I think we're all using different definitions of whale depending on our own income and spending habits. To someone on low income or who is frugal, anyone who's not F2P could be thought of as a whale. For me, a whale is someone who throws lots of money at the game, like £50 every week or more. Basically someone whose income is at a level where it doesn't matter to them how much they spend here, they're still doing fine. Other people's mileage may vary I guess.
I look at it compared to the cost of other forms of entertainment. I wouldn't consider someone who buys a round of beers at the pub or has a night out at the pictures someone who's rolling in money. But I suppose if you're living on the breadline and struggle to even buy food/make rent, you might consider them such.
Agreed... a lot of denial. But admitting you are a whale is the first step
It is really interesting how people rationalize their spending behavior by comparing it to other spendings.
I think spending $1000 or a multitude of that on a game you do not own nor ever will and that the moment the plug is pulled from this game you lose everything you put in it equals whaleness.
Which doesn't mean that it has no value it just means that we spend a lot of moneey on something very fleeting.
If I pay $10 a week to go see a movie, am I a cinema whale if I do it over 2-3 years knowing that I do not own that movie?
I think there are a TON of alternative examples, since everyone has their own unique hobbies/interests/pleasures/vices:
$20/week for STT instead watching 1 or 2 movies at the theater,
$20/week for STT instead of a few beers or shots at the bar,
$20/week for STT instead of taking that taxi just 1 time over the bus,
$20/week for STT instead of taking that hooker out for not even an entire night of fun,
$20/week for STT instead of just 1 hand at the blackjack table,
$20/week for STT instead of that filet mignon that just goes in one end and out the other,
$20/week for STT instead of that small baggie of weed or whatever you smoke,
$20/week for STT instead of getting your wife/girlfriend those dozen roses......
And many more.....Its true that STT is not something that is permanently owned or stays with us forever, but so are many other forms of entertainment. I'd like to think that the crew in STT stays with you on your phone much longer than that filet mignon, that bag of weed, or that girlfriend ever will. Heck, that last one on the list is probably the biggest waste of them all! 😃 (Being sarcastic here, I waste money on my wife all the time)
Fyi I'm not a VIP14 yet but mostly because I've only been active for a couple of months, but I totally understand those who are and wouldn't mind being one myself someday....those extra replicates & crew slots are nice!
Is that formula with VIP points correct? By Sybok I've got a problem. Hi everyone, I'm WeAreBorg and I have a STT problem. Might need one of those invites Frank but to be honest I'll fail to write that essay cause I'll be too busy playing STT. I'm a whale and have been for awhile. I had been on a hiatus from gaming, don't have the time for consul gaming and never got into mobile gaming until now. The only reason why - Star Trek! I know this game won't last forever but don't mind supporting it and would rather enjoy the ride then spend my time leveling Chef Neelix over and over again.
The Timelines Whale Collective, which is exactly what it sounds like, meets every other Tuesday at our secret facility, deep within Mount Doom.
If you would like to join our happy and lovely group, please prepare a 4 page essay on the impact of the mass production of cheap ink pens and how that crippled and ended the market for quill pens, save for quill pen aficionados.
Once this essay has been submitted, we will contact you to come in person to Mount Doom for a luncheon and social event. If you gel well with the rest of the group, which is to say you don't hurl slurs or wipe your nose on the curtains, we shall send a membership kit to your residence within 6-8 weeks.
I TOLD YOU,... I WAS STANDING NEXT TO THE CURTAIN WHEN I SNEEZED. WHEN I CAUGHT MY BREATH I COULDN'T HELP BUT NOTICE HOW NICE THE DRAPERY SMELLED, SO I TOOK A NICE WHIFF. HOW MANY TIMES TO WE HAVE TO GO OVER THIS?!!!
All I know is that after reading some of the replies in this thread, I now feel a lot better about the colossal chunk of money I've spent on STT in the past year, because I haven't bought any alcohol during that time (I decided to go cold turkey on booze for a year or two)... and that likely would have approached similar dollar amounts, had I still been drinking.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing. ~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
All I know is that after reading some of the replies in this thread, I now feel a lot better about the colossal chunk of money I've spent on STT in the past year, because I haven't bought any alcohol during that time (I decided to go cold turkey on booze for a year or two)... and that likely would have approached similar dollar amounts, had I still been drinking.
I prefer to play STT while drunk... I think it enhances the experience and makes me feel like my Dabo Wheel spins and portal pulls will succeed more than they actually do... and when they inevitably don’t, the booze numbs the pain... oh crap, now I gotta go to AA as well as the STT Mount Doom meeting... I’m feeling a lot of “fight club” deja vu here...
