in other packs sometime in the future, but that is not what we are complaining about. The principal of the matter is that DB completely went against their word that has been established for eight months now and screwed over many players, from the "whales" to those who are free-to-play and every type of player in between.
DB: Do Better.
Member of Starship Trista.
Off-topic, but wow, this new forum word filter/replacement is truly odd. I saw it on someone else's post and thought it was an auto-correct thing.
Apparently, somebody's been taking Q very seriously when he asks, "How about a big hug?"
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
Not quite just "live with things". I don't mind the feedback DB have been getting. It's important to be critical, and for customers to explain what will and won't affect their purchasing decisions.
It's just some of the utter ridiculousness in some (possibly most, I haven't been counting!) of the posts, as if they'd been written by people who have no idea how money works, have no idea how buying things works, and also don't seem to understand that they're dealing with humans and think it's OK to be rude in their demands and their tickets.
Err... let me try to produce a more sensible reaction!
Grrr! DB just gave away mPicard to everybody! JUST LAST WEEK I SPENT $25 TO FF HIM!!! I could have saved $25 if I'd just waited!!! I'm totally kicking myself!
Hey, DB, there must be lots of people in my position! We're clearly big spenders on Timelines, if we're spending $25 on a single character. Given the other problems Timelines has had over the past few weeks as well, would it be at all possible to trade this extra Picard card that we don't need for 50K honor instead? Please? It would be really appreciated!
Instead, there are people threatening to report DB for fraud, because those people gave DB $25 for a copy of Mirror Picard, and DB gave them a copy of Mirror Picard.
I agree some moderation should be in effect, however moderation has never led to change here.
The fights Lethfold and others put forth just to get DB to give us any advanced notice of events was pretty epic. Though that was a long simmer that kinda blew. (We used to find out about events well, on Wednesday when the pic and rewards table was posted in game... this was about a year or so ago)
Hitting up the fraud piece, not even going to touch that.
Though I was advocating negative reviews of the games in the stores if movement in the right direction is not seen. I may still advocate that depending on how things go for the next few events. And though fraud protection usage is what some are advocating does not mean others or even the majority are doing so.
Most folks are just venting their varying degrees of anger or frustration and in many cases deciding to boycott spending for now.
You seem to paint folks with an issue with this with a pretty broad brush whether intentionally or not, and frankly, it feels like your methodology is stoking the fire rather than combatting it.
In the original MAA forums retarded was change to retardo, and curse words became pinkbunnies. I miss the pinkbunnies.
Well that sounds really
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
I would agree if this was just an opinion but the post is basically a troll. Many forums will flag and remove trolling posts
I think your definition of trolling is unnecessarily broad. Trolling is not merely stating something that a lot of people have already stated the opposite of, which is what the OP was. It was given from the get-go as an opinion, and an "unpopular" one, at that — and it was not abusive nor did it sling personal insults — so it is a far cry from overt trolling, whether or not you agree with what was said.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
Its borderline, looking at the subject line. Was it intended to give voice to an unpopular decision or to incite a response? Its somewhere in the grey area.
Who knows, besides the OP? Perhaps it was a little of both. But even if it was, as you call it, borderline, the flag option really shouldn't be used for posts like that, but rather for two things only: spam and abuse. Neither of which were employed by the OP in that post. I feel like it's a slippery slope when people start coming up with their own definitions of which posts are "trolling", as suddenly it's open season on anyone who voices an unpopular opinion.
One particular post of mine (which I won't dredge up now, but it stirred up a lot of responses) got 5 flags from people who apparently thought I was trolling. However, due to the subject in question, I actually wear those flags as a badge of honor. ;-)
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
They have been and are available. You are wrong.
I didn't realize that this matter had a principal. Hopefully he/she is better than the one I had in high school.
Timelines crashes or bugs more than any game I have ever played (apart from GTA Online but that is connection rather than bugs). I am not frustrated because it crashes because they say sorry with useful stuff. Yes, I pay to play.
I had a 4/5 Picard, now he's 5/5. I was happy with that gift too.
What does frustrate me is the general Star Trek gaming experience. We never get good games. If you compare Star Trek games across all platform to Star Wars, let's say, we are sorely behind in quality and stability. Compare Star Trek Online to Battlefront, there is no comparison.
Timelines crashes and bugs, but it should. It's a Star Trek game. We can't expect anything else.
Trolling doesn't have to be offensive and any post which is designed to wind people up and annoy is a troll.
The original poster has posted an unpopular opinion to wind people up and then stepped back from the debate. This is clear trolling behaviour (usually a troll will only return occasionally to stoke the debate).
The fact that you can't see that this is a troll just shows that the original poster knows what he is doing