But I'm not seeing 'good weeks' like Penguin Jim. I had a good voyage yesterday with 5 super-rares, the best I've had since I went on my 20 hour voyage. I went 12-14 hours to get that.
Most weeks I just get a super-rare or two, and I run 7 1/2 hour voyages almost constantly.
It's been an excellent week for me, no doubt about it. A typical good week might be four or five super-rares across ~12 Voyages. Typically followed by a week of zero!
But here's a little trick that I hadn't wanted to suggest before, because it sounds completely ridiculous - but then, what do you have to lose? Are you renaming your ship every time at the start of every Voyage? I didn't bother for the first few months, until well after the nerf. And then, I remember, the very first time I did that, I got two super-rares from the Voyage. Then immediately after, I did it again - BAM - another super-rare. And since then... well, it's been hit-or-miss, obviously! But it's also ever-so-slightly diverting to try to think of a good ship name each time - and never the same name twice, naturally.
Complete superstition and complete codswallop. Try it!
Those of you acting like committee members for a graduate research program asking for "statistics" and "data" need to get real. At the end of the day we all play this game and drop comments on this forum but this is not a research project for us. We report what we observe and what we don't. We do not have T test, chi squared, or F test statistics to back our claims because we are posting in a forum about a game not publishing in a peer reviewed journal. The above post by Travis is the typical voyage that I have seen for months where it goes beyond 6 hours and picks up one maybe no 3*s. When you spend months seeing screens like the one Travis just put up and then say "hey what happened to all the 4*s I use to get?" that is not a "feeling" or "rose tinted glasses" that is the reality of what you are observing. Am I going to screen capture each voyage and document every item received and then plot graphs of the data and compare trends over months? No because I am not working on a graduate study in STT, I am playing a phone game I enjoy. Those of you who think because voyages are free we don't deserve 4* cards...I would say this...if you are running a voyage with all FF/FE 5* cards (which you spent literally hundreds of dollars) on a maxed 5* ship, you deserve for those cards to shine and return something beyond 120 honor and sniper Reed (see above). So please Shan, Pebble please see my post above for the compromise I am suggesting.
Wow, you just hit he nail on the head. All this condescending statistics snobbery is supposed to ridicule our observations that quite undeniably we are witnessing worsening results from our voyages....
We know this game intimately and too many people are witnessing exactly the same phenomenon for this to be simply brushed aside by ‘lack of data’.
So, let me get this straight... Someone comes to a forum and makes a claim, provides no evidence and you expect to be believed? Why post at all? There is an onus on a complainant to prove their claim, if they can't they, are wasting their breath and everyone else's time.
This is not a process that is reserved for graduate students, it is what the world should be. If you're not prepared to do the work, then prepare to be just another anecdote and to be treated as such. This is not to say that what you are claiming might not be true, it's always possible, but if you want to convince anyone else you need to put in the legwork.
As an aside, I get 4*s pretty regularly, so I don't think there is a problem myself. Icheb is up to 3*s from zero since he was put into Voyages. Some of that came from dilemmas, some from random drops. I almost always hit 8hr voyages, so I probably spend 3hrs per day on average in the zone where 4*s can drop and I have a slightly higher chance of getting a 4* on the 4th dilemma on average, so I would expect ot get more 4*s than someone recalling a voyage before then.
Voyages *have* been nerfed, they no longer provide the chrons they did, and that's why I very rarely extend. And because I am not extending I would expect that on average I will see less 4*s, so getting a few a week seems reasonable. 4*s aren't worth spending any dilithium on in my opinon because we get them free all of the time.
Convinced? (Probably not, so why do you expect us to be convinced by your anecdotal claims?)
If your observatuons are so obvious, then statistics would only enchance your arguments and would, in fact , make them incontrovertible.
I have gotten no less than 10 4*s fron voyages this past month including 3 in one earluer this week. Lots of others from my fleet have had similar observations. But, if we are saying your personal observations are valid, then that of my fleet are to.
How do you reconcile those observational differences? Statistics.
Edit: the "shuttle failure rate" crowd was in the conspiracy theorist camp until they started tracking things. Now, they have actual numbers that they can point to that DB is welcome to ignore or do something to fix the, obvious, problem.
The difference, here, is there is no promised "success rate" for 4*s like there is for a shuttle mission. You just get what you get. Even if we were able to show a marketable drop...so what? You were never primised a certain drop rate, nor are you entitled to it. You end up sounding like the crew slot beggars who feel entitled to something just for showing up.
I'm fairly new F2P player. My account is about month and a half old. About two weeks ago I reached a point I can consistently send 4 hours long voyages and I have two observations.