I think spending $1000 or a multitude of that on a game you do not own nor ever will and that the moment the plug is pulled from this game you lose everything you put in it equals whaleness.
Which doesn't mean that it has no value it just means that we spend a lot of moneey on something very fleeting.
This means almost everyone is a whale because people spend money on other things that are just as fleeting. Alcohol, iTunes music, cinema tickets, live sports. You don't own anything at the end of those and never will either.
Clearly you did not actually read what I said....
There is no such thing as "whales" when it comes to alcohol, music etc... because it has a specific reference to either gambling or gaming.
I also say that it is not without value.
But take for instance music... when you spend a 1000 dollars on music you own it and you can have it forever. This game you will lose everything the moment the plug is pulled...
Of course consumables like drinks and food are not comparable to games or music...
A game company will definitely think of you as a whale when you spend $1000 (and yes I have worked for a gaming company)
Actually, read your TOS. if iTunes goes away, so does your legal right to that music. Same for Amazon. So sounds very similar to what you are referring to as the difference between real and virtual goods.
It's called download.
I'm not sure about you but I have copies of everything.
But lets be real, Apple will survive DB by a very long time.
I understand that you might take my comments in a combative way but arguing about what will last longer or shorter has nothing to do with the actual subject.
The term whales does not refer to the purchase of music or food or cars for that matter. We have all acquired things that were over $1000 yet we do not refer to these purchases as being made by a whale.
When talking about online games a whale is just way less as what most of us here have put in STT, that is not a bad or good thing it simply is.
I'm not sure why anyone feels like they need to argue that spending $1000 on a mobile game does not make you a whale? I find that odd.
I think spending $1000 or a multitude of that on a game you do not own nor ever will and that the moment the plug is pulled from this game you lose everything you put in it equals whaleness.
Which doesn't mean that it has no value it just means that we spend a lot of moneey on something very fleeting.
This means almost everyone is a whale because people spend money on other things that are just as fleeting. Alcohol, iTunes music, cinema tickets, live sports. You don't own anything at the end of those and never will either.
Clearly you did not actually read what I said....
There is no such thing as "whales" when it comes to alcohol, music etc... because it has a specific reference to either gambling or gaming.
I also say that it is not without value.
But take for instance music... when you spend a 1000 dollars on music you own it and you can have it forever. This game you will lose everything the moment the plug is pulled...
Of course consumables like drinks and food are not comparable to games or music...
A game company will definitely think of you as a whale when you spend $1000 (and yes I have worked for a gaming company)
Actually, read your TOS. if iTunes goes away, so does your legal right to that music. Same for Amazon. So sounds very similar to what you are referring to as the difference between real and virtual goods.
It's called download.
I'm not sure about you but I have copies of everything.
But lets be real, Apple will survive DB by a very long time.
I understand that you might take my comments in a combative way but arguing about what will last longer or shorter has nothing to do with the actual subject.
The term whales does not refer to the purchase of music or food or cars for that matter. We have all acquired things that were over $1000 yet we do not refer to these purchases as being made by a whale.
When talking about online games a whale is just way less as what most of us here have put in STT, that is not a bad or good thing it simply is.
I'm not sure why anyone feels like they need to argue that spending $1000 on a mobile game does not make you a whale? I find that odd.
Sorry if I offended anyone by my claims.
Incidentally, it may be called download, but its also called illegal possession and intellectual property infringement if you keep the music after the service goes bye bye.
Agreed... a lot of denial. But admitting you are a whale is the first step
It is really interesting how people rationalize their spending behavior by comparing it to other spendings.
I think spending $1000 or a multitude of that on a game you do not own nor ever will and that the moment the plug is pulled from this game you lose everything you put in it equals whaleness.
Which doesn't mean that it has no value it just means that we spend a lot of moneey on something very fleeting.
Yeah, I agree that's those who spend that much might be considered whales by many, but I don't think that's the part that people are have trouble accepting. I would think, from a neutral perspective, that its the "rationalize their spending" part and the "spend a lot of money on something very fleeting" part that triggers people. Again, that's speaking as a non-VIP14 but that's how it appears. I think we as human beings waste money on TONS of things that might be considered "fleeting" or meaningless (some might consider music in general a waste of money), but it doesn't diminish how those fleeting things make us happier even if for just a moment...
I think spending $1000 or a multitude of that on a game you do not own nor ever will and that the moment the plug is pulled from this game you lose everything you put in it equals whaleness.
Which doesn't mean that it has no value it just means that we spend a lot of moneey on something very fleeting.
This means almost everyone is a whale because people spend money on other things that are just as fleeting. Alcohol, iTunes music, cinema tickets, live sports. You don't own anything at the end of those and never will either.
Clearly you did not actually read what I said....
