With respect, I think Travis's point was that the labor costs of designing a new starship still exists whether it's CGi or a model.
'Twas my point, yes.
Respectfully, I disagree and think this is already the best Trek since DS9 went off the air. Bold statement one episode in, but unless Picard goes GoT final season, I'm comfortable saying it.
I'm mindful that I felt in 1995 that "Caretaker" was the best Trek pilot, and by 1996 felt VOY was the worst Trek series. I'm more invested in this series than I was in VOY, ENT, or DSC after the pilot, but I'm also mindful that this has more to do with preexisting goodwill for legacy characters. Once we get more into what's new and original about this series, I should be more able to untangle all that.
As an aside, it was pointed out on Memory Alpha that this is the third Star Trek pilot in which the first spoken words were delivered by Patrick Stewart. I thought that was neat.
So, two Easter Eggs from the premiere episode. One, you may have seen mention of already — the Ferengi logo is on a building when a shot of Greater Boston is shown...
But in that same scene, some other eagle-eyed Trekkie spotted a DS9-er's name on a billboard — I blew up and enhanced the section in question so it's a bit easier to read...
Not that this means we'll see either of those showing up on the series in person, but it's an interesting notion.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing. ~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
So, two Easter Eggs from the premiere episode. One, you may have seen mention of already — the Ferengi logo is on a building when a shot of Greater Boston is shown...
But in that same scene, some other eagle-eyed Trekkie spotted a DS9-er's name on a billboard — I blew up and enhanced the section in question so it's a bit easier to read...
Not that this means we'll see either of those showing up on the series in person, but it's an interesting notion.
I could see having a Ferengi Logo up as just a general part of Star Trek lore to create the atmosphere of that universe.
Kasidy Yates, however, is an awfully specific name to flash on a billboard. It’s not like she was a series regular, or even a much beloved recurring character, like Garak. She appeared in some episodes, and she was fine. It would be like putting up “Ambassador Soval” or “Admiral Paris”. Unless you’re putting up nearly every recurring guest star, it makes no sense.
(Note: I’m not saying PR always makes sense, because it doesn’t, but assuming a logical thought process, don’t know why else she would be mentioned unless she was on the show. Which, I honestly don’t want, because I didn’t give two figs about her on DS9. Her entire character could have been cut from the show, and I would’ve been perfectly fine with it.)
This is irrelevant, and I've mentioned it before in my other posts, but I just want to say it again...
They could have copied Data, or anyone, literally infinite times if they wanted. The answer's been staring them in the face since it was invented: The transporter.
It's debated whether the transporter just sends a "pattern" for other materials to reconstruct or it sends literally every atom in a person and reconstructs them. Either way, it's copying EVERYTHING about them, down to their memories. What people don't typically think about is that a transporter is basically doing the same job as a replicator, only one is designed to go 1:1 and one is designed to store patterns and make copies upon request.
We know Data's been transported before, so clearly his pattern can be deconstructed and reconstructed. We know Riker's pattern was duplicated by some (plot device) and Thomas was created. Effectively, he was cloned.
You could totally clone Data a million times if you wanted. Just save his pattern in the buffer and boom. Don't tell me it's not possible, because they've done it.
As a fan of physics, I always laugh when a certain technology is presented in a work of fiction that could literally solve all of their problems, but isn't used as such due to plot constraints. For instance, whenever time travel is an option. If you had time travel, you could solve every problem ever. That's why they constantly have to put rules on it.
In any case, TL; DR is this: If you can transport, you can replicate, and you can duplicate. Hell, store a copy of everyone on the ship while they're on away missions! If they get killed, boom, produce the copy you stored when they beamed down! Don't tell me they don't have memory space in the buffer. If they can hold the data in there during transport, they can hold it til they come back.
So, two Easter Eggs from the premiere episode. One, you may have seen mention of already — the Ferengi logo is on a building when a shot of Greater Boston is shown...
But in that same scene, some other eagle-eyed Trekkie spotted a DS9-er's name on a billboard — I blew up and enhanced the section in question so it's a bit easier to read...
Not that this means we'll see either of those showing up on the series in person, but it's an interesting notion.
I could see having a Ferengi Logo up as just a general part of Star Trek lore to create the atmosphere of that universe.
Kasidy Yates, however, is an awfully specific name to flash on a billboard. It’s not like she was a series regular, or even a much beloved recurring character, like Garak. She appeared in some episodes, and she was fine. It would be like putting up “Ambassador Soval” or “Admiral Paris”. Unless you’re putting up nearly every recurring guest star, it makes no sense.
(Note: I’m not saying PR always makes sense, because it doesn’t, but assuming a logical thought process, don’t know why else she would be mentioned unless she was on the show. Which, I honestly don’t want, because I didn’t give two figs about her on DS9. Her entire character could have been cut from the show, and I would’ve been perfectly fine with it.)
Well, then! Guess I misread how weakened the Romulans have become since the supernova! I think it's kinda silly to invent something older and even more secretive than the Tal Shiar, but whatever. I dig clandestine spy stuff. It's a shame our Romulan commodore is treacherous, and yet in some respects I supposed I'd be disappointed if she wasn't. This show has definitely surprised me by how quickly it's played its hand, explaining Dahj and Soji in the first episode, and revealing the Romulan conspiracy in the second. I appreciate that.
