I think the damage from the combo chain should be awarded to those unlocking the nodes. The way it is now, that damage is "lost", and damage is what determines personal rewards. The amount of Boss hull is the score the players are pursuing. Less damage (score) awarded to players is less rewards, either lesser rewards for those playing, or not enough hull to destroy for the rest of players willing to participate (Add to that, that for you to unlock nodes, you need to try different cards other than your optimal crew for damage, so you deal less damage, while attempting to reduce the pool of points awarded to players)
My fleet has 1 node left on Brutal that is Federation (it must be hiding on the invisible 4th row) and 2 other traits, at least 1 of which is also hiding out of sight.
Noble merits have been lost trying to unlock it using traits from the visible rows, before realizing there even was a fourth row.
Someone posted this on my fleet's Discord, haven't tried it myself.
I think the damage from the combo chain should be awarded to those unlocking the nodes. The way it is now, that damage is "lost", and damage is what determines personal rewards. The amount of Boss hull is the score the players are pursuing. Less damage (score) awarded to players is less rewards, either lesser rewards for those playing, or not enough hull to destroy for the rest of players willing to participate (Add to that, that for you to unlock nodes, you need to try different cards other than your optimal crew for damage, so you deal less damage, while attempting to reduce the pool of points awarded to players)
Awarding the damage to the player(s) who unlock the nodes ignores the work put in by the rest of the fleet in figuring out the combos. When I run out of Valor I kill time figuring out which crew could fit the remaining combos and posting suggestions for the rest of the fleet to try. There's others in the fleet doing the same thing. Awarding all the damage to the individual who follows up on those suggestions is ignoring the whole "fleet cooperation" side of things.
I think the damage from the combo chain should be awarded to those unlocking the nodes. The way it is now, that damage is "lost", and damage is what determines personal rewards. The amount of Boss hull is the score the players are pursuing. Less damage (score) awarded to players is less rewards, either lesser rewards for those playing, or not enough hull to destroy for the rest of players willing to participate (Add to that, that for you to unlock nodes, you need to try different cards other than your optimal crew for damage, so you deal less damage, while attempting to reduce the pool of points awarded to players)
Awarding the damage to the player(s) who unlock the nodes ignores the work put in by the rest of the fleet in figuring out the combos. When I run out of Valor I kill time figuring out which crew could fit the remaining combos and posting suggestions for the rest of the fleet to try. There's others in the fleet doing the same thing. Awarding all the damage to the individual who follows up on those suggestions is ignoring the whole "fleet cooperation" side of things.
I think this honestly evens out. In my experience, there are people who focus on clearing nodes, and those who just put up dmg numbers. Yeah, I may not get the benefits from clearing every node I contribute to, but if I get the benefit from 1/2 of them, its worth it. I don't think any solution is perfect, but this is still better than the current situation where a bunch of people are sacrificial lambs dumping time, chrons and dilithium to take out half the boss then have to burn more dill just to get individual rewards
One observation, my fleet has basically stopped trying for traits, at least at our current level. The merit cost of swapping crew, the 30% damage that fleet members cant earn to get rewards, the lost damage from using sub-optimal crew, it all contributes to not wanting to search for traits.
If WRG wants us to continue to search for traits, the process needs to be reworked to fix the merit burn and give credit for people unlocking the traits.
If there was a realistic way to award evenly to those trying the nodes, it could work. But how you determine who really tries for the node and who doesn't. There are probably more design problems.
If you award the damage to those finding the actual crew, at least you reward someone that got either lucky or were helped (I don't think I would be upset about others receiving because I helped them with suggestions, quite the contrary)
Anyway, the current system, that "burns" the damage, doesn't work
Regarding the lack of workaround for unavailable crew, can't you just limit the selection pool to crew in the portal? This would be the most ideal and fair approach
The other issue of not everyone getting rewards is that the players that do use those rewards to get more points the next round and more rewards. The playing field gets more and more unfair the longer this continues.
If there was a realistic way to award evenly to those trying the nodes, it could work. But how you determine who really tries for the node and who doesn't. There are probably more design problems.
If you award the damage to those finding the actual crew, at least you reward someone that got either lucky or were helped (I don't think I would be upset about others receiving because I helped them with suggestions, quite the contrary)
Anyway, the current system, that "burns" the damage, doesn't work
All the more reason why this fleet feature should never have included personal rankings/rewards. The whole point of working together is being collaborative and complimentary - some work towards nodes & others work for damage, some are veteran players & others are newbies - you succeed or fail as a fleet, and gain rewards as a fleet.