There is no such thing as "whales" when it comes to alcohol, music etc... because it has a specific reference to either gambling or gaming.
I also say that it is not without value.
But take for instance music... when you spend a 1000 dollars on music you own it and you can have it forever. This game you will lose everything the moment the plug is pulled...
Of course consumables like drinks and food are not comparable to games or music...
A game company will definitely think of you as a whale when you spend $1000 (and yes I have worked for a gaming company)
Actually, read your TOS. if iTunes goes away, so does your legal right to that music. Same for Amazon. So sounds very similar to what you are referring to as the difference between real and virtual goods.
It's called download.
I'm not sure about you but I have copies of everything.
But lets be real, Apple will survive DB by a very long time.
I understand that you might take my comments in a combative way but arguing about what will last longer or shorter has nothing to do with the actual subject.
The term whales does not refer to the purchase of music or food or cars for that matter. We have all acquired things that were over $1000 yet we do not refer to these purchases as being made by a whale.
When talking about online games a whale is just way less as what most of us here have put in STT, that is not a bad or good thing it simply is.
I'm not sure why anyone feels like they need to argue that spending $1000 on a mobile game does not make you a whale? I find that odd.
Sorry if I offended anyone by my claims.
Incidentally, it may be called download, but its also called illegal possession and intellectual property infringement if you keep the music after the service goes bye bye.
I'm completely lost by your obsession on the iTunes thing... When I buy music on iTunes and then back up those music files I am not doing anything illegal. When I "burn" a cd of those files to play in a cd player I am still very much within my rights since I purchased the album for my personal use.
So please stop it with the far fetched music reference since it is just plain stupid.
Agreed... a lot of denial. But admitting you are a whale is the first step
It is really interesting how people rationalize their spending behavior by comparing it to other spendings.
I think spending $1000 or a multitude of that on a game you do not own nor ever will and that the moment the plug is pulled from this game you lose everything you put in it equals whaleness.
Which doesn't mean that it has no value it just means that we spend a lot of moneey on something very fleeting.
Yeah, I agree that's those who spend that much might be considered whales by many, but I don't think that's the part that people are have trouble accepting. I would think, from a neutral perspective, that its the "rationalize their spending" part and the "spend a lot of money on something very fleeting" part that triggers people. Again, that's speaking as a non-VIP14 but that's how it appears. I think we as human beings waste money on TONS of things that might be considered "fleeting" or meaningless (some might consider music in general a waste of money), but it doesn't diminish how those fleeting things make us happier even if for just a moment...
As I said, it does not mean it has no value. The value can be many things including but not limited to a moment of happiness when getting a certain character.
I do not have an opinion on if spending a certain amount is worth it, because that is a personal call to every single player. I am simply arguing that when one reaches vip 13/14 one is considered a whale in the eyes of the game company. But we all have different budgets and so the scale of when one feels they are a whale is not the same as when a game company might think of you as a whale.
I think spending $1000 or a multitude of that on a game you do not own nor ever will and that the moment the plug is pulled from this game you lose everything you put in it equals whaleness.
Which doesn't mean that it has no value it just means that we spend a lot of moneey on something very fleeting.
This means almost everyone is a whale because people spend money on other things that are just as fleeting. Alcohol, iTunes music, cinema tickets, live sports. You don't own anything at the end of those and never will either.
Clearly you did not actually read what I said....
There is no such thing as "whales" when it comes to alcohol, music etc... because it has a specific reference to either gambling or gaming.
I also say that it is not without value.
But take for instance music... when you spend a 1000 dollars on music you own it and you can have it forever. This game you will lose everything the moment the plug is pulled...
Of course consumables like drinks and food are not comparable to games or music...
A game company will definitely think of you as a whale when you spend $1000 (and yes I have worked for a gaming company)
Actually, read your TOS. if iTunes goes away, so does your legal right to that music. Same for Amazon. So sounds very similar to what you are referring to as the difference between real and virtual goods.
It's called download.
I'm not sure about you but I have copies of everything.
But lets be real, Apple will survive DB by a very long time.
I understand that you might take my comments in a combative way but arguing about what will last longer or shorter has nothing to do with the actual subject.
The term whales does not refer to the purchase of music or food or cars for that matter. We have all acquired things that were over $1000 yet we do not refer to these purchases as being made by a whale.
When talking about online games a whale is just way less as what most of us here have put in STT, that is not a bad or good thing it simply is.
I'm not sure why anyone feels like they need to argue that spending $1000 on a mobile game does not make you a whale? I find that odd.
Sorry if I offended anyone by my claims.
Incidentally, it may be called download, but its also called illegal possession and intellectual property infringement if you keep the music after the service goes bye bye.