1. My voyages are significantly less efficient regarding character rewards comapring to players that can send voyages longer than 6 hours. Number of green and blue characters I get is more less the same but their usefulness is, let's just say... questionable. What really suprise me I keep getting blue characters I have already ff. It's very odd because I have very little such characters considering how many of them exists. In my opinion this is not pure RNG issue. It's probably induced in some way.
2. Number of replicator rations I get is most of the time pretty proportional to the rate I use them. If I use many rations I probably get many of them from my voyage, most of the time.
If your observatuons are so obvious, then statistics would only enchance your arguments and would, in fact , make them incontrovertible.
I have gotten no less than 10 4*s fron voyages this past month including 3 in one earluer this week. Lots of others from my fleet have had similar observations. But, if we are saying your personal observations are valid, then that of my fleet are to.
How do you reconcile those observational differences? Statistics.
Edit: the "shuttle failure rate" crowd was in the conspiracy theorist camp until they started tracking things. Now, they have actual numbers that they can point to that DB is welcome to ignore or do something to fix the, obvious, problem.
The difference, here, is there is no promised "success rate" for 4*s like there is for a shuttle mission. You just get what you get. Even if we were able to show a marketable drop...so what? You were never primised a certain drop rate, nor are you entitled to it. You end up sounding like the crew slot beggars who feel entitled to something just for showing up.
Haha Peach 🍑 I am a crew slot begger and proudly so. The major slot shortage is *Chocolate Cronut*.
This thread again? So there are two camps of people
1. Those that believe voyages have been nerfed for months and the returns are continually diminishing. Those people state the facts of what they have observed and are usually flagged as spam
2. Those that adamantly insist that voyages are a treasure-trove of 4* cards and replicator rations. Those same people insist the people in group 1 have simply suffered months of RNG bad luck and then flag their post as spam.
You forgot the group of players that use poor strategy in game and then blame the game for their lack of success.
Its easy to shout conspiracy. Do you see me pitching a fit that I don't have a single Caretaker? Its pretty unfair that some players have gotten 6 of him whilst I have nothing. I blame DB for this calamity.
This thread again? So there are two camps of people
1. Those that believe voyages have been nerfed for months and the returns are continually diminishing. Those people state the facts of what they have observed and are usually flagged as spam
2. Those that adamantly insist that voyages are a treasure-trove of 4* cards and replicator rations. Those same people insist the people in group 1 have simply suffered months of RNG bad luck and then flag their post as spam.
You forgot the group of players that use poor strategy in game and then blame the game for their lack of success.
Its easy to shout conspiracy. Do you see me pitching a fit that I don't have a single Caretaker? Its pretty unfair that some players have gotten 6 of him whilst I have nothing. I blame DB for this calamity.
Strangely, sometimes, I'll be in a thread where someone's complaining about how many aspects of this game are run on RNG... and then switch to another thread and they mention how many Caretakers they have.
This thread again? So there are two camps of people
1. Those that believe voyages have been nerfed for months and the returns are continually diminishing. Those people state the facts of what they have observed and are usually flagged as spam
2. Those that adamantly insist that voyages are a treasure-trove of 4* cards and replicator rations. Those same people insist the people in group 1 have simply suffered months of RNG bad luck and then flag their post as spam.
You forgot the group of players that use poor strategy in game and then blame the game for their lack of success.
Its easy to shout conspiracy. Do you see me pitching a fit that I don't have a single Caretaker? Its pretty unfair that some players have gotten 6 of him whilst I have nothing. I blame DB for this calamity.
Strangely, sometimes, I'll be in a thread where someone's complaining about how many aspects of this game are run on RNG... and then switch to another thread and they mention how many Caretakers they have.
It's always more than I have. (:
Conclusion seems to be obvious. You must be that "bad strategist" kind of player... or am I wrong? :-)
This thread again? So there are two camps of people
1. Those that believe voyages have been nerfed for months and the returns are continually diminishing. Those people state the facts of what they have observed and are usually flagged as spam
2. Those that adamantly insist that voyages are a treasure-trove of 4* cards and replicator rations. Those same people insist the people in group 1 have simply suffered months of RNG bad luck and then flag their post as spam.
You forgot the group of players that use poor strategy in game and then blame the game for their lack of success.
Its easy to shout conspiracy. Do you see me pitching a fit that I don't have a single Caretaker? Its pretty unfair that some players have gotten 6 of him whilst I have nothing. I blame DB for this calamity.
"I blame DB for this calamity." As it should be. This or you must be a very bad strategist. ;-)
This thread again? So there are two camps of people
1. Those that believe voyages have been nerfed for months and the returns are continually diminishing. Those people state the facts of what they have observed and are usually flagged as spam
2. Those that adamantly insist that voyages are a treasure-trove of 4* cards and replicator rations. Those same people insist the people in group 1 have simply suffered months of RNG bad luck and then flag their post as spam.
You forgot the group of players that use poor strategy in game and then blame the game for their lack of success.