I'm still fuzzy on just how and why the Romulans have control over a Borg Cube, but it's an interesting enough premise. Someone said it was fourteen years old, implying another Borg incursion between Nemesis and the supernova of the reboot movie. That could also help explain why the Federation had to construct the fleet that was destroyed at Mars.
It looks increasingly as though Bruce Maddox is the ultimate MacGuffin of the series, with Soji a minor one up front. I'm intrigued by that, with a caveat. Maddox using Data to construct Dahj, Soji, and potentially other androids/synthetics is one thing, but I'm less intrigued by the implication that he's one neuron away from resurrecting Data. I love Data, but I'm strongly in favor of him remaining dead.
I appreciated the explanation for sidelining the rest of the TNG crew. Yeah, I would have preferred to get the band back together, but I respect the decision not to do that and I think Picard feeling he can't impose on their loyalty makes sense. It's a contrivance, but it feels like a natural, organic one given how withdrawn and disillusioned they've presented Picard as having become over the years. I think if he'd said all that in the first episode, I would have been irked, but I've had enough time to settle in and accept Picard on his own.
I liked the scene of Picard's arrival at Starfleet. The majestic Alexander Courage fanfare was well used. The holographic Enterprises were a nice touch. I wish they'd gone with the classic TOS model instead of the Disco revamp, but I can understand wanting that synergy. The display of the Enterprise-D was the important bit, though. It's fan service, yeah, but it actually serves narrative purpose. Starfleet is happy to celebrate the legacy of Jean-Luc Picard publicly, while being derisive of him behind closed doors. It tells us a lot about how contentious things became, but also reflects that his reputation seems to have survived intact enough that Starfleet feels compelled to put on the face and smile about him in front of the public. It's a great shorthand.
Lastly, I didn't expect them to introduce Irumodic Syndrome, but it certainly looks as though that's what they've done. His condition isn't pinned down or named yet, but I think we're expected to know what's up. That ticking clock adds something new to the mix. It's too soon to have a feeling about how it's used, but as a dramatic choice, I like it. Like the Enterprise-D hologram, it's more than a callback. We've seen already how Irumodic Syndrome will affect Picard's faculties and everyone's perception of him, so we know what he's racing against now.
My nitpicks for this episode:
*The unnecessary f-bomb from the admiral. I was okay with how it was used in Discovery; that series is trying to be edgy (with mixed results). Here it felt unbecoming and beneath the dignity of Picard. At least he wasn't the one to say it, I guess.
*The Romulan scanning whatsit. I'm sure folks more into ideas of what technology could potentially do are more accepting of such a gizmo, but as a storyteller, I find it too easy and uninspiring. (And just how the hell did Picard gain access to Dahj's apartment, anyway?)
*Why did we need the flashback of what happened on Mars? Nothing else in the episode connects with it directly. We saw enough in "Children of Mars" and "Remembrance" to fill in the blanks already. It may well be paid off later, but within this episode, it just seemed like wasted time.
I appreciated the explanation for sidelining the rest of the TNG crew. Yeah, I would have preferred to get the band back together, but I respect the decision not to do that and I think Picard feeling he can't impose on their loyalty makes sense. It's a contrivance, but it feels like a natural, organic one given how withdrawn and disillusioned they've presented Picard as having become over the years. I think if he'd said all that in the first episode, I would have been irked, but I've had enough time to settle in and accept Picard on his own.
To play (somewhat) devil’s advocate, if this situation is as big of a deal as Picard seems to think it is, why *wouldn’t* you call on all the friends in high places that you could?
“Oh, I’m trying to track down a conspiracy at the very heart of the Federation, but I couldn’t possibly impose!”
Dude, that is exactly when you impose. When what you are doing is more important than your career (or anybody’s career) because it can affect billions of lives. I can kinda see keeping people with younger children out of it, like Riker or Troi, but Geordie? He certainly wouldn’t know anything about artificial intelligence or synths. /s/. Same with Crusher, to a lesser degree.
I would have preferred no explanation, or if they had to explain it, something else.
I mean, look at TNG’s finale. Picard certainly wasn’t afraid to impose on people like Bev/Captain Picard, because he felt the need was great enough.
And these aren’t just any old friends, no, they’re (probably) some of the most decorated and well-respected people in Starfleet. They don’t even necessarily have to join the team, but it would have made sense for him to at least ask them to ask around.
Whatever. It’s not the end of the world, but it’s annoying. I mean, I don’t necessarily want fan-service cameos, but it would be natural and organic for him to contact his old crew, because they are probably some of the best placed to help him.
Somewhat to change the subject, but I saw a few shots of Gates McFadden at the Picard premiere. She doesn’t look good, and I don’t mean that in a “she got older” way, but in a “she looks ill” way. She’s very skinny, and has kind of a grey pallor about her. I hope she is actually well, but those photos were concerning. Anyone see the same, and/or know anything?
I appreciated the explanation for sidelining the rest of the TNG crew. Yeah, I would have preferred to get the band back together, but I respect the decision not to do that and I think Picard feeling he can't impose on their loyalty makes sense. It's a contrivance, but it feels like a natural, organic one given how withdrawn and disillusioned they've presented Picard as having become over the years. I think if he'd said all that in the first episode, I would have been irked, but I've had enough time to settle in and accept Picard on his own.
To play (somewhat) devil’s advocate, if this situation is as big of a deal as Picard seems to think it is, why *wouldn’t* you call on all the friends in high places that you could?