I'm completely lost by your obsession on the iTunes thing... When I buy music on iTunes and then back up those music files I am not doing anything illegal. When I "burn" a cd of those files to play in a cd player I am still very much within my rights since I purchased the album for my personal use.
So please stop it with the far fetched music reference since it is just plain stupid.
You aren't doing anything illegal until a streaming and digital media service ceases to exist after which you are required by law and contract to destroy all copies. Your license to use the works only exists as long as they have their license.
You agreed to these terms when you joined the service. Amazon has the same terms on their streaming service, however the exception to that rule is when you purchase the physical media with it with their 'auto-rip' service. There are several other examples of this. What's interesting is Amazon's subsidiary (formerly independent) Audible does NOT have this limitation in their TOS, but may be implied depending on their contracts with folks like Simon and Shuster.
Now not saying you cannot violate these without much retribution or cost, as normal individuals don't get data audits -- however, that does not change the legal status of the situation.
Agreed... a lot of denial. But admitting you are a whale is the first step
It is really interesting how people rationalize their spending behavior by comparing it to other spendings.
I think spending $1000 or a multitude of that on a game you do not own nor ever will and that the moment the plug is pulled from this game you lose everything you put in it equals whaleness.
Which doesn't mean that it has no value it just means that we spend a lot of moneey on something very fleeting.
Yeah, I agree that's those who spend that much might be considered whales by many, but I don't think that's the part that people are have trouble accepting. I would think, from a neutral perspective, that its the "rationalize their spending" part and the "spend a lot of money on something very fleeting" part that triggers people. Again, that's speaking as a non-VIP14 but that's how it appears. I think we as human beings waste money on TONS of things that might be considered "fleeting" or meaningless (some might consider music in general a waste of money), but it doesn't diminish how those fleeting things make us happier even if for just a moment...
As I said, it does not mean it has no value. The value can be many things including but not limited to a moment of happiness when getting a certain character.
I do not have an opinion on if spending a certain amount is worth it, because that is a personal call to every single player. I am simply arguing that when one reaches vip 13/14 one is considered a whale in the eyes of the game company. But we all have different budgets and so the scale of when one feels they are a whale is not the same as when a game company might think of you as a whale.
Yup, I know you mentioned a couple of times that you don't argue that it has no value, but there were also implications made in other parts of your comments that spending any sort of money on a digitally fleeting form of entertainment was a fool's errand. Hey, I'm sure that's not how you meant it, because from your forum status, I'm sure you must've spent some money on the game yourself? No judgement whatsoever here, just my observation of your comments, me being one of those foolish spenders that have no regrets...
You can have this online victory and then you can msgs me privately and we'll hammer out the legal debate since my opinion is that you are very much wrong but again the strange and unrelated music debate has nothing, I mean NOTHING to do with "When Is One Considered a Whale?".
I am just mesmerized by your relentless iTunes debate.
So, please feel free to msgs me in private and then you can make your case for how my music would ever become illegal. Good luck
Agreed... a lot of denial. But admitting you are a whale is the first step
It is really interesting how people rationalize their spending behavior by comparing it to other spendings.
I think spending $1000 or a multitude of that on a game you do not own nor ever will and that the moment the plug is pulled from this game you lose everything you put in it equals whaleness.
Which doesn't mean that it has no value it just means that we spend a lot of moneey on something very fleeting.
Yeah, I agree that's those who spend that much might be considered whales by many, but I don't think that's the part that people are have trouble accepting. I would think, from a neutral perspective, that its the "rationalize their spending" part and the "spend a lot of money on something very fleeting" part that triggers people. Again, that's speaking as a non-VIP14 but that's how it appears. I think we as human beings waste money on TONS of things that might be considered "fleeting" or meaningless (some might consider music in general a waste of money), but it doesn't diminish how those fleeting things make us happier even if for just a moment...
As I said, it does not mean it has no value. The value can be many things including but not limited to a moment of happiness when getting a certain character.
I do not have an opinion on if spending a certain amount is worth it, because that is a personal call to every single player. I am simply arguing that when one reaches vip 13/14 one is considered a whale in the eyes of the game company. But we all have different budgets and so the scale of when one feels they are a whale is not the same as when a game company might think of you as a whale.
Yup, I know you mentioned a couple of times that you don't argue that it has no value, but there were also implications made in other parts of your comments that spending any sort of money on a digitally fleeting form of entertainment was a fool's errand. Hey, I'm sure that's not how you meant it, because from your forum status, I'm sure you must've spent some money on the game yourself? No judgement whatsoever here, just my observation of your comments, me being one of those foolish spenders that have no regrets...
Can you please put line breaks in you comment so it is easier to read?
