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  • Mirror Mirror
    “What's a knockout like you doing in a computer-generated gin joint like this?”

    Proud member of Patterns of Force
    Captain Level 99
    Played since January 2017

    TP: Do better!!!
  • KaiteeKaitee ✭✭✭✭✭
    To clarify, the 1701-A was Kirk's ship; the C-in-C just meant that the Klingons would respect Kirk and the Enterprise more than, say, Sulu and the Excelsior (or Kirk/Excelsior or Sulu/Enterprise). Spock formally assumes command after the arrest of Kirk and McCoy, which tells us that Kirk was the ship's captain. When Spock did that, he moved up the food chain and took Chekov with him.

    Ah, gotcha. Although now that I've got that idea in my head, I kind of like it. I'll have to throw on the movie when I get the chance (can't do that at work, someone would notice) and see if there's anything that outright conflicts with Kirk's assignment being for the mission only.
  • Travis S McClainTravis S McClain ✭✭✭✭✭
    Kaitee wrote: »
    To clarify, the 1701-A was Kirk's ship; the C-in-C just meant that the Klingons would respect Kirk and the Enterprise more than, say, Sulu and the Excelsior (or Kirk/Excelsior or Sulu/Enterprise). Spock formally assumes command after the arrest of Kirk and McCoy, which tells us that Kirk was the ship's captain. When Spock did that, he moved up the food chain and took Chekov with him.

    Ah, gotcha. Although now that I've got that idea in my head, I kind of like it. I'll have to throw on the movie when I get the chance (can't do that at work, someone would notice) and see if there's anything that outright conflicts with Kirk's assignment being for the mission only.

    Kirk was formally assigned the Enterprise-A at the end of IV, and clearly retained it through V, so ceteris paribus, he would still be in command as of VI. There is a clear sense that the Enterprise hadn't been used in awhile under Kirk or anyone else, with the ship as ready for retirement as her senior staff. Kirk teases Scotty about finding the engine room, which the latter says was "right where [he] left it," suggesting it had been awhile since he'd been aboard.

    Valeris explains, "We were told you needed a helmsman, so I volunteered." Sulu had been captain of the Excelsior for three years in the Beta Quadrant by then, per his opening log entry, so if he's who she was replacing, then the Enterprise hadn't been out in all that time.

    Add to this that Spock had been the Federation's Special Envoy for peace talks since the destruction of Praxis "two months ago". It is possible that he did that work as Captain of the Enterprise. But my reading of the situation is that this was done more clandestinely, without involving an entire starship crew.
  • KaiteeKaitee ✭✭✭✭✭
    There is a clear sense that the Enterprise hadn't been used in awhile under Kirk or anyone else, with the ship as ready for retirement as her senior staff. Kirk teases Scotty about finding the engine room, which the latter says was "right where [he] left it," suggesting it had been awhile since he'd been aboard.
    There is that bit about Enterprise having been doing gas anomaly studies though - I mean it seems pretty obvious that Excelsior would be the one to fire that torpedo and they set it up in Sulu's opening captain's log, then it got changed to Enterprise having the torpedo for drama's sake, but however it came to be it happened and we have to live with it. So it's been puttering around doing science at least (maybe just in the backyard, given the ship's age, while Excelsior got to go study the really exciting gas in the Beta Quadrant). Valeris all of a sudden showing up, after Sulu's been gone three years, might just be a matter of them wanting a really good helmswoman in case the Gorkon thing goes sideways - top of her class and all that - whereas while they've just been meandering around poking at clouds they've been letting various rookie ensigns get in some flight time and there's been no need to have an experienced pilot assigned to the roster.
    ceteris paribus
    Totally using that next time I need a Romulan name.
  • Travis S McClainTravis S McClain ✭✭✭✭✭
    Kaitee wrote: »
    There is a clear sense that the Enterprise hadn't been used in awhile under Kirk or anyone else, with the ship as ready for retirement as her senior staff. Kirk teases Scotty about finding the engine room, which the latter says was "right where [he] left it," suggesting it had been awhile since he'd been aboard.
    There is that bit about Enterprise having been doing gas anomaly studies though - I mean it seems pretty obvious that Excelsior would be the one to fire that torpedo and they set it up in Sulu's opening captain's log, then it got changed to Enterprise having the torpedo for drama's sake, but however it came to be it happened and we have to live with it. So it's been puttering around doing science at least (maybe just in the backyard, given the ship's age, while Excelsior got to go study the really exciting gas in the Beta Quadrant). Valeris all of a sudden showing up, after Sulu's been gone three years, might just be a matter of them wanting a really good helmswoman in case the Gorkon thing goes sideways - top of her class and all that - whereas while they've just been meandering around poking at clouds they've been letting various rookie ensigns get in some flight time and there's been no need to have an experienced pilot assigned to the roster.