The new items are used in your captain's bridge upgrades. Kemocite starts being used during level 2.
Rob W
So in other words, since my tiny fleet can't even beat the easy level to get kemocite I'll never be able to get my bridge past level 2. Nice.
I believe he means level two upgrades.
When level 2 rewards appear you still have level 1 upgrades to do. But only two are helpful, hull and reduced damage.
I do not understand why my damage of the boss went down. Now that I am doing level 2 rewards. Is there a bug not giving the previous upgrades any more in boss battles.
Why have Brutal and Nitemare for 50/75% destruction the very same amounts of items(Kemocite) for the Captains Bridge? Shouldn t Nitemare have better rewards overall, since its harder to accomplish the same amount of damage? And i m not speaking about the higher merits and useless Replicator Ration rewards.
And btw can you please consider to replace the Replicator Rations with something more useful?
Regarding the lack of workaround for unavailable crew, can't you just limit the selection pool to crew in the portal? This would be the most ideal and fair approach
This is imperative. It was addresses in the in game mail that some traits were shown for crew unavailable, but it goes far beyond that example. We had a node yesterday morning that required a SR Aenar, the only one being in the treshold rewards of the event starting the same day. We had to wait until we reached the reward to clear it, but it could have been worst (reward of next week event, or someone released only in a pack, reward in the highter levels of captain's bridge, etc)
Not even a mention that the merit black hole would be addressed. But I quit thinking WRG would have any shame at all when it came to forcing people to spend buckets of money a long time ago. As bad as DB was at a lot of things, I'd rather have them back to be honest. They weren't as shamelessly greedy.
Things would be updated slower, but at least the game wouldn't be openly hostile to free and low spending players.
Not even a mention that the merit black hole would be addressed. But I quit thinking WRG would have any shame at all when it came to forcing people to spend buckets of money a long time ago. As bad as DB was at a lot of things, I'd rather have them back to be honest. They weren't as shamelessly greedy.
Things would be updated slower, but at least the game wouldn't be openly hostile to free and low spending players.
This is only our first more urgent pass, we will continue to monitor our data and player feedback as days go by.
Look there is a lot of bugs, they said there would be. I have faith they will work on them and ultimately everyone has to admit that it has increased everyone's communication in their fleet and it has stole my week with all the time spent lol.
Also I caught the Boss missing my ship so nothing to do with anything but here is a brag post:
Not even a mention that the merit black hole would be addressed. But I quit thinking WRG would have any shame at all when it came to forcing people to spend buckets of money a long time ago. As bad as DB was at a lot of things, I'd rather have them back to be honest. They weren't as shamelessly greedy.
Things would be updated slower, but at least the game wouldn't be openly hostile to free and low spending players.
This is only our first more urgent pass, we will continue to monitor our data and player feedback as days go by.
I'm not sure how bleeding everyone dry on resources in the first 2 days of a beta isn't urgent. But by all means, fix the incorrect icon. That's surely more important.
So, multiple players in my fleet (who have been keeping track of how much damage they do in each attack) have just noticed that the number shown on the leaderboard is slightly less than what's being shown in the results screen of the attack. Anyone else notice this, or know why it would happen?
The merit cost to thaw and refreeze is tremendous and unsustainable. It would be nice if we could either have more space for thawed crews, or a reduced cost for thawing during fleet battles, or more ways of earning merits. (Maybe add them to voyages.)
I fear people will stop playing fleet battles once the honeymoon phase is over once they realize the "cost."
A healthy attitude is contagious but don't wait to catch it from others. Be a carrier.
Here is a 'simple' fix to the whole losing points for attempting trait matches. Give a damage multiplier for each crew slot applied to attempting a match. That should make it worthwhile for people to attempt rather than ignore as well as adding value to failing.
This could be abused by attempting with someone that is known to be not a match though. But let the players abuse the game rather than the game abusing the players.
I upgraded my bridge from level 1 to level 2 and then played a normal battle. The crew that I just selected were removed and the ship was crewless. I ran a second normal attack and it ran with the selected crew but at a reduced damage. I ran a third attack on easy and it ran crewless as well.
Then I went looking for my 4* Behold and it was not issued for upgrading the Bridge.
Has anyone had the crew taken off their ship? I think other people are missing earned rewards.