So you just put words in my mouth that I did not use "foolish", "fools errant" and more words with foolish.
I never use foolish so please do not say I did.
A whale has nothing to do with foolishness, worthlessness or regret. It is about how a gaming company looks at YOU. You are a whale because you are willing to pay 10 of 50 bucks easy on a free to play game. This does not make you a bad person it just puts you in a box.
I am in the same box so I'm not sure why you take this as an insult... it's just understanding that you and I spend more on this "free to play" game than the average person does.
It’s like watching an Orca Killer Whale pod against Moby Dick...
Gonna get me some popcorn 🍿 now and save me $10 on a movie ticket because this is far more entertaining and then I can use than money to buy a $10 for 10 pack which will net me 6800 honour with all the 3x immortalized beholds...
Wow... a small mention of large cetaceans sure rubs some nerves. I love the whales... watched then breech on the par 3 at Kapalua in Maui last year... and in STT they keep DB employees in work and the servers on.
Tip of the hat to the whales... with all sincerity. You may kick my butt at events but I’m cool with that. Spend your money any way you want as long as it doesn’t burn the kids college fund or milk money...
You can have this online victory and then you can msgs me privately and we'll hammer out the legal debate since my opinion is that you are very much wrong but again the strange and unrelated music debate has nothing, I mean NOTHING to do with "When Is One Considered a Whale?".
I am just mesmerized by your relentless iTunes debate.
So, please feel free to msgs me in private and then you can make your case for how my music would ever become illegal. Good luck
1) Its pertinent as you were making statements on things that cease to have value once a service, i.e. this game, disappear. The impermanence is something that is the world that we live in, as well as the perpetual ownership of the corporate sponsor or the actual artist if 'purchased' directly.
2) It's not your music. You've purchased licensing to access said music. That's the changes in the digital media environment. It's a revocable license as well, as the vendor can revoke not only your access but your license to possess any copy of said media.
Go ahead and invite it private so things can go all non-TOS or some such. It does not change how the intellectual property landscape has changed, not whether purchases of entertainment on a streaming services vs this game vs other venues are any more ethereal from a legal standpoint.
It’s like watching an Orca Killer Whale pod against Moby Dick...
Gonna get me some popcorn 🍿 now and save me $10 on a movie ticket because this is far more entertaining and then I can use than money to buy a $10 for 10 pack which will net me 6800 honour with all the 3x immortalized beholds...
Wow... a small mention of large cetaceans sure rubs some nerves. I love the whales... watched then breech on the par 3 at Kapalua in Maui last year... and in STT they keep DB employees in work and the servers on.
Tip of the hat to the whales... with all sincerity. You may kick my butt at events but I’m cool with that. Spend your money any way you want as long as it doesn’t burn the kids college fund or milk money...
My kid doesn’t have diapers but I got my fifth star for Mirror T’Pol. (I feel the need to say that yes, of course this was a joke and not reality)
You can have this online victory and then you can msgs me privately and we'll hammer out the legal debate since my opinion is that you are very much wrong but again the strange and unrelated music debate has nothing, I mean NOTHING to do with "When Is One Considered a Whale?".
I am just mesmerized by your relentless iTunes debate.
So, please feel free to msgs me in private and then you can make your case for how my music would ever become illegal. Good luck
1) Its pertinent as you were making statements on things that cease to have value once a service, i.e. this game, disappear. The impermanence is something that is the world that we live in, as well as the perpetual ownership of the corporate sponsor or the actual artist if 'purchased' directly.
2) It's not your music. You've purchased licensing to access said music. That's the changes in the digital media environment. It's a revocable license as well, as the vendor can revoke not only your access but your license to possess any copy of said media.
Go ahead and invite it private so things can go all non-TOS or some such. It does not change how the intellectual property landscape has changed, not whether purchases of entertainment on a streaming services vs this game vs other venues are any more ethereal from a legal standpoint.
"the vendor can revoke not only your access but your license to possess any copy of said media"
This is an absolutely untrue statement.
Please feel free to find any "real" (this means real legal and not iTunes TOU) legal standing that would support this.
I understand that you want to drag this out in public but I'll end here and leave what ever last word to you.
You can have this online victory and then you can msgs me privately and we'll hammer out the legal debate since my opinion is that you are very much wrong but again the strange and unrelated music debate has nothing, I mean NOTHING to do with "When Is One Considered a Whale?".
I am just mesmerized by your relentless iTunes debate.
So, please feel free to msgs me in private and then you can make your case for how my music would ever become illegal. Good luck
1) Its pertinent as you were making statements on things that cease to have value once a service, i.e. this game, disappear. The impermanence is something that is the world that we live in, as well as the perpetual ownership of the corporate sponsor or the actual artist if 'purchased' directly.
