I gotta say thanks to all for sharing this outside your fleets. While I have had a tendency to see the first slot as 'primary' without any reason to do so, and haven't had any issues with my event shuttles for a while, many in my fleet have and for some of them it will make a huge difference.
Thanks for your community minded attitude from 10F.
I dunno if it's because of this, or just because RNGesus is being kinder to me this event, but I'm going to give you the guys credit -- thanks for helping me reduce the number of head-scratching shuttle fails.
I dunno if it's because of this, or just because RNGesus is being kinder to me this event, but I'm going to give you the guys credit -- thanks for helping me reduce the number of head-scratching shuttle fails.
I dunno if it's because of this, or just because RNGesus is being kinder to me this event, but I'm going to give you the guys credit -- thanks for helping me reduce the number of head-scratching shuttle fails.
Same here. My success rate is dramatically higher so-far with focusing on the first And skill. You guys did great work on this.
All of my missions have been over 90%. The one mission I did not follow the guidelines you have shown here is the only one I failed. Y’all are brilliant for finding this
This might explain why one of the missions I sent out with the same crew failed a lot more than the 6% it promised (94% success rate). I would wager I failed at least 1/3rd of the time. It was "Element of Surprise" with Sci, Eng AND Com, Eng AND Sci, and Eng. I ran Commander Keras (Com) in the first AND slot and my squadron leader's Surak (Sci) in the second AND slot (with my Surak and T'Rul in the two solo slots). All FE with the two 4*s being FF and the Suraks at 3/5.
If Keras and Surak were getting only 25%, then that's like 1200 instead of 4800 effective event stats (~800 for each stat, x3 for event crew). And considering Surak + T'Rul is around 4200, that drops my stats by 40% from what was expected.
I’d also like to thank people who suggested this theory, Sisko and I merely ran some experiments. We would have had no idea what to investigate without a few people providing a direction to study.
Only 9 hours to go in the shuttle bit of the event and I have sent 84 shuttles so far, all 84 were successful. This is the first time ever I've had a 100 purrcent success rate all over the event up to this late.
"Everything about the Jem'Hadar is lethal!" - Eris (ST-DS9 Episode 2x26 "The Jem'Hadar")
this is way too complex for me.....i have no idea what you are talking about..
All it is saying is if you get an AND mission, say DIP AND COM, just make sure who you put in that spot has their skills listed in that order. Do not put someone in that spot that has COM listed before DIP
I messed up my jump start and mis-applied a few boosts. Yet I ended the first half in the 1300's for score and with all thresholds met. I've never done so well in a faction event. I suppose it helped that I have a good set of bonus crew.
I failed some missions, but all within reason. This AND issue work-around is great.
Whether the order should matter or not, the calculation used to display the success rate to the client should be the same as the calculation used server side to determine success. They clearly are not.
I agree, having spotted this theory during the week I decided to give it a try and found that if I ignored trying to max out the % in favor of making sure to match ALL the skills the % reported was far more reliable than if you went with partial matches with supposed higher % success chance.
It meant I actually did see nearly 100% success until the predicted success dropped to <90%, previous events it seemed far more hit or miss.
So thank you very much GTMET.
I for one believe this is a bug, if they wanted (or want) the AND to function the way it is, they could just change the display to show the correct percentage and let us know. I don't think there is any evil intent, just a bug. That said, I sure hope there is enough evidence to get the R&D team to properly investigate and identify the issue. I am glad @Shan raised a ticket, but I know sometimes it can be a fight to get programmers to believe there is a problem, especially when the code looks right.
I for one believe this is a bug, if they wanted (or want) the AND to function the way it is, they could just change the display to show the correct percentage and let us know. I don't think there is any evil intent, just a bug. That said, I sure hope there is enough evidence to get the R&D team to properly investigate and identify the issue. I am glad @Shan raised a ticket, but I know sometimes it can be a fight to get programmers to believe there is a problem, especially when the code looks right.
I’m not yet convinced it’s just a bug with calculating 1st/2nd vs high/low skills. If it was truly always intended to be high/low, why would we have missions where the same two skills are used for AND slots on the same mission but in a different order?