“Oh, I’m trying to track down a conspiracy at the very heart of the Federation, but I couldn’t possibly impose!”
Dude, that is exactly when you impose. When what you are doing is more important than your career (or anybody’s career) because it can affect billions of lives. I can kinda see keeping people with younger children out of it, like Riker or Troi, but Geordie? He certainly wouldn’t know anything about artificial intelligence or synths. /s/. Same with Crusher, to a lesser degree.
I would have preferred no explanation, or if they had to explain it, something else.
I mean, look at TNG’s finale. Picard certainly wasn’t afraid to impose on people like Bev/Captain Picard, because he felt the need was great enough.
And these aren’t just any old friends, no, they’re (probably) some of the most decorated and well-respected people in Starfleet. They don’t even necessarily have to join the team, but it would have made sense for him to at least ask them to ask around.
Whatever. It’s not the end of the world, but it’s annoying. I mean, I don’t necessarily want fan-service cameos, but it would be natural and organic for him to contact his old crew, because they are probably some of the best placed to help him.
Somewhat to change the subject, but I saw a few shots of Gates McFadden at the Picard premiere. She doesn’t look good, and I don’t mean that in a “she got older” way, but in a “she looks ill” way. She’s very skinny, and has kind of a grey pallor about her. I hope she is actually well, but those photos were concerning. Anyone see the same, and/or know anything?
In fairness, Picard doesn't yet know there's a Federation conspiracy, though. All he knows is that Romulans killed Dahj on Earth and that Admiral F-Bomb treats him like Chicken Little for reporting it. He doesn't know anything about Commodore Oh or the secretive plot yet. From his perspective, the Federation isn't up to any shenanigans. They're just obtuse.
That said, ideally, yes, of course I would prefer to get the band back together! When we were told Picard would no longer be in Starfleet, my hope was that at least some of the others would be and that him being an outsider clashing with the others and testing their loyalties would be used to put Star Trek in a crucible. I've missed all of them, especially Worf. I'm just saying I buy Picard going through his Ahch-To phase, given the back story we've been told to this point.
I found it somewhat strange for them to say the Romulans have no androids, want no androids and are not even studying androids (insert AI/cybernetic/artificial life forms). Either they are just lying or the writers never saw the TNG episode "The Defector"
Adm Jarok: You're the android. I know a host of Romulan cyberneticists that would love to be this close to you.
DATA: I do not find that concept particularly appealing.
Adm Jarok: Nor should you
Anyway, love the show, cant wait for next week!
Founding ADM - PoF family of fleets (POF, POF2 & POF3) - Dear TP: Non sequitur. Your facts are uncoordinated.
So the real question is: Will Number One stay behind on the farm, or will he come along on the journey, and be the Porthos to Picard's Archer?
Either way, at least we know he will remain a very good boy.
I expect he'll stay home, if only because director Hanelle Culpepper and producer Michael Chabon emphasized how hard it was to work with him while filming. I'd imagine they tamped down his appearances after filming that first episode to minimize those frustrations.
Who did Jean - Luc contact via his old communicator?
I can't help but think that the nod towards the Irrumodic Syndrome thing is going to be the big twist - that this might all be in his head - a great, but dying, man revisits all his mistakes. "Star Trek: Dementia".
Who did Jean - Luc contact via his old communicator?
I can't help but think that the nod towards the Irrumodic Syndrome thing is going to be the big twist - that this might all be in his head - a great, but dying, man revisits all his mistakes. "Star Trek: Dementia".
Apparently it was Raffy, that black woman who lived in the middle of nowhere, who was subsequently surprised to see that he showed up at her home (in a freakin TAXI, nonetheless.) She was also his former second in command on the USS Verity.
Why he needed an outdated communicator instead of a standard electronic communication method, and why he figured hers would be on, who cares? In the JJ Abrams school of drama, story and "moments of nostalgia" come before logic.
Apparently it was Raffy, that black woman who lived in the middle of nowhere, who was subsequently surprised to see that he showed up at her home (in a freakin TAXI, nonetheless.) She was also his former second in command on the USS Verity.
Why he needed an outdated communicator instead of a standard electronic communication method, and why he figured hers would be on, who cares? In the JJ Abrams school of drama, story and "moments of nostalgia" come before logic.
Thank you. I must have missed the explanation of who she was. I just Googled "Raffy Star Trek Picard". It appears she was in that "Countdown" comic. I guess I'd better get around to looking at that.
Who did Jean - Luc contact via his old communicator?
I can't help but think that the nod towards the Irrumodic Syndrome thing is going to be the big twist - that this might all be in his head - a great, but dying, man revisits all his mistakes. "Star Trek: Dementia".
Apparently it was Raffy, that black woman who lived in the middle of nowhere, who was subsequently surprised to see that he showed up at her home (in a freakin TAXI, nonetheless.) She was also his former second in command on the USS Verity.
Why he needed an outdated communicator instead of a standard electronic communication method, and why he figured hers would be on, who cares? In the JJ Abrams school of drama, story and "moments of nostalgia" come before logic.