2) It's not your music. You've purchased licensing to access said music. That's the changes in the digital media environment. It's a revocable license as well, as the vendor can revoke not only your access but your license to possess any copy of said media.
Go ahead and invite it private so things can go all non-TOS or some such. It does not change how the intellectual property landscape has changed, not whether purchases of entertainment on a streaming services vs this game vs other venues are any more ethereal from a legal standpoint.
My understanding of the current state of digital copyright is similar to yours. Kind of why I still buy blu rays and CDs and rip them onto my iPhone, computer and car SD cards... the legal difference between buying a physical disc (or tapes or vinyl in the old days) is substantially different than current streaming and digital media platforms. If you want to see the difference, just look up Microsoft’s Groove music which dies this month.
The implications in reality are another story as it seems massively remote that anyone get prosecuted for having downloaded Groove music and keep using it after it dies. The same can be said about illegally downloaded music as well.
So the practical difference is virtually nil but the legal difference is substantial. I don’t trust any of these guys because I’ve seen enough “they’re too big too go bankrupt” companies go bust. Like to just store my discs and rip... which probably makes me a fossil... and if I make VIP 14, I’ll be a fossilized whale that can be put in the museum...
It’s like watching an Orca Killer Whale pod against Moby Dick...
Gonna get me some popcorn 🍿 now and save me $10 on a movie ticket because this is far more entertaining and then I can use than money to buy a $10 for 10 pack which will net me 6800 honour with all the 3x immortalized beholds...
Wow... a small mention of large cetaceans sure rubs some nerves. I love the whales... watched then breech on the par 3 at Kapalua in Maui last year... and in STT they keep DB employees in work and the servers on.
Tip of the hat to the whales... with all sincerity. You may kick my butt at events but I’m cool with that. Spend your money any way you want as long as it doesn’t burn the kids college fund or milk money...
My kid doesn’t have diapers but I got my fifth star for Mirror T’Pol. (I feel the need to say that yes, of course this was a joke and not reality)
I forgot about diapers (or nappies if you prefer)... it’s been 15 years since I had to buy those buggers... but they are just about the only thing that Costco sized portions is NOT sufficient because somehow a 10lb baby can produce 10 tonnes or bodily waste a day...
But my 5* for DA McCoy must wait because second semester university tuition bills just came in... so once again I will get my derrière kicked in the upcoming event by large aquatic cetaceans...
But my 5* for DA McCoy must wait because second semester university tuition bills just came in... so once again I will get my derrière kicked in the upcoming event by large aquatic cetaceans...
I know the feeling. If I put some effort in, I can sometimes just break top 2500, but that's about my limit. What's your usual placing?
Level 99. Latest Immortal (957): Chancellor Gowron - October 2023.
On a faction event I can place top 2500 with no kickstart, no speed boosts, and no dilithium. With a full effort, last time I placed 15th. All out max effort, last time I was 4th going into the galaxy portion
One good article, though it discusses the fact you do not own digital content in regards to it being transferable via an estate, rather than the revoking:
Incidentally calling the EULA/TOS for iTunes as non-legit is essentially stating that your contract with them is something you lied about agreeing to when you joined the service. Not sound legal ground from a civil standpoint.
To Paunds standpoint: I've been present for several software audits that turned up illegally stored music that led to some folks landing in hot water. Noone goes out of their way to go after folks who are storing or distributing anymore, as it gets too much social media and public backfire, but if you're caught during some other process... it usually is not pretty.
Hopefully most folks don't store their music at work.
One good article, though it discusses the fact you do not own digital content in regards to it being transferable via an estate, rather than the revoking:
Incidentally calling the EULA/TOS for iTunes as non-legit is essentially stating that your contract with them is something you lied about agreeing to when you joined the service. Not sound legal ground from a civil standpoint.
To Paunds standpoint: I've been present for several software audits that turned up illegally stored music that led to some folks landing in hot water. Noone goes out of their way to go after folks who are storing or distributing anymore, as it gets too much social media and public backfire, but if you're caught during some other process... it usually is not pretty.
Hopefully most folks don't store their music at work.
Was this the whole thing started by the Napster/Metallica feud? Where for 10 years Metallica was all like “down with corporations” and “big business sells us out! We want our music heard by anyone who wants it!!!” Then they sued Napster for letting anyone have their music who wants it?
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I think there are a TON of alternative examples, since everyone has their own unique hobbies/interests/pleasures/vices:
$20/week for STT instead watching 1 or 2 movies at the theater,
$20/week for STT instead of a few beers or shots at the bar,
$20/week for STT instead of taking that taxi just 1 time over the bus,
$20/week for STT instead of taking that hooker out for not even an entire night of fun,
$20/week for STT instead of just 1 hand at the blackjack table,
$20/week for STT instead of that filet mignon that just goes in one end and out the other,
$20/week for STT instead of that small baggie of weed or whatever you smoke,
$20/week for STT instead of getting your wife/girlfriend those dozen roses......