    Is there any reason why the Enterprise should be carrying special equipment for scientific research during a diplomatic mission? No. Is there any reason why the Chief Medical Officer should assist with equipping a torpedo instead of tending to injured crew members in Sickbay? No. Is that whole plot point contrived? Yes. But it gives Uhura one last contribution, so I'm cool with it.

    I've long been fascinated to envision how it would have felt had they gone through with bringing back Saavik, rather than inventing Valeris. I love Kim Cattrall's performance, so I don't feel cheated. But I do feel like that would have been a more powerful story choice.
  • KaiteeKaitee ✭✭✭✭✭
    I've long been fascinated to envision how it would have felt had they gone through with bringing back Saavik, rather than inventing Valeris. I love Kim Cattrall's performance, so I don't feel cheated. But I do feel like that would have been a more powerful story choice.

    I just love Kim Cattrall generally, but yeah, Valeris isn't what she should be. I mean we get told she's Spock's protege and he thinks she's ready to be Spock 2, but I've never quite been able to feel in that quiet scene between Spock and Kirk (the one where they've 'outlived their usefulness) that he's feeling he's failed as much as Kirk does. He's looking back over his whole career and thinking, man, I was this flawed that whole time and I had no idea, and I just don't really buy that Spock's invested so much in Valeris that his regret would be on the same level.

    No idea if they could've talked Kirstie Alley into it even if the studio had okayed using Saavik anyway though (I just really don't get much from Robin Curtis's version, in my head Saavik is always Kirstie).
    Is there any reason why the Enterprise should be carrying special equipment for scientific research during a diplomatic mission?
    Eh, it doesn't get in the way of me enjoying it, but I have kind of a hobby of un-nitpicking.
  • Travis S McClainTravis S McClain ✭✭✭✭✭
    Kaitee wrote: »
    I've long been fascinated to envision how it would have felt had they gone through with bringing back Saavik, rather than inventing Valeris. I love Kim Cattrall's performance, so I don't feel cheated. But I do feel like that would have been a more powerful story choice.

    I just love Kim Cattrall generally, but yeah, Valeris isn't what she should be. I mean we get told she's Spock's protege and he thinks she's ready to be Spock 2, but I've never quite been able to feel in that quiet scene between Spock and Kirk (the one where they've 'outlived their usefulness) that he's feeling he's failed as much as Kirk does. He's looking back over his whole career and thinking, man, I was this flawed that whole time and I had no idea, and I just don't really buy that Spock's invested so much in Valeris that his regret would be on the same level.

    I do kinda buy the mentor/protege thing, but only because of the aforementioned gap between V and VI during which the Enterprise crew had seemingly been off doing other things for up to three years. I can accept that Spock is invested in Valeris, though not having seen any of her before, I'm not invested in her as I was Saavik.

    Also, I never read it that Valeris was, by herself, what was weighing on Spock. He mentions that Kirk and McCoy had nearly been killed because he had placed them in harm's way by bringing them into the mission. I took that to show that the scope of what was on his mind went beyond Valeris.

    Had the entire peace initiative been an exercise in futility? With a Starfleet admiral, a Romulan ambassador, and even his own Vulcan protege conspiring with Chang to stop it, that's a significant pall cast over everything.
    No idea if they could've talked Kirstie Alley into it even if the studio had okayed using Saavik anyway though (I just really don't get much from Robin Curtis's version, in my head Saavik is always Kirstie).