I upgraded my bridge from level 1 to level 2 and then played a normal battle. The crew that I just selected were removed and the ship was crewless. I ran a second normal attack and it ran with the selected crew but at a reduced damage. I ran a third attack on easy and it ran crewless as well.
Then I went looking for my 4* Behold and it was not issued for upgrading the Bridge.
Has anyone had the crew taken off their ship? I think other people are missing earned rewards.
For the reward please look in the Honor Hall, it is a Super Rare Behold there, not in the time portal.
So, multiple players in my fleet (who have been keeping track of how much damage they do in each attack) have just noticed that the number shown on the leaderboard is slightly less than what's being shown in the results screen of the attack. Anyone else notice this, or know why it would happen?
I noticed that the leaderboard is slow to update. I ran a battle, the leaderboard didn't reflect it, then a minute later it showed up. I didn't count exact numbers, but it looked correct roughly to the order of 100k. I noticed it was missing when I was short millions until the leaderboard updated. But if you were scoring less then maybe that's what they were seeing.
Thanks Shran, I found it!!!! So the best part of FBB is hide and seek!!!
What about the Crewless Ships? I was only dealing damage but I would be upset if I had pulled crew to unlock a node and had a dud!!!
I am not blue and I do not have antennas
I would need more reports of crew being unseated like that to be able to investigate.
We can however look if it would be best to disallow engaging in a battle without crew.
I encountered a weird glitch where I had two Valor, then the game said I had 4 Valor, then when I did an attack to get the refill timer running again, it said I was down to 1 (I already sent in a ticket). This is a problem for me because it usually takes 4 attacks (3 if I'm lucky) to hit the personal threshold on Hard, so I usually wait until my Valor is maxed out, and that way I can attack until I hit the threshold instead of doing a little damage and hoping the same boss will still be there when I get more Valor. But this time, because I thought my Valor was maxed out and it turned out to not be, I was back in that position of just hoping the same boss will still be there when I get more Valor. 45 minutes later, I got a second Valor, and the boss I had done some damage to was almost defeated, so I decided to take a chance and use my two Valor, if I got a good crit, then I could get over the threshold and not have wasted my Valor.
Well, my gamble didn't pay off, not even close. I don't really feel bad that I wasted 3 Valor instead of 1, because I wasn't gonna max out until the middle of the night anyway (that is, after spending the one when I thought it was already maxed this afternoon). But whether it's 1 or 3, I do really hate that I spent something and got nothing.
For me, there's something almost gut-wrenchingly annoying about putting time, effort or resources into something and getting absolutely nothing to show for it. I think there's probably nothing else I hate more in video games. So, the way they handle this fix and restructuring of the rewards is very pivotal to whether people like me are gonna want to keep playing this feature. For myself, it's usually pretty manageable because I have the flexibility to get on the game at different times of day, so I can generally just wait till I'm maxed out and go from 0 to threshold on Hard. But when it doesn't work out that way, it really hurts, and there are probably a lot of other players who hate that feeling as much as I do but don't have the flexibility to mitigate the risk factor like I can. I feel like the entire success or failure of this feature will rest on how they redo rewards (and maybe something to do with how much merits people spend on thawing).
The ship battles tell you if you are missing crew but I had all my crew manually selected and pushed attack. They were abducted by aliens or airlocked by pirates.
For the Valor display issue, it could be a refresh problem, something we will look into but I am wondering if it helps to go into the purchase flow and see what the pop up shows.
If I understand the message sent out correctly, the fact that players who don't collect individual damage rewards won't qualify for fleet rewards? That's even worse and really needs fixed, or if it's a "clarification" just changed completely!
That happened a little while ago, so I can't remember whether I checked the purchase screen or not. I was probably eager to go ahead and do an attack so the refill clock would start running again (which wouldn't be a problem if Valor didn't have a maximum, like chrons and almost every other currency don't).
That's one of those "oh well, I'll know for next time" things that I understand can happen in a beta stage, but I'm just trying to explain how fixing this rewards issue could be the make-or-break factor of whether people ultimately embrace this feature or not.
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Captain Zombie's Combo chain calculator
Someone posted this on my fleet's Discord, haven't tried it myself.
Awarding the damage to the player(s) who unlock the nodes ignores the work put in by the rest of the fleet in figuring out the combos. When I run out of Valor I kill time figuring out which crew could fit the remaining combos and posting suggestions for the rest of the fleet to try. There's others in the fleet doing the same thing. Awarding all the damage to the individual who follows up on those suggestions is ignoring the whole "fleet cooperation" side of things.