Its easy to shout conspiracy. Do you see me pitching a fit that I don't have a single Caretaker? Its pretty unfair that some players have gotten 6 of him whilst I have nothing. I blame DB for this calamity.
Strangely, sometimes, I'll be in a thread where someone's complaining about how many aspects of this game are run on RNG... and then switch to another thread and they mention how many Caretakers they have.
It's always more than I have. (:
Conclusion seems to be obvious. You must be that "bad strategist" kind of player... or am I wrong? :-)
I might be. I don't think I am, I know others who don't seem to think I am. But I'm not conceited enough to sit here and tell you that my way is the best way or even a way that would work for you, your lifestyle, and your gaming lifestyle. My way of playing this game is a careful balance of having fun and making smart decisions. (: Some people prioritize different smart decisions. For example, passing up their favorite character in a behold. I try not to do that.
But I actually meant that in these threads where people are ragging on an aspect of the game like this, they neglect to acknowledge that while maybe they're having bad RNG in one area, they've gotten some good RNG in other areas.
My point is, so many of these things are genuinely RNG driven. It's easy to find patterns and accuse it of being biased, and neglect the data points where you had a fabulous run of luck.
I understand. So I am not allowed to report simple observations to people, nor is anyone else unless we have statistics to back up our observations.....perfectly reasonable.
As per your comment about people saying that voyages are nerfed because they’re using poor strategy.
———————
No Caretaker yet? Sounds like poor strategy. If you need advice you are welcome to ask, since everyone in my fleet has him already.
As for voyages. This is a game, enjoy it. If people who play daily and understand the game intimately feel they’re receiving less, you can bet they’re right.
If some people put their time into statistical analysis and feel that gives them a platform to discredit others.... well, perhaps until those statistically inclined individuals can prove something to the contrary, they should respect everyone’s right to have an honest opinion about their gaming experience. Something about those condescending and disdainful comments doesn’t seem right.
This thread again? So there are two camps of people
1. Those that believe voyages have been nerfed for months and the returns are continually diminishing. Those people state the facts of what they have observed and are usually flagged as spam
2. Those that adamantly insist that voyages are a treasure-trove of 4* cards and replicator rations. Those same people insist the people in group 1 have simply suffered months of RNG bad luck and then flag their post as spam.
You forgot the group of players that use poor strategy in game and then blame the game for their lack of success.
Its easy to shout conspiracy. Do you see me pitching a fit that I don't have a single Caretaker? Its pretty unfair that some players have gotten 6 of him whilst I have nothing. I blame DB for this calamity.
Strangely, sometimes, I'll be in a thread where someone's complaining about how many aspects of this game are run on RNG... and then switch to another thread and they mention how many Caretakers they have.
It's always more than I have. (:
Conclusion seems to be obvious. You must be that "bad strategist" kind of player... or am I wrong? :-)
I might be. I don't think I am, I know others who don't seem to think I am. But I'm not conceited enough to sit here and tell you that my way is the best way or even a way that would work for you, your lifestyle, and your gaming lifestyle. My way of playing this game is a careful balance of having fun and making smart decisions. (: Some people prioritize different smart decisions. For example, passing up their favorite character in a behold. I try not to do that.
But I actually meant that in these threads where people are ragging on an aspect of the game like this, they neglect to acknowledge that while maybe they're having bad RNG in one area, they've gotten some good RNG in other areas.
My point is, so many of these things are genuinely RNG driven. It's easy to find patterns and accuse it of being biased, and neglect the data points where you had a fabulous run of luck.
And my point is that making RNG the only driving force is a very bad designing choice. Get rid of this illogical choice and you will ease the pain. It's so simple.
First of all I would like to acknowledge a fleet that I have recently become aware of Section 14. It's officers are amazing, and to know them is to love them and to love them is to know them. Sir Maniac commands the fleet with elegance and grace, he truly is amazing. Everyone in that fleet which I am not a part of (sample size 50) has noticed a steady decline in rewards from voyages. If it was just RNG bad luck it would be statistically unlikely to effect all 50 people within the same fleet around the same time and for a steady duration until present. So there we have a sample size of 50 people at least all experiencing the same difficulty. There is your statistics.
Conclusion seems to be obvious. You must be that "bad strategist" kind of player... or am I wrong? :-)
Obviously.
I spent good money getting a nice collection of event 4*'s. I thawed out Warship Chakotay for my current gauntlet because he has the Hunter trait. For someone reason, its not paying off I can't figure out why. Its really annoying.
