I am not on Linkedin but hoping some folk on here are - Please can you contact David Cham and let him know how we are feeling
He has this in his bio "* Experience Running Engineering/QA/Product to ship video game products to millions world wide."
Maybe we don't dox employees? I understand being upset, and if you find a work email I don't see a problem with that, but let's not put their personal profiles on display.
Just following up with my Google experience. Not only did they already refund the past 60 day purchase, they are reviewing all my Star Trek Timelines purchases since I started playing in 2017.
In the response I got from Google, they were concerned about the recent number of negative reviews and apparently Google feels they are legit.
Just following up with my Google experience. Not only did they already refund the past 60 day purchase, they are reviewing all my Star Trek Timelines purchases since I started playing in 2017.
In the response I got from Google, they were concerned about the recent number of negative reviews and apparently Google feels they are legit.
Shan has clearly decided to treat this like the AND bug. Ignore every thread and hope that is goes away.
It's not on the same level. A fully documented and proven bug being ignored is nowhere near as egregious as the cravenness of hiding under a table after they lit the fuse that burned the house down. It's pure, unadulterated cowardess and that applies to everybody at WRG/TP who has any authority in the decision including @Shan because I don't believe for one second that Shan was not involved in some capacity.
Except initially Shan was sending emails calling people "rude and a cheater". So he is involved at some level. At the very least he is trying cover for his buddies.
Just following up with my Google experience. Not only did they already refund the past 60 day purchase, they are reviewing all my Star Trek Timelines purchases since I started playing in 2017.
In the response I got from Google, they were concerned about the recent number of negative reviews and apparently Google feels they are legit.
You will lost access to account probably and game itself. So be prepared to never going back. :-)
I am not on Linkedin but hoping some folk on here are - Please can you contact David Cham and let him know how we are feeling
He has this in his bio "* Experience Running Engineering/QA/Product to ship video game products to millions world wide."
Maybe we don't dox employees? I understand being upset, and if you find a work email I don't see a problem with that, but let's not put their personal profiles on display.
It's not doxxing when it's freely available information. If an executive's name is listed on the website that's not doxxing when a simple google search for that name will pull up their LinkedIn profile as a top hit.
Just following up with my Google experience. Not only did they already refund the past 60 day purchase, they are reviewing all my Star Trek Timelines purchases since I started playing in 2017.
In the response I got from Google, they were concerned about the recent number of negative reviews and apparently Google feels they are legit.
You will lost access to account probably and game itself. So be prepared to never going back. :-)
I honestly had not realized how much money I put in this game totally. If I get the total amount back, I could care less about any sort of ban, because I already had a personal response from Shan yesterday calling me rude and a cheater.
Shan has clearly decided to treat this like the AND bug. Ignore every thread and hope that is goes away.
It's not on the same level. A fully documented and proven bug being ignored is nowhere near as egregious as the cravenness of hiding under a table after they lit the fuse that burned the house down. It's pure, unadulterated cowardess and that applies to everybody at WRG/TP who has any authority in the decision including @Shan because I don't believe for one second that Shan was not involved in some capacity.
Except initially Shan was sending emails calling people "rude and a cheater". So he is involved at some level. At the very least he is trying cover for his buddies.
Maybe if by the 14th page you realized Shan was a woman and stopped referring to her as a he you would have had better luck.
I haven't decided if I'm coming back or not. I'll see how I feel Sunday afternoon. I won't be spending any money on it for awhile either way. What they've done is wrong and I just won't be able to trust them. It won't be as much fun in the future.
Some fleets took tremendous advantage of the exploit through social media/discord, that exponentially magnified the issue and disadvantaged honest players. A 72 hour ban is NOT the end of the world, getting off scott-free would be a stab in the back to every player who didn't click 80 times... I hope Wicked Realm doesn't give in to crybabies or bullies.
Please don't hate on me for what I am about to say. First off, the reaction from TP is probably extreem, but then, we don't know what criteria they used to decide who to ban (poor transparency and communication). But we know they had to do something. I come to this conclusion because I remember the debacle a long time ago with a bugged pack that gave out a ridiculous reward. In that case, there were players who got a ton of resources and it was WAY more evident that the issue was a bug. At first there was a mixed response. I remember how upset some of the players were that others were getting away with something.