I kinda find it amusing that even in the tech-laden future, there comes a point when people insist on using their old phones. My ex-mother-in-law kept using her Cingular flip phone until her phone stopped being supported by their system. Guess Picard's 20 year old combadge is still supported by Starfleet, though why it's supported for him as a civilian on the outs is weird. Surely they monitor that kind of thing. Though maybe that was his purpose; to bait Starfleet, and maybe that's why Seven turns up? If something like that pays off the use, I'll be fine with it. Otherwise, yeah, it's just a bit of the kind of fan service I could do without.
And to be fair, while Abrams is one of the poster boys for it, fixating on/exploiting nostalgic fan service is a pervasive problem that goes well beyond him. It's one of the three most frustrating trends in contemporary storytelling. For those willing to go down the rabbit hole with me, the other two are:
*Trying so hard to be cleverer than the audience by inserting convoluted "surprises" that at best make contribute nothing substantive and at worst undermine the narrative. Examples: The reveal of Talia in The Dark Knight Rises. Everyone is trying to recreate Darth Vader's "No, I am your father" moment. The reason we still watch and talk about Hitchcock's films is that his philosophy for suspense was that the audience be one step ahead of the protagonist. It renders us helpless to warn them, making us squirm when we can see the danger they can't.
*Making every single thing connect. I love payoffs. It was one of the things that I loved most about DS9. But the "everything is connected" approach to universe-building often turns a series into a serial, where each part isn't a story, but just the next segment. And it's worked because God help us, fandom is now insisting on it, too. Look at the reaction last year to the Sony/Disney custody battle for Spider-Man. A movie "just" about Spider-Man and his incredibly rich roster of supporting characters is now incapable of being interesting or entertaining, and is unacceptable.
I don’t have any knowledge other than what I’ve gathered from the trailers, but it doesn’t look like Seven of Nine is working with Starfleet. In fact, I don’t think anybody on the “good” team is going to end up being a Starfleet officer in this series.
I don’t have any knowledge other than what I’ve gathered from the trailers, but it doesn’t look like Seven of Nine is working with Starfleet. In fact, I don’t think anybody on the “good” team is going to end up being a Starfleet officer in this series.
I've anticipated Seven being with Section 31. For one thing, they did that with her in the continuing novels and comics and it seemed to be a popular pairing. Also, the current production team seems to really be into Section 31. But even if she is, yeah, there ain't much at Starfleet to feel good about right now. I hope that by time Picard is finished exposing all this that will change. Of course, we've seen that a society doesn't always care when its leaders are exposed doing terribly awful things so....
Next big question... WHAT are the Klingons going to look like? Discovery Orcs? They showed Worf in that montage of Picard’s career but you never know with these people.
The "new Klingon look" was the reason why I didn't initially watch Discovery. I just can't accept it ...
Anyway not disappointed by the show so far (and actually quite thrilled about it). Definitely some flaws here and there, but I can live with that. I can't wait to see Seven !
Next big question... WHAT are the Klingons going to look like? Discovery Orcs? They showed Worf in that montage of Picard’s career but you never know with these people.
And no! Putting hair on the Orcs didn’t fix them.
My guess has been that we'll get a mixture of 80's/90's Klingons and Disco era. Though if they really want to win me over, they'll put some Klingons in TAS purple clothes. Then it'd be a party.
So, BIG DISCLAIMER HERE:
I don't support ANY of this man's political views, nor I suggest you explore his channel further than this video. But I gotta say, this review is EXACTLY spot on! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgaSooMfd94
I'm sort of betting that the Romulan/Borg elements and the Maddox bits around the "synth" attack on Mars are a bit of a red herring and that it's going to be a reemergence of control. Or something like that that'll lead to a Picard/Discovery crossover at some point. Bearing in mind that Picard has Sarek's memories so, somewhere buried inside he knows about Control/Burnham/Discovery...
I don’t think he actually has Sarek’s memories, I think Sarek passed along a “message” to Spock through him that included words/memories/sensations/etc.
I don’t think he actually has Sarek’s memories, I think Sarek passed along a “message” to Spock through him that included words/memories/sensations/etc.
I never read it that way. Sarek's mind was so chaotic that their mind meld was more or less a massive data dump where nothing was in folders. Picard later "offer[ed]" Spock the "chance" to touch what Sarek had shared with him, which doesn't sound like "I have a message for you" to me.
In any event, Perrin explicitly stated that their meld made Picard and Sarek "a part of [one another]", so canonically, they have firm ground for deciding that meant Picard had the same kind of connection to Sarek that they gave Burnham. I could do without such a subplot, but I've anticipated it ever since PIC was announced.
On paper, not much happens in this episode. Picard talks Raffi into helping him with his quest and meets Captain Rios, Commodore Oh sends the Zhat Vash after Dr. Junati and Picard, and Soji freaks out a Romulan oracle. Pretty cut and dry stuff. And yet, I was thoroughly engrossed in the way that I was hoping I would be when this series was announced. Things are finally gelling and it feels good. Things I dug:
The ENH calling out Rios for being starstruck by Picard was nice in two respects. One, it's how I see Picard, and how I think most of us do. He is a living legend! At first, I wondered how the ENH knew about Picard working with Spock because I reflexively remembered "Unification", but then I remembered that the backstory for the Kelvinverse had them work together on trying to stop the supernova. That would have been known publicly, surely. But the scene also lets us know that in his heart, Rios sees Picard that way, too. Plus, the dude likes a good stogie. I like him already.