And many more.....Its true that STT is not something that is permanently owned or stays with us forever, but so are many other forms of entertainment. I'd like to think that the crew in STT stays with you on your phone much longer than that filet mignon, that bag of weed, or that girlfriend ever will. Heck, that last one on the list is probably the biggest waste of them all! 😃 (Being sarcastic here, I waste money on my wife all the time)
Fyi I'm not a VIP14 yet but mostly because I've only been active for a couple of months, but I totally understand those who are and wouldn't mind being one myself someday....those extra replicates & crew slots are nice!
The Mama and Papas... then The Beach Boys... were probably talking (or dreaming) about California... but that’s just a guess... 😇
I TOLD YOU,... I WAS STANDING NEXT TO THE CURTAIN WHEN I SNEEZED. WHEN I CAUGHT MY BREATH I COULDN'T HELP BUT NOTICE HOW NICE THE DRAPERY SMELLED, SO I TOOK A NICE WHIFF. HOW MANY TIMES TO WE HAVE TO GO OVER THIS?!!!
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
I prefer to play STT while drunk... I think it enhances the experience and makes me feel like my Dabo Wheel spins and portal pulls will succeed more than they actually do... and when they inevitably don’t, the booze numbs the pain... oh crap, now I gotta go to AA as well as the STT Mount Doom meeting... I’m feeling a lot of “fight club” deja vu here...
It's called download.
I'm not sure about you but I have copies of everything.
But lets be real, Apple will survive DB by a very long time.
I understand that you might take my comments in a combative way but arguing about what will last longer or shorter has nothing to do with the actual subject.
The term whales does not refer to the purchase of music or food or cars for that matter. We have all acquired things that were over $1000 yet we do not refer to these purchases as being made by a whale.
When talking about online games a whale is just way less as what most of us here have put in STT, that is not a bad or good thing it simply is.
I'm not sure why anyone feels like they need to argue that spending $1000 on a mobile game does not make you a whale? I find that odd.
Sorry if I offended anyone by my claims.
Incidentally, it may be called download, but its also called illegal possession and intellectual property infringement if you keep the music after the service goes bye bye.
Yeah, I agree that's those who spend that much might be considered whales by many, but I don't think that's the part that people are have trouble accepting. I would think, from a neutral perspective, that its the "rationalize their spending" part and the "spend a lot of money on something very fleeting" part that triggers people. Again, that's speaking as a non-VIP14 but that's how it appears. I think we as human beings waste money on TONS of things that might be considered "fleeting" or meaningless (some might consider music in general a waste of money), but it doesn't diminish how those fleeting things make us happier even if for just a moment...
I'm completely lost by your obsession on the iTunes thing... When I buy music on iTunes and then back up those music files I am not doing anything illegal. When I "burn" a cd of those files to play in a cd player I am still very much within my rights since I purchased the album for my personal use.
So please stop it with the far fetched music reference since it is just plain stupid.
As I said, it does not mean it has no value. The value can be many things including but not limited to a moment of happiness when getting a certain character.
I do not have an opinion on if spending a certain amount is worth it, because that is a personal call to every single player. I am simply arguing that when one reaches vip 13/14 one is considered a whale in the eyes of the game company. But we all have different budgets and so the scale of when one feels they are a whale is not the same as when a game company might think of you as a whale.
You aren't doing anything illegal until a streaming and digital media service ceases to exist after which you are required by law and contract to destroy all copies. Your license to use the works only exists as long as they have their license.
You agreed to these terms when you joined the service. Amazon has the same terms on their streaming service, however the exception to that rule is when you purchase the physical media with it with their 'auto-rip' service. There are several other examples of this. What's interesting is Amazon's subsidiary (formerly independent) Audible does NOT have this limitation in their TOS, but may be implied depending on their contracts with folks like Simon and Shuster.
Now not saying you cannot violate these without much retribution or cost, as normal individuals don't get data audits -- however, that does not change the legal status of the situation.
Yup, I know you mentioned a couple of times that you don't argue that it has no value, but there were also implications made in other parts of your comments that spending any sort of money on a digitally fleeting form of entertainment was a fool's errand. Hey, I'm sure that's not how you meant it, because from your forum status, I'm sure you must've spent some money on the game yourself? No judgement whatsoever here, just my observation of your comments, me being one of those foolish spenders that have no regrets...