If TP had done nothing, many of those complaining here would be complaining that they were.cheated because some people "got away" with something. I'm not saying this justifies a ban or just how far TP should have gone, but I think we can calm a bit and rationally agree something had to be done. I can also agree that we should have heard something more from them, but in the present mood of the most active and vocal player base, I don't think people would be satisfied with any answer. (Although in one of these hundreds of posts I did see one good theoretical letter a player proposed.)
I advise a bit more calm and patience. From all sides. We will eventually get a response.
Also, as previously mentioned, if you seek out a refund, don't post about getting it and then expect to keep playing. That was made very clear in previous community uproars.
What really bugs me, is that while I was pushing the button to buy it again and trying to figure out what I was buying it with, I was actually exploiting the game. If they had only tried this for themselves instead of throwing a 3 year old's tantrum, they would have seen that they made a hole that anyone would have fallen into.
Some fleets took tremendous advantage of the exploit through social media/discord, that exponentially magnified the issue and disadvantaged honest players. A 72 hour ban is NOT the end of the world, getting off scott-free would be a stab in the back to every player who didn't click 80 times... I hope Wicked Realm doesn't give in to crybabies or bullies.
Way to be rude and to lump everyone into the same boat.
I speak as someone who is the only one from their fleet banned. Who pressed a 'buy again' button five or so times - certainly less than the nineteen that y'all got after my ban. And who didn't profit from the honour bonanza years back.
...I won't be spending any money on it for awhile either way. What they've done is wrong and I just won't be able to trust them. It won't be as much fun in the future.
This is where I am right now. There will be no more money spent, and I have spent a lot over these last, nearly 5, years. The longer they take before even the barest, minimum attempt at making this right, the closer I am to just leaving my fleet and abandoning the game.
I was not among the banned, but @Shan 's response that leads this thread is among the worst customer service blunders I've seen from a company in a long time. It will have the exact opposite effect the company owners want: revenue is going to tank.
"I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?!'" - Chris Knight
Moderator of r/startrektimelines Fleet - Inner Planets Alliance Fleet of Pubs Captain Level - 99 Player since - May 2016
Please don't hate on me for what I am about to say. First off, the reaction from TP is probably extreem, but then, we don't know what criteria they used to decide who to ban (poor transparency and communication). But we know they had to do something. I come to this conclusion because I remember the debacle a long time ago with a bugged pack that gave out a ridiculous reward. In that case, there were players who got a ton of resources and it was WAY more evident that the issue was a bug. At first there was a mixed response. I remember how upset some of the players were that others were getting away with something.
If TP had done nothing, many of those complaining here would be complaining that they were.cheated because some people "got away" with something. I'm not saying this justifies a ban or just how far TP should have gone, but I think we can calm a bit and rationally agree something had to be done. I can also agree that we should have heard something more from them, but in the present mood of the most active and vocal player base, I don't think people would be satisfied with any answer. (Although in one of these hundreds of posts I did see one good theoretical letter a player proposed.)
I advise a bit more calm and patience. From all sides. We will eventually get a response.
Also, as previously mentioned, if you seek out a refund, don't post about getting it and then expect to keep playing. That was made very clear in previous community uproars.
Why not make refunds public? People should be aware to what level and whom is offering refunds. Google is hooking people up!
Some fleets took tremendous advantage of the exploit through social media/discord, that exponentially magnified the issue and disadvantaged honest players. A 72 hour ban is NOT the end of the world, getting off scott-free would be a stab in the back to every player who didn't click 80 times... I hope Wicked Realm doesn't give in to crybabies or bullies.
Maybe actually reading everything before making a blanket statement would help in your perspective. Also, this was not an exploit; it was a feature that appeared in game and open to anyone who saw it. As per the TOS, the players are not at fault for a screw up by the programmer and TP suspending accounts breaches their own contracts with players. The fact Google Play is now looking into this says a whole different story than what TP is trying to spin.
There are three ways to do something; the right way, the wrong way, and the Janeway.
Shan has clearly decided to treat this like the AND bug. Ignore every thread and hope that is goes away.
It's not on the same level. A fully documented and proven bug being ignored is nowhere near as egregious as the cravenness of hiding under a table after they lit the fuse that burned the house down. It's pure, unadulterated cowardess and that applies to everybody at WRG/TP who has any authority in the decision including @Shan because I don't believe for one second that Shan was not involved in some capacity.