    I'm kinda the reverse. Whenever I think of Saavik, I first think of Curtis on Genesis, chastising David and hooking up with Hormonal Spock. I'm a sucker for those big doe eyes of hers.
  • Haere LinteseregHaere Lintesereg ✭✭✭✭✭
    Enterprise captains or commanding officers (only variants with uniform):

    Jonathan Archer
    Robert April
    Christopher Pike
    James T. Kirk
    Will Decker
    Captain Spock
    John Harriman
    Rachel Garrett
    Jean-Luc Picard
  • KaiteeKaitee ✭✭✭✭✭
    Also, I never read it that Valeris was, by herself, what was weighing on Spock. He mentions that Kirk and McCoy had nearly been killed because he had placed them in harm's way by bringing them into the mission. I took that to show that the scope of what was on his mind went beyond Valeris.

    Could be. My read was that it was Valeris's betrayal that actually hurt him - even after the mission's gone sideways and they know someone on the ship was in on it he keeps his cool and works the problem, but when he sees it's her he's just furious. I feel like by that point he's matured in handling his emotions to the point that it's only being angry at himself than can make him lose it like he did slapping the phaser out of her hand. Afterwards he's calmed down and is thinking about the whole mission and his role in putting Kirk and McCoy in danger, but I think it was Valeris that cracked his armour and put him in that mood, like how Gorkon's dying words to Kirk cracked his and got him to reflect on his whole attitude throughout.

    TBH part of my problem with her is that I really don't give V much thought, so on some level I guess I kind of treat the whole gap between the end of IV and the beginning of VI like this vague stretch of whatever that doesn't really affect anything much. I mean yeah Spock's been training Valeris to take over for a while, but in my head she kind of just pops into existence on the bridge.
  • Travis S McClainTravis S McClain ✭✭✭✭✭
    Enterprise captains or commanding officers (only variants with uniform):

    Jonathan Archer
    Robert April
    Christopher Pike
    James T. Kirk
    Will Decker
    Captain Spock
    John Harriman
    Rachel Garrett
    Jean-Luc Picard

    We also still need Edward Jellico. Admiral Riker should be included in such a collection (he specifically states that a privilege of his rank is getting to choose his ship). And since we now have variants of crew in identical uniforms but from different moments, we need a "Best of Both Worlds" Riker.
  • KaiteeKaitee ✭✭✭✭✭
    Gabriel Bell popping up in my community reward pull gave me an idea - historical figures? Not counting our usual heroes, yes of course Kirk is a historical figure by the 24th Century and Picard and Sisko get well known as well, but narrowing it just to keep the collection manageable - Bell, Lincoln, Commodore April, Gorkon (Starfleet named a ship for him after all), Cochrane, let's say COP Founder Archer because that's a proper 'historical moment' variant of him, Daystrom, Amelia Earhart, Surak, Kahless (yeah he's a clone, but near enough, and at least he can pronounce his own name), and so on.
  • IronagedaveIronagedave ✭✭✭✭✭
    The Suggestive Collection -
    Cards that can be put in Risque positions on the bridge crew or can be entirely suggestive individually.

    2*
    Naomi Wildman

    3*
    CMD Wrap Kirk

    4*
    Evil KIrk
    Cyrus Redblock
    Warship Chakotay

    5*
    Etana Jol
    Phlox au naturel
    [was on Sabbatical/Hiatus] Currently a trialist at Galaxy SquadronSTAY SAFE and KBO
  • Prime LorcaPrime Lorca ✭✭✭✭✭
    The Suggestive Collection -
    Cards that can be put in Risque positions on the bridge crew or can be entirely suggestive individually.

    2*
    Naomi Wildman

    3*
    CMD Wrap Kirk

    4*
    Evil KIrk
    Cyrus Redblock
    Warship Chakotay

    5*
    Etana Jol
    Phlox au naturel

    You left out Bell Riots Bashir. And maybe Smitten Picard.
    Farewell 🖖
  • Travis S McClainTravis S McClain ✭✭✭✭✭
    Kaitee wrote: »
    Gabriel Bell popping up in my community reward pull gave me an idea - historical figures? Not counting our usual heroes, yes of course Kirk is a historical figure by the 24th Century and Picard and Sisko get well known as well, but narrowing it just to keep the collection manageable - Bell, Lincoln, Commodore April, Gorkon (Starfleet named a ship for him after all), Cochrane, let's say COP Founder Archer because that's a proper 'historical moment' variant of him, Daystrom, Amelia Earhart, Surak, Kahless (yeah he's a clone, but near enough, and at least he can pronounce his own name), and so on.

    I'd add Leonardo da Vinci for sure. Maybe Edith Keeler. Kortar was the first Klingon and he slew all their gods, so that's pretty dope. Buck Bokai was the last real baseball star before the sport fell out of mainstream favor.