Hugh! I recognized in him the character we last saw in "Descent II", determined to help Borg severed from the Collective. At that time, he was just trying to help them literally function. Now, he's helping them reclaim their minds and souls. It's a nice arc. I'm curious to see what things are like when he and Picard inevitably reunite. There's bound to be a blend of empathy and bitterness, I would think. I'm curious to learn what has transpired over the years.
I didn't expect Raffi would find Maddox so early, though I suspect Picard will find his princess is in another castle when they get to Freecloud. (Side note: Freecloud is an entirely underwhelming name for a failed storage startup. The place better be Bespin when we see it.) They laid it on a bit too thick, with her calling him "JL" every other sentence, but ultimately I do buy their relationship.
Lastly, this is the most Romulans have gotten to do in a very long time. A friend of mine has long been a big fan of Romulans and he's really digging their shady shenanigans. I liked also that we learned Starfleet thinks Commodore Oh is Vulcan and doesn't realize she's Romulan. That answers the question why there's a high ranking Romulan in Starfleet.
Kinda disappointed in Number One, though. I get that Patrick Stewart is trying to rehabilitate the public perception of pit bulls and showing him mauling Romulans is antithetical to that, but couldn't he have at least barked or something?
A guy with a Spanish name (Cristóbal Ríos) have a book (Del sentimiento trágico de la vida) by a Spaniard writer (Miguel de Unamuno)... and he's reading it in English. Funny.
Was reading an article that picked up on something I just sort of glossed over — and it may have repercussions for explaining the varying looks of the Klingons, as well.
There's a scene with Laris and Zhaban interrogating a captured member of the Tal Shiar in Picard's living room, and Laris mentions something to Zhaban to the effect of, "He's a stubborn Northerner, just like you." Both the Tal Shair and Zhaban have similar pronounced forehead ridges to what we've seen in Romulans since TNG, while Laris does not. So this line was apparently to give an explanation to their appearances over the years.
Regarding my other point, I know there was the Trials and Tribble-ations moment with Worf ("We do not discuss it with outsiders"), but I also read somewhere that if Worf does appear on Picard, he won't look like the Disco Klingons. So as far as Picard making everything jibe with all that...
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing. ~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
It was genuinely exciting just to see in the opening title credits "Special Guest Star Jeri Ryan", and "Directed by Jonathan Frakes". This episode amounted to The Fellowship of the Ring and I think it's my favorite so far.
The opening sequence of Picard's relationship with young Elnor was lovely. I might have had a hard time accepting such a striking change in him had the series opened with this softened Picard, but coming after three "present day" episodes showing how he's hardened with disillusionment, I think it was a nice reprieve just to see him upbeat again.
Moreover, it was great to see him as his old self, reflexively giving orders. Even the tone in his voice when answering the door chime ("Come!") was familiar. I wasn't sure what to make of the shot in the trailer of him sword fighting a Romulan, so I was relieved to find it was just the brief clash and that he laid down his sword immediately thereafter. I can buy paternal Picard striking up a relationship with a Romulan child more easily than I was prepared to buy swashbuckling 93 year old Picard dueling with an adult.
The heart of this episode, though, is Picard facing Romulans in person. It's one thing to see him grapple with his abstract guilt; it's another to see him look Romulans in the eye. I can understand the bitter resentment toward Picard, but I also think it's misplaced. The former Senator snaps that the Federation underestimated Romulans' ingenuity and self-sufficiency, but where were those things? Surely the Romulans didn't suspend their operations and defer entirely to Starfleet? As a Senator, surely he understands that Picard, influential as he was, was ultimately still just one admiral? "And then you gave up!" he barks, but just what was Picard supposed to do without the resources of Starfleet? It's not like he was a Sith lord with a secret fleet of his own just kinda lying there underwater on a planet somewhere.
I can understand Picard not arguing those things himself; angry people interpret explanations as excuses and it would only have exacerbated the conflict. As angry as he is, he may even think himself that those practicalities are merely excuses. But someone should have spoken up. If nothing else, I hope someone says it to Picard. He didn't cause the supernova, he didn't tell the Romulans not to bother doing anything themselves, and he didn't decide for Starfleet to abandon Romulus.
Lastly, I think we are gonna find out that Seven is with Section 31, as they did with her in the novels.
Comments
'Twas my point, yes.
I'm mindful that I felt in 1995 that "Caretaker" was the best Trek pilot, and by 1996 felt VOY was the worst Trek series. I'm more invested in this series than I was in VOY, ENT, or DSC after the pilot, but I'm also mindful that this has more to do with preexisting goodwill for legacy characters. Once we get more into what's new and original about this series, I should be more able to untangle all that.
As an aside, it was pointed out on Memory Alpha that this is the third Star Trek pilot in which the first spoken words were delivered by Patrick Stewart. I thought that was neat.
But in that same scene, some other eagle-eyed Trekkie spotted a DS9-er's name on a billboard — I blew up and enhanced the section in question so it's a bit easier to read...
Not that this means we'll see either of those showing up on the series in person, but it's an interesting notion.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
I could see having a Ferengi Logo up as just a general part of Star Trek lore to create the atmosphere of that universe.
Kasidy Yates, however, is an awfully specific name to flash on a billboard. It’s not like she was a series regular, or even a much beloved recurring character, like Garak. She appeared in some episodes, and she was fine. It would be like putting up “Ambassador Soval” or “Admiral Paris”. Unless you’re putting up nearly every recurring guest star, it makes no sense.