Except initially Shan was sending emails calling people "rude and a cheater". So he is involved at some level. At the very least he is trying cover for his buddies.
Maybe if by the 14th page you realized Shan was a woman and stopped referring to her as a he you would have had better luck.
Some fleets took tremendous advantage of the exploit through social media/discord, that exponentially magnified the issue and disadvantaged honest players. A 72 hour ban is NOT the end of the world, getting off scott-free would be a stab in the back to every player who didn't click 80 times... I hope Wicked Realm doesn't give in to crybabies or bullies.
Maybe actually reading everything before making a blanket statement would help in your perspective. Also, this was not an exploit; it was a feature that appeared in game and open to anyone who saw it. As per the TOS, the players are not at fault for a screw up by the programmer and TP suspending accounts breaches their own contracts with players. The fact Google Play is now looking into this says a whole different story than what TP is trying to spin.
That really is the difference here, isn't it? I don't see how this could possibly be a TOS breach.
I'm not saying this justifies a ban or just how far TP should have gone, but I think we can calm a bit and rationally agree something had to be done.
I would have had no issue returning the extra resources I only received because of TP's own mistake of accidentally coding new functionality ('buy more' button) into yesterday's retrieval pack, which I only claimed once.
Issuing an in-game apology with an explanation as to why the extra, unintended goodies were being returned would likely have made everybody happy.
How many people got banned? Maybe 1000?And they are the most active, or at least likely the most active. And maybe averaged between whales and non spenders, maybe $15 a month?So if 1000 who spend 15 a month walk, thats $180,000 a year, right?
Please don't hate on me for what I am about to say. First off, the reaction from TP is probably extreem, but then, we don't know what criteria they used to decide who to ban (poor transparency and communication). But we know they had to do something. I come to this conclusion because I remember the debacle a long time ago with a bugged pack that gave out a ridiculous reward. In that case, there were players who got a ton of resources and it was WAY more evident that the issue was a bug. At first there was a mixed response. I remember how upset some of the players were that others were getting away with something.
If TP had done nothing, many of those complaining here would be complaining that they were.cheated because some people "got away" with something. I'm not saying this justifies a ban or just how far TP should have gone, but I think we can calm a bit and rationally agree something had to be done. I can also agree that we should have heard something more from them, but in the present mood of the most active and vocal player base, I don't think people would be satisfied with any answer. (Although in one of these hundreds of posts I did see one good theoretical letter a player proposed.)
I advise a bit more calm and patience. From all sides. We will eventually get a response.
Also, as previously mentioned, if you seek out a refund, don't post about getting it and then expect to keep playing. That was made very clear in previous community uproars.
So I discovered that I got one more donate in the bag than I paid for this morning. What's the resolution? 1) The donate shop has to give everyone a free donate so they don't feel cheated. 2) Everyone who didn't get the free donate realizes that mistakes happen but it didn't really cost them anything. or 3) The Tilting Point way. I spend 3 days without donuts for exploiting the store.
Some fleets took tremendous advantage of the exploit through social media/discord, that exponentially magnified the issue and disadvantaged honest players. A 72 hour ban is NOT the end of the world, getting off scott-free would be a stab in the back to every player who didn't click 80 times... I hope Wicked Realm doesn't give in to crybabies or bullies.
Maybe actually reading everything before making a blanket statement would help in your perspective. Also, this was not an exploit; it was a feature that appeared in game and open to anyone who saw it. As per the TOS, the players are not at fault for a screw up by the programmer and TP suspending accounts breaches their own contracts with players. The fact Google Play is now looking into this says a whole different story than what TP is trying to spin.
That really is the difference here, isn't it? I don't see how this could possibly be a TOS breach.
Precisely. The only TOS breach that was performed was by TP putting a three day ban on any and all accounts who dared to have clicked that button at least one other time.
There are three ways to do something; the right way, the wrong way, and the Janeway.
I'm not saying this justifies a ban or just how far TP should have gone, but I think we can calm a bit and rationally agree something had to be done.
I would have had no issue returning the extra resources I only received because of TP's own mistake of accidentally coding new functionality ('buy more' button) into yesterday's retrieval pack.
Issuing an in-game apology with an explanation as to why the extra, unintended goodies were being returned would likely have made everybody happy.