Those of you acting like committee members for a graduate research program asking for "statistics" and "data" need to get real. At the end of the day we all play this game and drop comments on this forum but this is not a research project for us. We report what we observe and what we don't. We do not have T test, chi squared, or F test statistics to back our claims because we are posting in a forum about a game not publishing in a peer reviewed journal. The above post by Travis is the typical voyage that I have seen for months where it goes beyond 6 hours and picks up one maybe no 3*s. When you spend months seeing screens like the one Travis just put up and then say "hey what happened to all the 4*s I use to get?" that is not a "feeling" or "rose tinted glasses" that is the reality of what you are observing. Am I going to screen capture each voyage and document every item received and then plot graphs of the data and compare trends over months? No because I am not working on a graduate study in STT, I am playing a phone game I enjoy. Those of you who think because voyages are free we don't deserve 4* cards...I would say this...if you are running a voyage with all FF/FE 5* cards (which you spent literally hundreds of dollars) on a maxed 5* ship, you deserve for those cards to shine and return something beyond 120 honor and sniper Reed (see above). So please Shan, Pebble please see my post above for the compromise I am suggesting.
Wow, you just hit he nail on the head. All this condescending statistics snobbery is supposed to ridicule our observations that quite undeniably we are witnessing worsening results from our voyages....
We know this game intimately and too many people are witnessing exactly the same phenomenon for this to be simply brushed aside by ‘lack of data’.
The two of you sound like anti-vaccine advocates, seriously. “We don’t need evidence, we know what we see and anyone who says otherwise is a shill!” It’s getting embarrassing.
Extreme claims (DB has secretly nerfed Voyages again in a grab for more money) require extreme proof. You cannot provide that because even though we can collect a lot of good data now, collecting more pre-nerf data is impossible. What we can do now is look at the claims that “rep rats never drop” or “4* crew never drop” and determine if they are true or if it is as the rest of us have noticed and that voyages seem to have a random pre-determined focus on one kind of rewards that changes from voyage to voyage.
Although it is purely anecdotal, I recall seeing some voyages where I got nearly 100 each of blue and purple rep rats and others where I barely hit double digits (for reference, my voyages are usually in the 6.5-7.5 hour range with refills only when I can’t recall due to work or forgetfulness). Likewise for trainers, chrons (anywhere from 300-500), and 3*/4* crew (none to a half dozen). I’m sure there is some variability in items as well but I rarely look at components and equipment when I claim my rewards.
If we collect enough data on our voyages we will be able to eventually say with confidence that we understand how voyages are programmed. Until then, we just can’t make claims one way or the other...this shouldn’t be hard to understand.
If we collect enough data on our voyages we will be able to eventually say with confidence that we understand how voyages are programmed. Until then, we just can’t make claims one way or the other...this shouldn’t be hard to understand.
Please specify desired amount of voyages and sample that will be according to you relevant to take in consideration as valid proof.
Take in consideration that no prior data can be collected due to the fact that it is past and noone consider to collect this data in order to proof validity of claim.
Further more that can be taken as proof ( cause no earlier data is avalible ) that there is no changes but then...if it is main goal to dissmis claims about lazy voyages and reduced item and crew procentage drop rate why constantly searching for statistic? Please clarify your demand and as said....time frame and sample, I will take effort to aquire enough input data. That beeing said, disbelieveing claims of players and constantly asking for statistic is more retorical in nature and asked from persons that have need to justify the current state of voyages.
The last is 1st year psyhology student material - retorical issues, claims and...
I do appologize if someone feels hurt by fact that I stated my point of wiew and clearly disclose attemps that are asking the impossible to dissmis arguments of same.
If we collect enough data on our voyages we will be able to eventually say with confidence that we understand how voyages are programmed. Until then, we just can’t make claims one way or the other...this shouldn’t be hard to understand.
Please specify desired amount of voyages and sample that will be according to you relevant to take in consideration as valid proof.
Take in consideration that no prior data can be collected due to the fact that it is past and noone consider to collect this data in order to proof validity of claim.
Further more that can be taken as proof ( cause no earlier data is avalible ) that there is no changes but then...if it is main goal to dissmis claims about lauzy voyages and reduced item and crew procentage why constantly searching for statistic? Please clarify your demand and as said....time frame and sample, I will take effort to aquire enough input data.
I would say when the user-derived formula for voyage drops is robust enough that nobody complains about their voyage rewards not making sense, but this is the Internet...someone will always complain.
Coming from a Quality background in RL, I would say a 90% confidence interval in our results would make me happy for our purposes. As for how many voyages it will take to reach that level, I don’t know - just like I didn’t know how many photos I would need one time at my last job to fulfill the required confidence interval on an ASTM E562 Volume Fraction By Manual Point Count analysis on the ferrite percentage in a grade 4A duplex stainless steel...we thought it was around 50 and it ended up being 71. Oops.