I think this honestly evens out. In my experience, there are people who focus on clearing nodes, and those who just put up dmg numbers. Yeah, I may not get the benefits from clearing every node I contribute to, but if I get the benefit from 1/2 of them, its worth it. I don't think any solution is perfect, but this is still better than the current situation where a bunch of people are sacrificial lambs dumping time, chrons and dilithium to take out half the boss then have to burn more dill just to get individual rewards
If WRG wants us to continue to search for traits, the process needs to be reworked to fix the merit burn and give credit for people unlocking the traits.
If you award the damage to those finding the actual crew, at least you reward someone that got either lucky or were helped (I don't think I would be upset about others receiving because I helped them with suggestions, quite the contrary)
Anyway, the current system, that "burns" the damage, doesn't work
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Captain Zombie's Combo chain calculator
All the more reason why this fleet feature should never have included personal rankings/rewards. The whole point of working together is being collaborative and complimentary - some work towards nodes & others work for damage, some are veteran players & others are newbies - you succeed or fail as a fleet, and gain rewards as a fleet.
I believe he means level two upgrades.
When level 2 rewards appear you still have level 1 upgrades to do. But only two are helpful, hull and reduced damage.
I do not understand why my damage of the boss went down. Now that I am doing level 2 rewards. Is there a bug not giving the previous upgrades any more in boss battles.
And btw can you please consider to replace the Replicator Rations with something more useful?
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Captain Zombie's Combo chain calculator
Things would be updated slower, but at least the game wouldn't be openly hostile to free and low spending players.
This is only our first more urgent pass, we will continue to monitor our data and player feedback as days go by.
Also I caught the Boss missing my ship so nothing to do with anything but here is a brag post:
Got almost 6 million for that in Hard mode:
I'm not sure how bleeding everyone dry on resources in the first 2 days of a beta isn't urgent. But by all means, fix the incorrect icon. That's surely more important.
I fear people will stop playing fleet battles once the honeymoon phase is over once they realize the "cost."
This could be abused by attempting with someone that is known to be not a match though. But let the players abuse the game rather than the game abusing the players.
Then I went looking for my 4* Behold and it was not issued for upgrading the Bridge.
Has anyone had the crew taken off their ship? I think other people are missing earned rewards.
For the reward please look in the Honor Hall, it is a Super Rare Behold there, not in the time portal.
What about the Crewless Ships? I was only dealing damage but I would be upset if I had pulled crew to unlock a node and had a dud!!!
I noticed that the leaderboard is slow to update. I ran a battle, the leaderboard didn't reflect it, then a minute later it showed up. I didn't count exact numbers, but it looked correct roughly to the order of 100k. I noticed it was missing when I was short millions until the leaderboard updated. But if you were scoring less then maybe that's what they were seeing.
I am not blue and I do not have antennas
I would need more reports of crew being unseated like that to be able to investigate.
We can however look if it would be best to disallow engaging in a battle without crew.
Well, my gamble didn't pay off, not even close. I don't really feel bad that I wasted 3 Valor instead of 1, because I wasn't gonna max out until the middle of the night anyway (that is, after spending the one when I thought it was already maxed this afternoon). But whether it's 1 or 3, I do really hate that I spent something and got nothing.
For me, there's something almost gut-wrenchingly annoying about putting time, effort or resources into something and getting absolutely nothing to show for it. I think there's probably nothing else I hate more in video games. So, the way they handle this fix and restructuring of the rewards is very pivotal to whether people like me are gonna want to keep playing this feature. For myself, it's usually pretty manageable because I have the flexibility to get on the game at different times of day, so I can generally just wait till I'm maxed out and go from 0 to threshold on Hard. But when it doesn't work out that way, it really hurts, and there are probably a lot of other players who hate that feeling as much as I do but don't have the flexibility to mitigate the risk factor like I can. I feel like the entire success or failure of this feature will rest on how they redo rewards (and maybe something to do with how much merits people spend on thawing).
Is it incorrect too or does it force a refresh?
That happened a little while ago, so I can't remember whether I checked the purchase screen or not. I was probably eager to go ahead and do an attack so the refill clock would start running again (which wouldn't be a problem if Valor didn't have a maximum, like chrons and almost every other currency don't).
That's one of those "oh well, I'll know for next time" things that I understand can happen in a beta stage, but I'm just trying to explain how fixing this rewards issue could be the make-or-break factor of whether people ultimately embrace this feature or not.