    What I like about this is that there's room for adding some other crew that interest me that aren't yet in the game:

    Albert Einstein (TNG "Descent")
    Doc Holliday (TOS "Spectre of the Gun")
    Flint (TOS "Requiem for Methuselah")
    Genghis Khan (TOS "The Savage Curtain")
    Isaac Newton (TNG "Descent", VOY "Death Wish")
    Samuel Clemens (TNG "Time's Arrow")
    Sigmund Freud (TNG "Emergence")
    Stephen Hawking (TNG "Descent", probably never gonna happen, but a wish list doesn't care; would be a fantastic milestone reward, though!)
    T'Pau (ENT "The Forge"/"Awakening"/"Kir'Shara", TOS "Amok Time")
    Wyatt Earp (TOS "Spectre of the Gun")

    Some others who don't interest me all that much but merit consideration and others may dig:

    Colonel Green (TOS "The Savage Curtain")
    Jack London (TNG "Time's Arrow")
    Johnny Behan (TOS "Spectre of the Gun")
    Lord Byron (VOY "Darkling")
    Mohatma Gandhi (VOY "Darkling")
    Morgan Earp (TOS "Spectre of the Gun")
    Socrates (VOY "Darkling")
    Virgil Earp (TOS "Spectre of the Gun")
    Thaddius Riker (VOY "Death Wish" - shown in a photo and discussed)
    Zora (TOS "The Savage Curtain", whoever the hell she was)
  • eXo | das411eXo | das411 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Enterprise captains or commanding officers (only variants with uniform):

    Jonathan Archer
    Robert April
    Christopher Pike
    James T. Kirk
    Will Decker
    Captain Spock
    John Harriman
    Rachel Garrett
    Jean-Luc Picard

    We also still need Edward Jellico. Admiral Riker should be included in such a collection (he specifically states that a privilege of his rank is getting to choose his ship). And since we now have variants of crew in identical uniforms but from different moments, we need a "Best of Both Worlds" Riker.

    and of course we need a Star Trek V version of Captain Chekov from when he fakes out Sybok...does that qualify as "Undercover operative"? :)

    finalfrontier18.jpg?type=vertical

  • Travis S McClainTravis S McClain ✭✭✭✭✭
    Enterprise captains or commanding officers (only variants with uniform):

    Jonathan Archer
    Robert April
    Christopher Pike
    James T. Kirk
    Will Decker
    Captain Spock
    John Harriman
    Rachel Garrett
    Jean-Luc Picard

    We also still need Edward Jellico. Admiral Riker should be included in such a collection (he specifically states that a privilege of his rank is getting to choose his ship). And since we now have variants of crew in identical uniforms but from different moments, we need a "Best of Both Worlds" Riker.

    and of course we need a Star Trek V version of Captain Chekov from when he fakes out Sybok...does that qualify as "Undercover operative"? :)

    finalfrontier18.jpg?type=vertical

    Crafty seems to be a euphemism for Damn Dirty Liar, so at minimum, that. In any event, I adore that you suggested anything from The Final Frontier .
  • KaiteeKaitee ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'd add Leonardo da Vinci for sure. Maybe Edith Keeler. Kortar was the first Klingon and he slew all their gods, so that's pretty dope. Buck Bokai was the last real baseball star before the sport fell out of mainstream favor.

    Leo and Bokai for sure (I was just kind of winging my list, I knew I'd forget some). I'm not sure about Keeler, she was only really a historical figure in the Tripping Balls McCoy timeline, and in any case the version we have of her predates that, truck or no truck. Kortar seems more myth than history.

    For the Captains of the Big E collection, maybe we could get an Acting Captain Beverly Crusher? She was legit in command, and there's an expanding cloud of gas that used to be a Borg teapot that'll agree she did more than just keep the chair warm.
  • [7TW] UnkieB[7TW] UnkieB ✭✭✭✭✭
    A time travel collection of some sort? Something like Not in their time...

    Crew from episodes/movies like The City on the Edge of Forever, Assignment: Earth, Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home, First Contact, Yesterday's Enterprise, All Good Things, Trials and Tibble-ations, Past Tense, Future's End, Relativity, Storm Front, Rasmussen from A Matter of Time, Bateson from Cause and Effect, etc.