Those of you acting like committee members for a graduate research program asking for "statistics" and "data" need to get real. At the end of the day we all play this game and drop comments on this forum but this is not a research project for us. We report what we observe and what we don't. We do not have T test, chi squared, or F test statistics to back our claims because we are posting in a forum about a game not publishing in a peer reviewed journal. The above post by Travis is the typical voyage that I have seen for months where it goes beyond 6 hours and picks up one maybe no 3*s. When you spend months seeing screens like the one Travis just put up and then say "hey what happened to all the 4*s I use to get?" that is not a "feeling" or "rose tinted glasses" that is the reality of what you are observing. Am I going to screen capture each voyage and document every item received and then plot graphs of the data and compare trends over months? No because I am not working on a graduate study in STT, I am playing a phone game I enjoy. Those of you who think because voyages are free we don't deserve 4* cards...I would say this...if you are running a voyage with all FF/FE 5* cards (which you spent literally hundreds of dollars) on a maxed 5* ship, you deserve for those cards to shine and return something beyond 120 honor and sniper Reed (see above). So please Shan, Pebble please see my post above for the compromise I am suggesting.
Wow, you just hit he nail on the head. All this condescending statistics snobbery is supposed to ridicule our observations that quite undeniably we are witnessing worsening results from our voyages....
We know this game intimately and too many people are witnessing exactly the same phenomenon for this to be simply brushed aside by ‘lack of data’.
The two of you sound like anti-vaccine advocates, seriously. “We don’t need evidence, we know what we see and anyone who says otherwise is a shill!” It’s getting embarrassing.
Extreme claims (DB has secretly nerfed Voyages again in a grab for more money) require extreme proof. You cannot provide that because even though we can collect a lot of good data now, collecting more pre-nerf data is impossible. What we can do now is look at the claims that “rep rats never drop” or “4* crew never drop” and determine if they are true or if it is as the rest of us have noticed and that voyages seem to have a random pre-determined focus on one kind of rewards that changes from voyage to voyage.
Although it is purely anecdotal, I recall seeing some voyages where I got nearly 100 each of blue and purple rep rats and others where I barely hit double digits (for reference, my voyages are usually in the 6.5-7.5 hour range with refills only when I can’t recall due to work or forgetfulness). Likewise for trainers, chrons (anywhere from 300-500), and 3*/4* crew (none to a half dozen). I’m sure there is some variability in items as well but I rarely look at components and equipment when I claim my rewards.
If we collect enough data on our voyages we will be able to eventually say with confidence that we understand how voyages are programmed. Until then, we just can’t make claims one way or the other...this shouldn’t be hard to understand.
AKA only a statistical analyst is allowed to have an opinion on the forum of this game. I have no problem with self-proclaimed statisticians stating the same thing repetitively, and I’d love to see some stats on this phenomenon. However, it’s not going to happen because collecting the data is almost impossible, getting a broad enough sample is problematic and labour intensive.... nobody is likely going to do that....
So what do we have? We have our previous experiences to relate to and compare the current situation with. We then have other gamers’ experiences to compare our experiences to. Yes, this is a rudimentary way of getting a grasp on matters, but it is more than the stat-lovers have compiled thus far.
If you’re passionate enough to create disparaging analogies of anti-vac maniacs etc, perhaps you could commence data collection and analyze this phenomenon so your retorts hence forth would have the said statistical proof, rather than a negative quip.
As it stands nobody can unequivocally say for sure whether or not voyages have been re-nerfed... but people are free to share their experiences. By the way I love this game, and I’m not complaining at all. I also run voyages daily and extend them once per day... but I have personally noticed 4* crew drops and rep rations reduced in frequency. That’s not complaining, or whining... just agreeing with the OP.
Coming from a Quality background in RL, I would say a 90% confidence interval in our results would make me happy for our purposes. As for how many voyages it will take to reach that level, I don’t know - just like I didn’t know how many photos I would need one time at my last job to fulfill the required confidence interval on an ASTM E562 Volume Fraction By Manual Point Count analysis on the ferrite percentage in a grade 4A duplex stainless steel...we thought it was around 50 and it ended up being 71. Oops.
Interesanting. So asking for statisticly mathematical proof but unable to give input amount that will be recoknized as valid later....under such circumstances is hard to take demand for statisticly correct calculations - made in good will and desire to see inpartial objective data in order to reach correct conslusion based on facts.
PS. Even in voyage estimator as in all programs that calculate something, input data must be entered in order to get a result. For instance in part of code that regulating voyages - item drops, crew drops, replicator ration drops, credit drops values are inputed or directly in code itself or over CMS like in voyage estimator - crew drop 10%, item drop 20%, credit 5%....of course that can go to specific subcategories and some categories are excluded completly, for instance legendary crew.
Salutations!