(Note: I’m not saying PR always makes sense, because it doesn’t, but assuming a logical thought process, don’t know why else she would be mentioned unless she was on the show. Which, I honestly don’t want, because I didn’t give two figs about her on DS9. Her entire character could have been cut from the show, and I would’ve been perfectly fine with it.)
They could have copied Data, or anyone, literally infinite times if they wanted. The answer's been staring them in the face since it was invented: The transporter.
It's debated whether the transporter just sends a "pattern" for other materials to reconstruct or it sends literally every atom in a person and reconstructs them. Either way, it's copying EVERYTHING about them, down to their memories. What people don't typically think about is that a transporter is basically doing the same job as a replicator, only one is designed to go 1:1 and one is designed to store patterns and make copies upon request.
We know Data's been transported before, so clearly his pattern can be deconstructed and reconstructed. We know Riker's pattern was duplicated by some (plot device) and Thomas was created. Effectively, he was cloned.
You could totally clone Data a million times if you wanted. Just save his pattern in the buffer and boom. Don't tell me it's not possible, because they've done it.
As a fan of physics, I always laugh when a certain technology is presented in a work of fiction that could literally solve all of their problems, but isn't used as such due to plot constraints. For instance, whenever time travel is an option. If you had time travel, you could solve every problem ever. That's why they constantly have to put rules on it.
In any case, TL; DR is this: If you can transport, you can replicate, and you can duplicate. Hell, store a copy of everyone on the ship while they're on away missions! If they get killed, boom, produce the copy you stored when they beamed down! Don't tell me they don't have memory space in the buffer. If they can hold the data in there during transport, they can hold it til they come back.
SAYS YOU. #KasForever
Well, then! Guess I misread how weakened the Romulans have become since the supernova! I think it's kinda silly to invent something older and even more secretive than the Tal Shiar, but whatever. I dig clandestine spy stuff. It's a shame our Romulan commodore is treacherous, and yet in some respects I supposed I'd be disappointed if she wasn't. This show has definitely surprised me by how quickly it's played its hand, explaining Dahj and Soji in the first episode, and revealing the Romulan conspiracy in the second. I appreciate that.
I'm still fuzzy on just how and why the Romulans have control over a Borg Cube, but it's an interesting enough premise. Someone said it was fourteen years old, implying another Borg incursion between Nemesis and the supernova of the reboot movie. That could also help explain why the Federation had to construct the fleet that was destroyed at Mars.
It looks increasingly as though Bruce Maddox is the ultimate MacGuffin of the series, with Soji a minor one up front. I'm intrigued by that, with a caveat. Maddox using Data to construct Dahj, Soji, and potentially other androids/synthetics is one thing, but I'm less intrigued by the implication that he's one neuron away from resurrecting Data. I love Data, but I'm strongly in favor of him remaining dead.
I appreciated the explanation for sidelining the rest of the TNG crew. Yeah, I would have preferred to get the band back together, but I respect the decision not to do that and I think Picard feeling he can't impose on their loyalty makes sense. It's a contrivance, but it feels like a natural, organic one given how withdrawn and disillusioned they've presented Picard as having become over the years. I think if he'd said all that in the first episode, I would have been irked, but I've had enough time to settle in and accept Picard on his own.
I liked the scene of Picard's arrival at Starfleet. The majestic Alexander Courage fanfare was well used. The holographic Enterprises were a nice touch. I wish they'd gone with the classic TOS model instead of the Disco revamp, but I can understand wanting that synergy. The display of the Enterprise-D was the important bit, though. It's fan service, yeah, but it actually serves narrative purpose. Starfleet is happy to celebrate the legacy of Jean-Luc Picard publicly, while being derisive of him behind closed doors. It tells us a lot about how contentious things became, but also reflects that his reputation seems to have survived intact enough that Starfleet feels compelled to put on the face and smile about him in front of the public. It's a great shorthand.
Lastly, I didn't expect them to introduce Irumodic Syndrome, but it certainly looks as though that's what they've done. His condition isn't pinned down or named yet, but I think we're expected to know what's up. That ticking clock adds something new to the mix. It's too soon to have a feeling about how it's used, but as a dramatic choice, I like it. Like the Enterprise-D hologram, it's more than a callback. We've seen already how Irumodic Syndrome will affect Picard's faculties and everyone's perception of him, so we know what he's racing against now.
My nitpicks for this episode:
*The unnecessary f-bomb from the admiral. I was okay with how it was used in Discovery; that series is trying to be edgy (with mixed results). Here it felt unbecoming and beneath the dignity of Picard. At least he wasn't the one to say it, I guess.
*The Romulan scanning whatsit. I'm sure folks more into ideas of what technology could potentially do are more accepting of such a gizmo, but as a storyteller, I find it too easy and uninspiring. (And just how the hell did Picard gain access to Dahj's apartment, anyway?)
*Why did we need the flashback of what happened on Mars? Nothing else in the episode connects with it directly. We saw enough in "Children of Mars" and "Remembrance" to fill in the blanks already. It may well be paid off later, but within this episode, it just seemed like wasted time.
To play (somewhat) devil’s advocate, if this situation is as big of a deal as Picard seems to think it is, why *wouldn’t* you call on all the friends in high places that you could?
“Oh, I’m trying to track down a conspiracy at the very heart of the Federation, but I couldn’t possibly impose!”