That's why I didn't even cash in on anything. I figured it was a bug, it was going to be clawed back, and that would be the end of it. No harm, no foul, and a funny addition to the lore of the game (like "free butter"). I wouldn't have even needed an apology. A simple, "lol WHOOOOOOPS" and a clawback would have sufficed.
Now I'm mad, there's been no communication since yesterday, and I'm growing closer and closer to not coming back regardless of their response. This is one of the single worst PR blunders I have ever seen.
Well I was one of those banned and to be fair all I did was click the buy again button about 5 times when it then stopped, I did not seek to exploit anything it said buy again so I did like so many others
Yes the ban is totally draconian and as it currently stands I’m still banned so it looks like no one is listening upstairs
I enjoy the game but I’m having second thoughts about continuing
Let’s hope they reverse the desicion
Some fleets took tremendous advantage of the exploit through social media/discord, that exponentially magnified the issue and disadvantaged honest players. A 72 hour ban is NOT the end of the world, getting off scott-free would be a stab in the back to every player who didn't click 80 times... I hope Wicked Realm doesn't give in to crybabies or bullies.
And, what at the end those, like me, who “exploited” that bug gain? Constellations? Or maybe Polestars I can’t use, because quantum takes a month to refill? I don’t care about ban itself but how it was handled.
I'm not saying this justifies a ban or just how far TP should have gone, but I think we can calm a bit and rationally agree something had to be done.
I would have had no issue returning the extra resources I only received because of TP's own mistake of accidentally coding new functionality ('buy more' button) into yesterday's retrieval pack.
Issuing an in-game apology with an explanation as to why the extra, unintended goodies were being returned would likely have made everybody happy.
That's why I didn't even cash in on anything. I figured it was a bug, it was going to be clawed back, and that would be the end of it. No harm, no foul, and a funny addition to the lore of the game (like "free butter"). I wouldn't have even needed an apology. A simple, "lol WHOOOOOOPS" and a clawback would have sufficed.
Now I'm mad, there's been no communication since yesterday, and I'm growing closer and closer to not coming back regardless of their response. This is one of the single worst PR blunders I have ever seen.
It's pretty par for the course on this game. There's a huge blowup on the forums and you hear little or nothing official. Don't expect any further communication on this issue.
Everyone should leave 1 star reviews wherever they have the app, Apple, Google, Steam, Facebook, Amazon, Windows. Make sure this outrageous behavior by them is public. Don't let any new people get suckered in.
Please don't hate on me for what I am about to say. First off, the reaction from TP is probably extreem, but then, we don't know what criteria they used to decide who to ban (poor transparency and communication). But we know they had to do something. I come to this conclusion because I remember the debacle a long time ago with a bugged pack that gave out a ridiculous reward. In that case, there were players who got a ton of resources and it was WAY more evident that the issue was a bug. At first there was a mixed response. I remember how upset some of the players were that others were getting away with something.
If TP had done nothing, many of those complaining here would be complaining that they were.cheated because some people "got away" with something. I'm not saying this justifies a ban or just how far TP should have gone, but I think we can calm a bit and rationally agree something had to be done. I can also agree that we should have heard something more from them, but in the present mood of the most active and vocal player base, I don't think people would be satisfied with any answer. (Although in one of these hundreds of posts I did see one good theoretical letter a player proposed.)
I advise a bit more calm and patience. From all sides. We will eventually get a response.
Also, as previously mentioned, if you seek out a refund, don't post about getting it and then expect to keep playing. That was made very clear in previous community uproars.
Not hating on you, but in the previous case you cite (with which I am unfamiliar), where people took advantage of a bug and were rewarded with items that few others received, and were therefore given an advantage, were the players banned as well as having resources removed, or were the resources simply removed and the playing field again leveled?
I ask because if the latter response, then this is not the same situation. I'm pretty sure, having read most of the responses in this thread (though not all), that no one is saying that TP taking back the items that were received due to the bug yesterday is wrong. Everyone is taking issue with the bans. Previous bans for actual cheating were an order of magnitude less (8 hours as opposed to 72), and these bans, with their 3-day span, are cutting a swath of unintended consequences against most of the player base and many, many fleets, at a time when being in a fleet has become even more integral to success in this game with the mega-event and the introduction of a new feature that very much relies on fleet daily completions.