First of all I would like to acknowledge a fleet that I have recently become aware of Section 14. It's officers are amazing, and to know them is to love them and to love them is to know them. Sir Maniac commands the fleet with elegance and grace, he truly is amazing. Everyone in that fleet which I am not a part of (sample size 50) has noticed a steady decline in rewards from voyages. If it was just RNG bad luck it would be statistically unlikely to effect all 50 people within the same fleet around the same time and for a steady duration until present. So there we have a sample size of 50 people at least all experiencing the same difficulty. There is your statistics.
Might I see the 50 questionnaires themselves, if you don't mind?
I had too two bad weeks now with only 2* and some 3* and all my voyages are longer as 8h. But to say they have nerfed it - I dont know , maybe they have. And even if they have done it, it doesnt matter to me, its only a game - if I would get mad about that I would leave the game.
The call after statistics is a bad call too - all statistics are only good for the one who has made them, nothing is easier then to make fake statistics........
I had too two bad weeks now with only 2* and some 3* and all my voyages are longer as 8h. But to say they have nerfed it - I dont know , maybe they have. And even if they have done it, it doesnt matter to me, its only a game - if I would get mad about that I would leave the game.
The call after statistics is a bad call too - all statistics are only good for the one who has made them, nothing is easier then to make fake statistics........
But... but... our air IS poisonous because in a random global sample of one million deaths over the past year, all (100%) of the deceased were proven to have breathed the moments prior to death...
The call after statistics is a bad call too - all statistics are only good for the one who has made them, nothing is easier then to make fake statistics........
Stats are better than everyone saying their version of reality is better than everyone else's.
In any event, Voyages are still worth it. They're easy, have trivial time demands and give you good loot. Some Voyages are disappointing. Its not a big deal.
My most recent Voyage was "lucky". I got 4 common dilemma's but two of those gave me 3*'s. But I still only got 3x 3*'s in total. Better than a kick in the teeth.
First of all I would like to acknowledge a fleet that I have recently become aware of Section 14. It's officers are amazing, and to know them is to love them and to love them is to know them. Sir Maniac commands the fleet with elegance and grace, he truly is amazing. Everyone in that fleet which I am not a part of (sample size 50) has noticed a steady decline in rewards from voyages. If it was just RNG bad luck it would be statistically unlikely to effect all 50 people within the same fleet around the same time and for a steady duration until present. So there we have a sample size of 50 people at least all experiencing the same difficulty. There is your statistics.
Might I see the 50 questionnaires themselves, if you don't mind?
It's in our group chat. The poll has our displeasure about voyage returns and had a lot of obscenities about people in this forum demanding stats so it isn't appropriate to post here according to community guidelines. Bri you're in that fleet back me up here.
First of all I would like to acknowledge a fleet that I have recently become aware of Section 14. It's officers are amazing, and to know them is to love them and to love them is to know them. Sir Maniac commands the fleet with elegance and grace, he truly is amazing. Everyone in that fleet which I am not a part of (sample size 50) has noticed a steady decline in rewards from voyages. If it was just RNG bad luck it would be statistically unlikely to effect all 50 people within the same fleet around the same time and for a steady duration until present. So there we have a sample size of 50 people at least all experiencing the same difficulty. There is your statistics.
Might I see the 50 questionnaires themselves, if you don't mind?
It's in our group chat. The poll has our displeasure about voyage returns and had a lot of obscenities about people in this forum demanding stats so it isn't appropriate to post here according to community guidelines. Bri you're in that fleet back me up here.
True story. And it’s not just our fleet... friends in other fleets are saying exactly the same thing...
Comments
It's been an excellent week for me, no doubt about it. A typical good week might be four or five super-rares across ~12 Voyages. Typically followed by a week of zero!
But here's a little trick that I hadn't wanted to suggest before, because it sounds completely ridiculous - but then, what do you have to lose? Are you renaming your ship every time at the start of every Voyage? I didn't bother for the first few months, until well after the nerf. And then, I remember, the very first time I did that, I got two super-rares from the Voyage. Then immediately after, I did it again - BAM - another super-rare. And since then... well, it's been hit-or-miss, obviously! But it's also ever-so-slightly diverting to try to think of a good ship name each time - and never the same name twice, naturally.
Complete superstition and complete codswallop. Try it!
So, let me get this straight... Someone comes to a forum and makes a claim, provides no evidence and you expect to be believed? Why post at all? There is an onus on a complainant to prove their claim, if they can't they, are wasting their breath and everyone else's time.
This is not a process that is reserved for graduate students, it is what the world should be. If you're not prepared to do the work, then prepare to be just another anecdote and to be treated as such. This is not to say that what you are claiming might not be true, it's always possible, but if you want to convince anyone else you need to put in the legwork.
As an aside, I get 4*s pretty regularly, so I don't think there is a problem myself. Icheb is up to 3*s from zero since he was put into Voyages. Some of that came from dilemmas, some from random drops. I almost always hit 8hr voyages, so I probably spend 3hrs per day on average in the zone where 4*s can drop and I have a slightly higher chance of getting a 4* on the 4th dilemma on average, so I would expect ot get more 4*s than someone recalling a voyage before then.