You can have this online victory and then you can msgs me privately and we'll hammer out the legal debate since my opinion is that you are very much wrong but again the strange and unrelated music debate has nothing, I mean NOTHING to do with "When Is One Considered a Whale?".
I am just mesmerized by your relentless iTunes debate.
So, please feel free to msgs me in private and then you can make your case for how my music would ever become illegal. Good luck
Can you please put line breaks in you comment so it is easier to read?
So you just put words in my mouth that I did not use "foolish", "fools errant" and more words with foolish.
I never use foolish so please do not say I did.
A whale has nothing to do with foolishness, worthlessness or regret. It is about how a gaming company looks at YOU. You are a whale because you are willing to pay 10 of 50 bucks easy on a free to play game. This does not make you a bad person it just puts you in a box.
I am in the same box so I'm not sure why you take this as an insult... it's just understanding that you and I spend more on this "free to play" game than the average person does.
(She says, as someone with no Netflix and fifteen shelves full of dvds.)
It’s like watching an Orca Killer Whale pod against Moby Dick...
Gonna get me some popcorn 🍿 now and save me $10 on a movie ticket because this is far more entertaining and then I can use than money to buy a $10 for 10 pack which will net me 6800 honour with all the 3x immortalized beholds...
Wow... a small mention of large cetaceans sure rubs some nerves. I love the whales... watched then breech on the par 3 at Kapalua in Maui last year... and in STT they keep DB employees in work and the servers on.
Tip of the hat to the whales... with all sincerity. You may kick my butt at events but I’m cool with that. Spend your money any way you want as long as it doesn’t burn the kids college fund or milk money...
1) Its pertinent as you were making statements on things that cease to have value once a service, i.e. this game, disappear. The impermanence is something that is the world that we live in, as well as the perpetual ownership of the corporate sponsor or the actual artist if 'purchased' directly.
2) It's not your music. You've purchased licensing to access said music. That's the changes in the digital media environment. It's a revocable license as well, as the vendor can revoke not only your access but your license to possess any copy of said media.
Go ahead and invite it private so things can go all non-TOS or some such. It does not change how the intellectual property landscape has changed, not whether purchases of entertainment on a streaming services vs this game vs other venues are any more ethereal from a legal standpoint.
My kid doesn’t have diapers but I got my fifth star for Mirror T’Pol. (I feel the need to say that yes, of course this was a joke and not reality)
"the vendor can revoke not only your access but your license to possess any copy of said media"
This is an absolutely untrue statement.
Please feel free to find any "real" (this means real legal and not iTunes TOU) legal standing that would support this.
I understand that you want to drag this out in public but I'll end here and leave what ever last word to you.
My understanding of the current state of digital copyright is similar to yours. Kind of why I still buy blu rays and CDs and rip them onto my iPhone, computer and car SD cards... the legal difference between buying a physical disc (or tapes or vinyl in the old days) is substantially different than current streaming and digital media platforms. If you want to see the difference, just look up Microsoft’s Groove music which dies this month.
The implications in reality are another story as it seems massively remote that anyone get prosecuted for having downloaded Groove music and keep using it after it dies. The same can be said about illegally downloaded music as well.
So the practical difference is virtually nil but the legal difference is substantial. I don’t trust any of these guys because I’ve seen enough “they’re too big too go bankrupt” companies go bust. Like to just store my discs and rip... which probably makes me a fossil... and if I make VIP 14, I’ll be a fossilized whale that can be put in the museum...
I forgot about diapers (or nappies if you prefer)... it’s been 15 years since I had to buy those buggers... but they are just about the only thing that Costco sized portions is NOT sufficient because somehow a 10lb baby can produce 10 tonnes or bodily waste a day...
But my 5* for DA McCoy must wait because second semester university tuition bills just came in... so once again I will get my derrière kicked in the upcoming event by large aquatic cetaceans...
I know the feeling. If I put some effort in, I can sometimes just break top 2500, but that's about my limit. What's your usual placing?
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2012/sep/03/do-you-own-your-digital-content
Incidentally calling the EULA/TOS for iTunes as non-legit is essentially stating that your contract with them is something you lied about agreeing to when you joined the service. Not sound legal ground from a civil standpoint.
To Paunds standpoint: I've been present for several software audits that turned up illegally stored music that led to some folks landing in hot water. Noone goes out of their way to go after folks who are storing or distributing anymore, as it gets too much social media and public backfire, but if you're caught during some other process... it usually is not pretty.
Hopefully most folks don't store their music at work.
Was this the whole thing started by the Napster/Metallica feud? Where for 10 years Metallica was all like “down with corporations” and “big business sells us out! We want our music heard by anyone who wants it!!!” Then they sued Napster for letting anyone have their music who wants it?