No one is saying actions to reverse the bug results aren't warranted. The degree of the response, the apparent vindictiveness, the pretty clear lack of caring about unintended consequences, and especially the fact that this was a mistake that is wholly on TP's developers—their UI trains people to push buttons that say "Buy Now"—are the real problem here.
Instead of taking a careful look at what occurred, going through scenarios of responses, and taking measured steps to respond, they issued knee-jerk, unwarranted bans that have decimated a lot of the player base far beyond those very few who took advantage of the bug. And, warranted or not, the fact that they've done this after clown-world level constant developer mistakes with every new thing added to the game in the last few months, has at this point removed most goodwill anyone has for TP and will have repercussions on their bottom line.
Their response was thoughtless, rather than reasoned and carefully considered, and they have likely crippled the company for a long time to come, if not permanently.
"I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?!'" - Chris Knight
Moderator of r/startrektimelines Fleet - Inner Planets Alliance Fleet of Pubs Captain Level - 99 Player since - May 2016
Everyone should leave 1 star reviews wherever they have the app, Apple, Google, Steam, Facebook, Amazon, Windows. Make sure this outrageous behavior by them is public. Don't let any new people get suckered in.
Everyone should leave 1 star reviews wherever they have the app, Apple, Google, Steam, Facebook, Amazon, Windows. Make sure this outrageous behavior by them is public. Don't let any new people get suckered in.
I tweeted at Kotaku too. Don't forget the press.
Excellent idea.
"I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?!'" - Chris Knight
Moderator of r/startrektimelines Fleet - Inner Planets Alliance Fleet of Pubs Captain Level - 99 Player since - May 2016
Comments
Maybe we don't dox employees? I understand being upset, and if you find a work email I don't see a problem with that, but let's not put their personal profiles on display.
In the response I got from Google, they were concerned about the recent number of negative reviews and apparently Google feels they are legit.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Except initially Shan was sending emails calling people "rude and a cheater". So he is involved at some level. At the very least he is trying cover for his buddies.
You will lost access to account probably and game itself. So be prepared to never going back. :-)
It's not doxxing when it's freely available information. If an executive's name is listed on the website that's not doxxing when a simple google search for that name will pull up their LinkedIn profile as a top hit.
I honestly had not realized how much money I put in this game totally. If I get the total amount back, I could care less about any sort of ban, because I already had a personal response from Shan yesterday calling me rude and a cheater.
Maybe if by the 14th page you realized Shan was a woman and stopped referring to her as a he you would have had better luck.
If TP had done nothing, many of those complaining here would be complaining that they were.cheated because some people "got away" with something. I'm not saying this justifies a ban or just how far TP should have gone, but I think we can calm a bit and rationally agree something had to be done. I can also agree that we should have heard something more from them, but in the present mood of the most active and vocal player base, I don't think people would be satisfied with any answer. (Although in one of these hundreds of posts I did see one good theoretical letter a player proposed.)
I advise a bit more calm and patience. From all sides. We will eventually get a response.
Also, as previously mentioned, if you seek out a refund, don't post about getting it and then expect to keep playing. That was made very clear in previous community uproars.
Way to be rude and to lump everyone into the same boat.
I speak as someone who is the only one from their fleet banned. Who pressed a 'buy again' button five or so times - certainly less than the nineteen that y'all got after my ban. And who didn't profit from the honour bonanza years back.
This is where I am right now. There will be no more money spent, and I have spent a lot over these last, nearly 5, years. The longer they take before even the barest, minimum attempt at making this right, the closer I am to just leaving my fleet and abandoning the game.
I was not among the banned, but @Shan 's response that leads this thread is among the worst customer service blunders I've seen from a company in a long time. It will have the exact opposite effect the company owners want: revenue is going to tank.
Moderator of r/startrektimelines
Fleet - Inner Planets Alliance Fleet of Pubs
Captain Level - 99
Player since - May 2016
Why not make refunds public? People should be aware to what level and whom is offering refunds. Google is hooking people up!
Maybe actually reading everything before making a blanket statement would help in your perspective. Also, this was not an exploit; it was a feature that appeared in game and open to anyone who saw it. As per the TOS, the players are not at fault for a screw up by the programmer and TP suspending accounts breaches their own contracts with players. The fact Google Play is now looking into this says a whole different story than what TP is trying to spin.