I feel that miscommunication is a more believable answer - the question is whether the miscommunication is between DB and the player base with how shuttles work (super believable, given the general lack of help with learning game mechanics in-game) or between the programmers and whomever was responsible for designing the layout of the shuttle mission setup screen (also believable, given Shan’s bug ticket entry rather than telling us it’s a feature).
I for one believe this is a bug, if they wanted (or want) the AND to function the way it is, they could just change the display to show the correct percentage and let us know. I don't think there is any evil intent, just a bug. That said, I sure hope there is enough evidence to get the R&D team to properly investigate and identify the issue. I am glad @Shan raised a ticket, but I know sometimes it can be a fight to get programmers to believe there is a problem, especially when the code looks right.
I’m not yet convinced it’s just a bug with calculating 1st/2nd vs high/low skills. If it was truly always intended to be high/low, why would we have missions where the same two skills are used for AND slots on the same mission but in a different order?
I feel that miscommunication is a more believable answer - the question is whether the miscommunication is between DB and the player base with how shuttles work (super believable, given the general lack of help with learning game mechanics in-game) or between the programmers and whomever was responsible for designing the layout of the shuttle mission setup screen (also believable, given Shan’s bug ticket entry rather than telling us it’s a feature).
There is either a bug in the front end display of success rates or there is a bug in how results are calculated in the back end.
To the community's best knowledge, the front end display rates reflect what has been communicated to us in terms of how it is "supposed" to work.
I’m not yet convinced it’s just a bug with calculating 1st/2nd vs high/low skills. If it was truly always intended to be high/low, why would we have missions where the same two skills are used for AND slots on the same mission but in a different order?
There is either a bug in the front end display of success rates or there is a bug in how results are calculated in the back end.
To the community's best knowledge, the front end display rates reflect what has been communicated to us in terms of how it is "supposed" to work.
Exactly my point, there has to be a bug on one side or the other, and since the displayed percentage matches what has been communicated, the bug must be on the server side.
Well, this seems to be DB's biggest mess so far in the history of STT. It has been buggy for months while DB was communicating repeatedly that everything works as intended.
Luckily I didn't spend money or dilithium for shuttle speed ups or boosts. But if I was a whale, I'd wanted my huge loads of money back. Are any of the big spenders in contact with the support? I'm very interested in how they are going to work this out.
Well, this seems to be DB's biggest mess so far in the history of STT. It has been buggy for months while DB was communicating repeatedly that everything works as intended.
Luckily I didn't spend money or dilithium for shuttle speed ups or boosts. But if I was a whale, I'd wanted my huge loads of money back. Are any of the big spenders in contact with the support? I'm very interested in how they are going to work this out.
No need for targeted refunds. If people did better than others by inadvertently picking the optimal order, so be it. If someone had already figured this out and was keeping quiet about it to gain an advantage, well, good for them but the party's over now. We were all in the same boat on this one - on average, it's unlikely anyone gained a notable advantage prior to this investigation. If DB does figure out why the back end code is flawed (my preferred theory for the source of the issue), I would be sufficiently pleased if they said "oops, you guys were right, we've repaired it, and here's 10K honor for us being too stubborn to believe all the ranting was an accurate perception of a legitimate issue").
Maybe I'm just in a glass half-full kind of mood this morning.
Well now I have no reason to post all my shuttle crashing GIFs. 😬
But I agree. This event seemed more reasonable for failures after this was figured out. I think the dead giveaway was last week’s three ENG & shuttles with a paucity of ENG characters and everyone putting powerful event and bonus characters on the second skill to see high displayed success rates only to have massive fails rates.
DBs failure to communicate on it is hopeful just them being slow to react. Preferably they will address the issue and not stealth patch it so we know if it has been corrected or changed.
Players complain for months that there is something wrong with shuttle %, please fix it. DB gives the classic "it's just RNG, so working as intended". Player's figure out the problem, multiple players then test the proposed solution and report improved results, and DB can't so much as comment on it.
Now I get it, they don't want to make a hasty comment rather agreeing or shooting the answer to the problem down, but come on, at least acknowledge it! At the bare minimum, they could state that they will review the findings and see if they can confirm them.
Players complain for months that there is something wrong with shuttle %, please fix it. DB gives the classic "it's just RNG, so working as intended". Player's figure out the problem, multiple players then test the proposed solution and report improved results, and DB can't so much as comment on it.