Dude, that is exactly when you impose. When what you are doing is more important than your career (or anybody’s career) because it can affect billions of lives. I can kinda see keeping people with younger children out of it, like Riker or Troi, but Geordie? He certainly wouldn’t know anything about artificial intelligence or synths. /s/. Same with Crusher, to a lesser degree.
I would have preferred no explanation, or if they had to explain it, something else.
I mean, look at TNG’s finale. Picard certainly wasn’t afraid to impose on people like Bev/Captain Picard, because he felt the need was great enough.
And these aren’t just any old friends, no, they’re (probably) some of the most decorated and well-respected people in Starfleet. They don’t even necessarily have to join the team, but it would have made sense for him to at least ask them to ask around.
Whatever. It’s not the end of the world, but it’s annoying. I mean, I don’t necessarily want fan-service cameos, but it would be natural and organic for him to contact his old crew, because they are probably some of the best placed to help him.
Somewhat to change the subject, but I saw a few shots of Gates McFadden at the Picard premiere. She doesn’t look good, and I don’t mean that in a “she got older” way, but in a “she looks ill” way. She’s very skinny, and has kind of a grey pallor about her. I hope she is actually well, but those photos were concerning. Anyone see the same, and/or know anything?
In fairness, Picard doesn't yet know there's a Federation conspiracy, though. All he knows is that Romulans killed Dahj on Earth and that Admiral F-Bomb treats him like Chicken Little for reporting it. He doesn't know anything about Commodore Oh or the secretive plot yet. From his perspective, the Federation isn't up to any shenanigans. They're just obtuse.
That said, ideally, yes, of course I would prefer to get the band back together! When we were told Picard would no longer be in Starfleet, my hope was that at least some of the others would be and that him being an outsider clashing with the others and testing their loyalties would be used to put Star Trek in a crucible. I've missed all of them, especially Worf. I'm just saying I buy Picard going through his Ahch-To phase, given the back story we've been told to this point.
Adm Jarok: You're the android. I know a host of Romulan cyberneticists that would love to be this close to you.
DATA: I do not find that concept particularly appealing.
Adm Jarok: Nor should you
Anyway, love the show, cant wait for next week!
These are pretty cool. They're close enough to the "alternate future" episodes that I'm happy.
Either way, at least we know he will remain a very good boy.
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
I expect he'll stay home, if only because director Hanelle Culpepper and producer Michael Chabon emphasized how hard it was to work with him while filming. I'd imagine they tamped down his appearances after filming that first episode to minimize those frustrations.
I can't help but think that the nod towards the Irrumodic Syndrome thing is going to be the big twist - that this might all be in his head - a great, but dying, man revisits all his mistakes. "Star Trek: Dementia".
Apparently it was Raffy, that black woman who lived in the middle of nowhere, who was subsequently surprised to see that he showed up at her home (in a freakin TAXI, nonetheless.) She was also his former second in command on the USS Verity.
Why he needed an outdated communicator instead of a standard electronic communication method, and why he figured hers would be on, who cares? In the JJ Abrams school of drama, story and "moments of nostalgia" come before logic.
Thank you. I must have missed the explanation of who she was. I just Googled "Raffy Star Trek Picard". It appears she was in that "Countdown" comic. I guess I'd better get around to looking at that.
I kinda find it amusing that even in the tech-laden future, there comes a point when people insist on using their old phones. My ex-mother-in-law kept using her Cingular flip phone until her phone stopped being supported by their system. Guess Picard's 20 year old combadge is still supported by Starfleet, though why it's supported for him as a civilian on the outs is weird. Surely they monitor that kind of thing. Though maybe that was his purpose; to bait Starfleet, and maybe that's why Seven turns up? If something like that pays off the use, I'll be fine with it. Otherwise, yeah, it's just a bit of the kind of fan service I could do without.
And to be fair, while Abrams is one of the poster boys for it, fixating on/exploiting nostalgic fan service is a pervasive problem that goes well beyond him. It's one of the three most frustrating trends in contemporary storytelling. For those willing to go down the rabbit hole with me, the other two are:
*Making every single thing connect. I love payoffs. It was one of the things that I loved most about DS9. But the "everything is connected" approach to universe-building often turns a series into a serial, where each part isn't a story, but just the next segment. And it's worked because God help us, fandom is now insisting on it, too. Look at the reaction last year to the Sony/Disney custody battle for Spider-Man. A movie "just" about Spider-Man and his incredibly rich roster of supporting characters is now incapable of being interesting or entertaining, and is unacceptable.
I've anticipated Seven being with Section 31. For one thing, they did that with her in the continuing novels and comics and it seemed to be a popular pairing. Also, the current production team seems to really be into Section 31. But even if she is, yeah, there ain't much at Starfleet to feel good about right now. I hope that by time Picard is finished exposing all this that will change. Of course, we've seen that a society doesn't always care when its leaders are exposed doing terribly awful things so....
And no! Putting hair on the Orcs didn’t fix them.
Anyway not disappointed by the show so far (and actually quite thrilled about it). Definitely some flaws here and there, but I can live with that. I can't wait to see Seven !
My guess has been that we'll get a mixture of 80's/90's Klingons and Disco era. Though if they really want to win me over, they'll put some Klingons in TAS purple clothes. Then it'd be a party.
I don't support ANY of this man's political views, nor I suggest you explore his channel further than this video. But I gotta say, this review is EXACTLY spot on!