    Lots of crew that could be added to like Capt. John Christopher from Tomorrow is Yesterday, Kirk from The City on the Edge of Forever, Roberta Lincoln, Isis & Spock from Assignment: Earth, Zarabeth from All Our Yesterdays, Double Dumbass Kirk from Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home, everyone from Time's Arrow, etc.


    Might be too big for a collection I suppose.
  • edited May 2019
    A time travel collection of some sort? Something like Not in their time...

    Crew from episodes/movies like The City on the Edge of Forever, Assignment: Earth, Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home, First Contact, Yesterday's Enterprise, All Good Things, Trials and Tibble-ations, Past Tense, Future's End, Relativity, Storm Front, Rasmussen from A Matter of Time, Bateson from Cause and Effect, etc.

    Lots of crew that could be added to like Capt. John Christopher from Tomorrow is Yesterday, Kirk from The City on the Edge of Forever, Roberta Lincoln, Isis & Spock from Assignment: Earth, Zarabeth from All Our Yesterdays, Double Dumbass Kirk from Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home, everyone from Time's Arrow, etc.


    Might be too big for a collection I suppose.

    I like this one temporal 7 of 9 tons of things that could be added
    Mirror Mirror

    simple and brilliant at the same time I bet its already in the works ... I also liked the trill/dax collection...

    I think we need a tux/dress collection as well
  • Mary Sue Collection?

    All the Burnhams and Wesley's in one place?
  • Haere LinteseregHaere Lintesereg ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited May 2019
    A collection about alternatives futures, timelines, universes or realities.

    Alternate Future Bashir
    Alternate Future Dax
    Captain Nog
    Bestselling Author Jake Sisko
    Captain T'Pol
    Alternate Future T'Pol
    Lorian
    Assimilated Tuvok
    Assimilated Janeway
    Assimilated Torres
    Commander Barclay
    Captain Harry Kim
    Rogue Harry Kim
    Captain La Forge
    Odo Gaia
    K'mtar
    Lt. Naomi Wildman
    Irumodic Syndrome Picard
    Captain Beverly Picard
    Admiral Riker
    Governor Worf
    Warship Yar
    Prisoner O'Brien

    I have doubts with the last two, and probably I forgot someone. I don't count the crew from Far Beyond the Stars, because sooner or later there will be a collection from that.
  • KaiteeKaitee ✭✭✭✭✭
    Have you all forgotten Commander Chekov was the EXO on the Reliant before all that?

    That's where I always assumed First Officer Chekov was from, but Travis is right, the art's straight out of VI (and Spock does formally state he's taking command after Kirk's arrested, it's logical - ha - that he explicitly gave Chekov the XO berth off-screen just as a matter of procedure).
  • Prime LorcaPrime Lorca ✭✭✭✭✭
    Dessert crew.

    Desert Michael Burnham.
    Desert Ezri Dax.
    Desert Philippa Georgiou
    Desert T'Pol
    and
    Cheesecake Seven.

    Desert and dessert crew. I see what you did there.
    Farewell 🖖
  • Dirk GundersonDirk Gunderson ✭✭✭✭✭
    Kaitee wrote: »
    Have you all forgotten Commander Chekov was the EXO on the Reliant before all that?

    That's where I always assumed First Officer Chekov was from, but Travis is right, the art's straight out of VI (and Spock does formally state he's taking command after Kirk's arrested, it's logical - ha - that he explicitly gave Chekov the XO berth off-screen just as a matter of procedure).

    So what I’m reading here is that we need to have EV Suit Chekov to make sure we have all of the reasonable XO Chekov variants in-game. Better throw in Acting Captain Chekov from Final Frontier while we’re at it.
  • KaiteeKaitee ✭✭✭✭✭
    So what I’m reading here is that we need to have EV Suit Chekov to make sure we have all of the reasonable XO Chekov variants in-game.

    If a Chekov is seen in the movie, it must be used later on in the game o:)
  • The Ambassadors - Crew with "Ambassador" in their name.

    I'm in Charge Now - Crew promoted to "Captian" - Limited to the card with "Captain" in the title, and limited to characters who appeard at a lower rank in the show.

  • SSR BarkleySSR Barkley ✭✭✭✭✭
    Q
    /SSR/ Barkley - semi retired
    Second Star to the Right - Join Today!
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