Voyages *have* been nerfed, they no longer provide the chrons they did, and that's why I very rarely extend. And because I am not extending I would expect that on average I will see less 4*s, so getting a few a week seems reasonable. 4*s aren't worth spending any dilithium on in my opinon because we get them free all of the time.
Convinced? (Probably not, so why do you expect us to be convinced by your anecdotal claims?)
I have gotten no less than 10 4*s fron voyages this past month including 3 in one earluer this week. Lots of others from my fleet have had similar observations. But, if we are saying your personal observations are valid, then that of my fleet are to.
How do you reconcile those observational differences? Statistics.
Edit: the "shuttle failure rate" crowd was in the conspiracy theorist camp until they started tracking things. Now, they have actual numbers that they can point to that DB is welcome to ignore or do something to fix the, obvious, problem.
The difference, here, is there is no promised "success rate" for 4*s like there is for a shuttle mission. You just get what you get. Even if we were able to show a marketable drop...so what? You were never primised a certain drop rate, nor are you entitled to it. You end up sounding like the crew slot beggars who feel entitled to something just for showing up.
1. My voyages are significantly less efficient regarding character rewards comapring to players that can send voyages longer than 6 hours. Number of green and blue characters I get is more less the same but their usefulness is, let's just say... questionable. What really suprise me I keep getting blue characters I have already ff. It's very odd because I have very little such characters considering how many of them exists. In my opinion this is not pure RNG issue. It's probably induced in some way.
2. Number of replicator rations I get is most of the time pretty proportional to the rate I use them. If I use many rations I probably get many of them from my voyage, most of the time.
Haha Peach 🍑 I am a crew slot begger and proudly so. The major slot shortage is *Chocolate Cronut*.
... but a few days ago I got my first copy of (the previously elusive) Jazz Musician Riker when the following happened:
You forgot the group of players that use poor strategy in game and then blame the game for their lack of success.
Its easy to shout conspiracy. Do you see me pitching a fit that I don't have a single Caretaker? Its pretty unfair that some players have gotten 6 of him whilst I have nothing. I blame DB for this calamity.
Strangely, sometimes, I'll be in a thread where someone's complaining about how many aspects of this game are run on RNG... and then switch to another thread and they mention how many Caretakers they have.
It's always more than I have. (:
Conclusion seems to be obvious. You must be that "bad strategist" kind of player... or am I wrong? :-)
"I blame DB for this calamity." As it should be. This or you must be a very bad strategist. ;-)
I might be. I don't think I am, I know others who don't seem to think I am. But I'm not conceited enough to sit here and tell you that my way is the best way or even a way that would work for you, your lifestyle, and your gaming lifestyle. My way of playing this game is a careful balance of having fun and making smart decisions. (: Some people prioritize different smart decisions. For example, passing up their favorite character in a behold. I try not to do that.
But I actually meant that in these threads where people are ragging on an aspect of the game like this, they neglect to acknowledge that while maybe they're having bad RNG in one area, they've gotten some good RNG in other areas.
My point is, so many of these things are genuinely RNG driven. It's easy to find patterns and accuse it of being biased, and neglect the data points where you had a fabulous run of luck.
As per your comment about people saying that voyages are nerfed because they’re using poor strategy.
———————
No Caretaker yet? Sounds like poor strategy. If you need advice you are welcome to ask, since everyone in my fleet has him already.
As for voyages. This is a game, enjoy it. If people who play daily and understand the game intimately feel they’re receiving less, you can bet they’re right.
If some people put their time into statistical analysis and feel that gives them a platform to discredit others.... well, perhaps until those statistically inclined individuals can prove something to the contrary, they should respect everyone’s right to have an honest opinion about their gaming experience. Something about those condescending and disdainful comments doesn’t seem right.
And my point is that making RNG the only driving force is a very bad designing choice. Get rid of this illogical choice and you will ease the pain. It's so simple.
Obviously.
I spent good money getting a nice collection of event 4*'s. I thawed out Warship Chakotay for my current gauntlet because he has the Hunter trait. For someone reason, its not paying off I can't figure out why. Its really annoying.
The two of you sound like anti-vaccine advocates, seriously. “We don’t need evidence, we know what we see and anyone who says otherwise is a shill!” It’s getting embarrassing.
Extreme claims (DB has secretly nerfed Voyages again in a grab for more money) require extreme proof. You cannot provide that because even though we can collect a lot of good data now, collecting more pre-nerf data is impossible. What we can do now is look at the claims that “rep rats never drop” or “4* crew never drop” and determine if they are true or if it is as the rest of us have noticed and that voyages seem to have a random pre-determined focus on one kind of rewards that changes from voyage to voyage.