I never read it that way. Sarek's mind was so chaotic that their mind meld was more or less a massive data dump where nothing was in folders. Picard later "offer[ed]" Spock the "chance" to touch what Sarek had shared with him, which doesn't sound like "I have a message for you" to me.
In any event, Perrin explicitly stated that their meld made Picard and Sarek "a part of [one another]", so canonically, they have firm ground for deciding that meant Picard had the same kind of connection to Sarek that they gave Burnham. I could do without such a subplot, but I've anticipated it ever since PIC was announced.
On paper, not much happens in this episode. Picard talks Raffi into helping him with his quest and meets Captain Rios, Commodore Oh sends the Zhat Vash after Dr. Junati and Picard, and Soji freaks out a Romulan oracle. Pretty cut and dry stuff. And yet, I was thoroughly engrossed in the way that I was hoping I would be when this series was announced. Things are finally gelling and it feels good. Things I dug:
The ENH calling out Rios for being starstruck by Picard was nice in two respects. One, it's how I see Picard, and how I think most of us do. He is a living legend! At first, I wondered how the ENH knew about Picard working with Spock because I reflexively remembered "Unification", but then I remembered that the backstory for the Kelvinverse had them work together on trying to stop the supernova. That would have been known publicly, surely. But the scene also lets us know that in his heart, Rios sees Picard that way, too. Plus, the dude likes a good stogie. I like him already.
Hugh! I recognized in him the character we last saw in "Descent II", determined to help Borg severed from the Collective. At that time, he was just trying to help them literally function. Now, he's helping them reclaim their minds and souls. It's a nice arc. I'm curious to see what things are like when he and Picard inevitably reunite. There's bound to be a blend of empathy and bitterness, I would think. I'm curious to learn what has transpired over the years.
I didn't expect Raffi would find Maddox so early, though I suspect Picard will find his princess is in another castle when they get to Freecloud. (Side note: Freecloud is an entirely underwhelming name for a failed storage startup. The place better be Bespin when we see it.) They laid it on a bit too thick, with her calling him "JL" every other sentence, but ultimately I do buy their relationship.
Lastly, this is the most Romulans have gotten to do in a very long time. A friend of mine has long been a big fan of Romulans and he's really digging their shady shenanigans. I liked also that we learned Starfleet thinks Commodore Oh is Vulcan and doesn't realize she's Romulan. That answers the question why there's a high ranking Romulan in Starfleet.
Kinda disappointed in Number One, though. I get that Patrick Stewart is trying to rehabilitate the public perception of pit bulls and showing him mauling Romulans is antithetical to that, but couldn't he have at least barked or something?
There's a scene with Laris and Zhaban interrogating a captured member of the Tal Shiar in Picard's living room, and Laris mentions something to Zhaban to the effect of, "He's a stubborn Northerner, just like you." Both the Tal Shair and Zhaban have similar pronounced forehead ridges to what we've seen in Romulans since TNG, while Laris does not. So this line was apparently to give an explanation to their appearances over the years.
Regarding my other point, I know there was the Trials and Tribble-ations moment with Worf ("We do not discuss it with outsiders"), but I also read somewhere that if Worf does appear on Picard, he won't look like the Disco Klingons. So as far as Picard making everything jibe with all that...
Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
It was genuinely exciting just to see in the opening title credits "Special Guest Star Jeri Ryan", and "Directed by Jonathan Frakes". This episode amounted to The Fellowship of the Ring and I think it's my favorite so far.
The opening sequence of Picard's relationship with young Elnor was lovely. I might have had a hard time accepting such a striking change in him had the series opened with this softened Picard, but coming after three "present day" episodes showing how he's hardened with disillusionment, I think it was a nice reprieve just to see him upbeat again.
Moreover, it was great to see him as his old self, reflexively giving orders. Even the tone in his voice when answering the door chime ("Come!") was familiar. I wasn't sure what to make of the shot in the trailer of him sword fighting a Romulan, so I was relieved to find it was just the brief clash and that he laid down his sword immediately thereafter. I can buy paternal Picard striking up a relationship with a Romulan child more easily than I was prepared to buy swashbuckling 93 year old Picard dueling with an adult.
The heart of this episode, though, is Picard facing Romulans in person. It's one thing to see him grapple with his abstract guilt; it's another to see him look Romulans in the eye. I can understand the bitter resentment toward Picard, but I also think it's misplaced. The former Senator snaps that the Federation underestimated Romulans' ingenuity and self-sufficiency, but where were those things? Surely the Romulans didn't suspend their operations and defer entirely to Starfleet? As a Senator, surely he understands that Picard, influential as he was, was ultimately still just one admiral? "And then you gave up!" he barks, but just what was Picard supposed to do without the resources of Starfleet? It's not like he was a Sith lord with a secret fleet of his own just kinda lying there underwater on a planet somewhere.
I can understand Picard not arguing those things himself; angry people interpret explanations as excuses and it would only have exacerbated the conflict. As angry as he is, he may even think himself that those practicalities are merely excuses. But someone should have spoken up. If nothing else, I hope someone says it to Picard. He didn't cause the supernova, he didn't tell the Romulans not to bother doing anything themselves, and he didn't decide for Starfleet to abandon Romulus.
Lastly, I think we are gonna find out that Seven is with Section 31, as they did with her in the novels.