Now I get it, they don't want to make a hasty comment rather agreeing or shooting the answer to the problem down, but come on, at least acknowledge it! At the bare minimum, they could state that they will review the findings and see if they can confirm them.
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Thanks for your community minded attitude from 10F.
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i thought this looked familiar, lol
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Likewise.
Same here. My success rate is dramatically higher so-far with focusing on the first And skill. You guys did great work on this.
If Keras and Surak were getting only 25%, then that's like 1200 instead of 4800 effective event stats (~800 for each stat, x3 for event crew). And considering Surak + T'Rul is around 4200, that drops my stats by 40% from what was expected.
All it is saying is if you get an AND mission, say DIP AND COM, just make sure who you put in that spot has their skills listed in that order. Do not put someone in that spot that has COM listed before DIP
I failed some missions, but all within reason. This AND issue work-around is great.
Thanks for proving it.
I agree, having spotted this theory during the week I decided to give it a try and found that if I ignored trying to max out the % in favor of making sure to match ALL the skills the % reported was far more reliable than if you went with partial matches with supposed higher % success chance.
It meant I actually did see nearly 100% success until the predicted success dropped to <90%, previous events it seemed far more hit or miss.
So thank you very much GTMET.
This might mean an impact to revenue to DB.
like More ppl able to clear threshold meaning they don’t need to buy pack etc?
But taking away the kickstart should offset this. It takes longer to hit the thresholds now
I’m not yet convinced it’s just a bug with calculating 1st/2nd vs high/low skills. If it was truly always intended to be high/low, why would we have missions where the same two skills are used for AND slots on the same mission but in a different order?
I feel that miscommunication is a more believable answer - the question is whether the miscommunication is between DB and the player base with how shuttles work (super believable, given the general lack of help with learning game mechanics in-game) or between the programmers and whomever was responsible for designing the layout of the shuttle mission setup screen (also believable, given Shan’s bug ticket entry rather than telling us it’s a feature).
There is either a bug in the front end display of success rates or there is a bug in how results are calculated in the back end.
To the community's best knowledge, the front end display rates reflect what has been communicated to us in terms of how it is "supposed" to work.
Exactly my point, there has to be a bug on one side or the other, and since the displayed percentage matches what has been communicated, the bug must be on the server side.
Luckily I didn't spend money or dilithium for shuttle speed ups or boosts. But if I was a whale, I'd wanted my huge loads of money back. Are any of the big spenders in contact with the support? I'm very interested in how they are going to work this out.
No need for targeted refunds. If people did better than others by inadvertently picking the optimal order, so be it. If someone had already figured this out and was keeping quiet about it to gain an advantage, well, good for them but the party's over now. We were all in the same boat on this one - on average, it's unlikely anyone gained a notable advantage prior to this investigation. If DB does figure out why the back end code is flawed (my preferred theory for the source of the issue), I would be sufficiently pleased if they said "oops, you guys were right, we've repaired it, and here's 10K honor for us being too stubborn to believe all the ranting was an accurate perception of a legitimate issue").
Maybe I'm just in a glass half-full kind of mood this morning.
But I agree. This event seemed more reasonable for failures after this was figured out. I think the dead giveaway was last week’s three ENG & shuttles with a paucity of ENG characters and everyone putting powerful event and bonus characters on the second skill to see high displayed success rates only to have massive fails rates.
DBs failure to communicate on it is hopeful just them being slow to react. Preferably they will address the issue and not stealth patch it so we know if it has been corrected or changed.
Players complain for months that there is something wrong with shuttle %, please fix it. DB gives the classic "it's just RNG, so working as intended". Player's figure out the problem, multiple players then test the proposed solution and report improved results, and DB can't so much as comment on it.
Now I get it, they don't want to make a hasty comment rather agreeing or shooting the answer to the problem down, but come on, at least acknowledge it! At the bare minimum, they could state that they will review the findings and see if they can confirm them.
Actually, Shan did reply. It's just in the original thread about this:
https://forum.disruptorbeam.com/stt/discussion/5050/experiment-findings-is-the-and-function-bugged-in-events/p1
So they're still looking into it, hopefully.