Although it is purely anecdotal, I recall seeing some voyages where I got nearly 100 each of blue and purple rep rats and others where I barely hit double digits (for reference, my voyages are usually in the 6.5-7.5 hour range with refills only when I can’t recall due to work or forgetfulness). Likewise for trainers, chrons (anywhere from 300-500), and 3*/4* crew (none to a half dozen). I’m sure there is some variability in items as well but I rarely look at components and equipment when I claim my rewards.
If we collect enough data on our voyages we will be able to eventually say with confidence that we understand how voyages are programmed. Until then, we just can’t make claims one way or the other...this shouldn’t be hard to understand.
Please specify desired amount of voyages and sample that will be according to you relevant to take in consideration as valid proof.
Take in consideration that no prior data can be collected due to the fact that it is past and noone consider to collect this data in order to proof validity of claim.
Further more that can be taken as proof ( cause no earlier data is avalible ) that there is no changes but then...if it is main goal to dissmis claims about lazy voyages and reduced item and crew procentage drop rate why constantly searching for statistic? Please clarify your demand and as said....time frame and sample, I will take effort to aquire enough input data. That beeing said, disbelieveing claims of players and constantly asking for statistic is more retorical in nature and asked from persons that have need to justify the current state of voyages.
The last is 1st year psyhology student material - retorical issues, claims and...
I do appologize if someone feels hurt by fact that I stated my point of wiew and clearly disclose attemps that are asking the impossible to dissmis arguments of same.
Salutations!
I would say when the user-derived formula for voyage drops is robust enough that nobody complains about their voyage rewards not making sense, but this is the Internet...someone will always complain.
Coming from a Quality background in RL, I would say a 90% confidence interval in our results would make me happy for our purposes. As for how many voyages it will take to reach that level, I don’t know - just like I didn’t know how many photos I would need one time at my last job to fulfill the required confidence interval on an ASTM E562 Volume Fraction By Manual Point Count analysis on the ferrite percentage in a grade 4A duplex stainless steel...we thought it was around 50 and it ended up being 71. Oops.
AKA only a statistical analyst is allowed to have an opinion on the forum of this game. I have no problem with self-proclaimed statisticians stating the same thing repetitively, and I’d love to see some stats on this phenomenon. However, it’s not going to happen because collecting the data is almost impossible, getting a broad enough sample is problematic and labour intensive.... nobody is likely going to do that....
So what do we have? We have our previous experiences to relate to and compare the current situation with. We then have other gamers’ experiences to compare our experiences to. Yes, this is a rudimentary way of getting a grasp on matters, but it is more than the stat-lovers have compiled thus far.
If you’re passionate enough to create disparaging analogies of anti-vac maniacs etc, perhaps you could commence data collection and analyze this phenomenon so your retorts hence forth would have the said statistical proof, rather than a negative quip.
As it stands nobody can unequivocally say for sure whether or not voyages have been re-nerfed... but people are free to share their experiences. By the way I love this game, and I’m not complaining at all. I also run voyages daily and extend them once per day... but I have personally noticed 4* crew drops and rep rations reduced in frequency. That’s not complaining, or whining... just agreeing with the OP.
Interesanting. So asking for statisticly mathematical proof but unable to give input amount that will be recoknized as valid later....under such circumstances is hard to take demand for statisticly correct calculations - made in good will and desire to see inpartial objective data in order to reach correct conslusion based on facts.
PS. Even in voyage estimator as in all programs that calculate something, input data must be entered in order to get a result. For instance in part of code that regulating voyages - item drops, crew drops, replicator ration drops, credit drops values are inputed or directly in code itself or over CMS like in voyage estimator - crew drop 10%, item drop 20%, credit 5%....of course that can go to specific subcategories and some categories are excluded completly, for instance legendary crew.
Salutations!
Might I see the 50 questionnaires themselves, if you don't mind?
The call after statistics is a bad call too - all statistics are only good for the one who has made them, nothing is easier then to make fake statistics........
But... but... our air IS poisonous because in a random global sample of one million deaths over the past year, all (100%) of the deceased were proven to have breathed the moments prior to death...
Stats are better than everyone saying their version of reality is better than everyone else's.
In any event, Voyages are still worth it. They're easy, have trivial time demands and give you good loot. Some Voyages are disappointing. Its not a big deal.
My most recent Voyage was "lucky". I got 4 common dilemma's but two of those gave me 3*'s. But I still only got 3x 3*'s in total. Better than a kick in the teeth.
It's in our group chat. The poll has our displeasure about voyage returns and had a lot of obscenities about people in this forum demanding stats so it isn't appropriate to post here according to community guidelines. Bri you're in that fleet back me up here.
True story. And it’s not just our fleet... friends in other fleets are saying exactly the same thing...