DB: Do Better.
Member of Starship Trista.
Comment moderated. ~Shan
That really is the difference here, isn't it? I don't see how this could possibly be a TOS breach.
I would have had no issue returning the extra resources I only received because of TP's own mistake of accidentally coding new functionality ('buy more' button) into yesterday's retrieval pack, which I only claimed once.
Issuing an in-game apology with an explanation as to why the extra, unintended goodies were being returned would likely have made everybody happy.
Lets walk. Hit em where it hurts
So I discovered that I got one more donate in the bag than I paid for this morning. What's the resolution? 1) The donate shop has to give everyone a free donate so they don't feel cheated. 2) Everyone who didn't get the free donate realizes that mistakes happen but it didn't really cost them anything. or 3) The Tilting Point way. I spend 3 days without donuts for exploiting the store.
Guess which store I won't be visiting soon.
Precisely. The only TOS breach that was performed was by TP putting a three day ban on any and all accounts who dared to have clicked that button at least one other time.
DB: Do Better.
Member of Starship Trista.
That's why I didn't even cash in on anything. I figured it was a bug, it was going to be clawed back, and that would be the end of it. No harm, no foul, and a funny addition to the lore of the game (like "free butter"). I wouldn't have even needed an apology. A simple, "lol WHOOOOOOPS" and a clawback would have sufficed.
Now I'm mad, there's been no communication since yesterday, and I'm growing closer and closer to not coming back regardless of their response. This is one of the single worst PR blunders I have ever seen.
Yes the ban is totally draconian and as it currently stands I’m still banned so it looks like no one is listening upstairs
I enjoy the game but I’m having second thoughts about continuing
Let’s hope they reverse the desicion
And, what at the end those, like me, who “exploited” that bug gain? Constellations? Or maybe Polestars I can’t use, because quantum takes a month to refill? I don’t care about ban itself but how it was handled.
It's pretty par for the course on this game. There's a huge blowup on the forums and you hear little or nothing official. Don't expect any further communication on this issue.
Everyone should leave 1 star reviews wherever they have the app, Apple, Google, Steam, Facebook, Amazon, Windows. Make sure this outrageous behavior by them is public. Don't let any new people get suckered in.
Not hating on you, but in the previous case you cite (with which I am unfamiliar), where people took advantage of a bug and were rewarded with items that few others received, and were therefore given an advantage, were the players banned as well as having resources removed, or were the resources simply removed and the playing field again leveled?
I ask because if the latter response, then this is not the same situation. I'm pretty sure, having read most of the responses in this thread (though not all), that no one is saying that TP taking back the items that were received due to the bug yesterday is wrong. Everyone is taking issue with the bans. Previous bans for actual cheating were an order of magnitude less (8 hours as opposed to 72), and these bans, with their 3-day span, are cutting a swath of unintended consequences against most of the player base and many, many fleets, at a time when being in a fleet has become even more integral to success in this game with the mega-event and the introduction of a new feature that very much relies on fleet daily completions.
No one is saying actions to reverse the bug results aren't warranted. The degree of the response, the apparent vindictiveness, the pretty clear lack of caring about unintended consequences, and especially the fact that this was a mistake that is wholly on TP's developers—their UI trains people to push buttons that say "Buy Now"—are the real problem here.
Instead of taking a careful look at what occurred, going through scenarios of responses, and taking measured steps to respond, they issued knee-jerk, unwarranted bans that have decimated a lot of the player base far beyond those very few who took advantage of the bug. And, warranted or not, the fact that they've done this after clown-world level constant developer mistakes with every new thing added to the game in the last few months, has at this point removed most goodwill anyone has for TP and will have repercussions on their bottom line.
Their response was thoughtless, rather than reasoned and carefully considered, and they have likely crippled the company for a long time to come, if not permanently.
Moderator of r/startrektimelines
Fleet - Inner Planets Alliance Fleet of Pubs
Captain Level - 99
Player since - May 2016
I tweeted at Kotaku too. Don't forget the press.
Proud Former Officer of The Gluten Empire
Retired 12-14-20. So long, and thanks for all the cat pics!
Excellent idea.
Moderator of r/startrektimelines
Fleet - Inner Planets Alliance Fleet of Pubs
Captain Level - 99
Player since - May 2016