The "combo chain" interface can wrongly suggest crew that cannot be used to solve the node they're listed for. It's an impossibility under specific circumstances:
* the suggested crew is not in the portal
* the suggested crew has both the open trait and (at least) two traits listed in the general trait pool
* no other crew in the portal has the specific combination of traits
as an example of the above, see the following screenshots. as you can see, dahj on the run was suggested for the botanist + ? + ? node, with the possible traits in the interface being listed as only civilian and survivalist.
however, using unsanctioned third-party tools we can learn, that this dahj variant is the only one in the game with these three traits. thus she would've been excluded from being a viable choice after the fbb update, that stopped using non-portal crew as the source for possible trait combos.
i thought this was common knowledge and was surprised nobody in my fleet knew about it, so i'm posting it here.
Crew select will show you crew that YOU have that COULD potentially satisfy the node, based on the list of traits shown.
I've highlighted the relevant part of your comment, because my assertion is, that dahj on the run, the crew used in the example I showed in my previous post, cannot be the correct crew to unlock that node. if it's impossible for dahj to unlock the node, she shouldn't be listed as a suggestion.
Before August 2nd you would have been correct, but in that day's server update you wrote the following:
- Fleet Boss Battles: a change has been implemented to ensure that the traits requirements to unlock nodes only pull from traits from crew available in Crew Retrieval/Time Portal
with this change, any trait combination required for a node unlock has to be present on at least one crew that's in the portal/crew retrieval.
please take a look at the screenshot below as proof that the trait combination of botanist + civilian + survivalist doesn't exist on any crew currently in the portal:
since we have now established that this specific combination doesn't exist on any crew in the portal, it should also stand that the combination cannot be the requirement in fleet boss battles either. if there is a 0% chance that this crew can unlock the node, it shouldn't be listed as a suggestion.
This does not mean that that particular node requires a crew with : Botanist, Survivalist, Civilian.
That's why the other crew displayed has another a different set of traits: Douwd, Civilain, Botanist.
What ended up being the traits combo for that particular node?
we haven't had problems with boss battles or node unlocks, in this case we easily found kevin uxbridge (botanist + civilian + dowd) to be the correct solution. thank you for your help though
Crew Select will show available crew that:
- have the revealed trait for the node
- have traits that are displayed in the trait list
For this case, having done the research and seen that only a crew not yet in the Time Portal had the traits Botanist, Survivalist, Civilian - was the clue that those were not the traits for that node.
The change that was made ensures nodes will require a trait combination that is only found on crew not yet in the time portal.
If crew select showed only crew that can resolve the node, that would be too easy.
If it showed only crew available in the Time Portal that would deprive you of the ability to use crew you possess and that could very well resolve a node due to the fact that the traits combination is found on various crew, some limited, some not.
i can accept that approach - it's a bug, but we're selling it as a feature - but i feel dissatisfied with the official stance on it.
After our conversation here, the only undeniable fact is this: the in-game crew-select feature changed how it worked on august 2nd, but this fact hasn't been mentioned anywhere that i can remember. on that day it stopped showing real suggestions of crew that have a chance at unlocking the node. the list now is merely a collection of crew that happen to share a sufficient number of traits and it's now up to players to know whether any of the listed combinations are a possibility or not.
how we should know (or learn) that with 40k+ combinations in the game (and sometimes over a hundred for a single chain) is beyond me. the game doesn't provide any easy to use method to check this, after all. in the end, this approach results in an average false-positive rate of listed non-portal crew that can be as high as 54%!
it didn't dawn on me until i ran the numbers, how significant a problem this would turn out to be. to me, it's a very deceptive method of knowingly tricking players into using more valor and spending dilithium on certain failure. and you've just confirmed this isn't caused by a bug but completely intentional.
it encourages me even more to solely rely on unsanctioned third-party tools that can get around these pitfalls. that said, i'm happy there's clarity on the topic. i'll now go and enjoy playing the game.
finally, here's the raw numbers to support my claim, for full transparency and as raw unbiased information:
total crew: 1,264
non-portal crew: 152
total distinct trait combinations of all crew: 42,889
... of portal crew: 38,129
... of non-portal crew: 8,831
... of non-portal crew shared with portal crew: 4,071
... of non-portal crew exclusive to non-portal crew: 4,760
Please can we make a request for combo crew eligibility.
We have several players in my fleet who started playing within the very first few months of the game launch. Yet between us we have identified twelve 4-star crew that nobody has and are unavailable in crew retrieval.
We don’t expect to have access to retrieve all crew - obviously that it how you make money
However if we are unable to acquire these crew and they appear in boss battle combos then we will be blocked from progress. Given that we are spending significant resources and dilithium for these battles this is unfair.
Please can the developers confirm and make an undertaking that combo crew possibilities will be limited to crew available in retrieval or through achievement rewards ONLY.
I just refueled my voyage antimatter. I should have gotten 2970. But I got 2920.
I just lost two antimatter after refresh.
My voyage started with 2970 AM. I guess they round to the nearest ten's or they truncate the one's digit.
Now that I realize how the original number is generated I would say my FBB AM bonus was subtracted for refuel. Which means they truncate the one's digit.
My bonus AM for 2950AM is 23.6. 2973.6 truncate the one's (and less) digit is then 2970.
With subtraction on refuel instead of addition, 2950-23.6= 2926.4 truncate the one's (and less) digits then is 2920 which is what I got.
I had the hologram ship. It is 9/10. My mistake , refill was correct.
If it showed only crew available in the Time Portal that would deprive you of the ability to use crew you possess and that could very well resolve a node due to the fact that the traits combination is found on various crew, some limited, some not.
I hope this is clearer, let me know if it is not.
For all combo crew slots there should be at least one match for crew available via Crew Retrieval or Achievement Rewards. There is no need to exclude any crew from the filtered list if they are additional possible matches.
This approach gives benefit to those that have obtained exclusive crew.
More importantly, it avoids blocking the entire fleet from progressing in a battle because a randomly picked exclusive crew member is a Unicorn.
Of course other fleets may vary but in ours none of us have any of these crew and there is no means available to acquire them:
Botanist Sulu
Cowpoke Boimler
Fanboy Boimler
First Monarch Kaitaama
Keyla Terrana
Meditative T'Pol
Outpost Vina
Pirate Tendi
Roy Ritterhouse
Rumpelstiltskin
Shroomies
Willie Hawkins
This is not a request to make these crew retrievable, only that they are excluded from being required to unlock a combo slot. We just want it actually possible to find a match.
Please can we make a request for combo crew eligibility.
We have several players in my fleet who started playing within the very first few months of the game launch. Yet between us we have identified twelve 4-star crew that nobody has and are unavailable in crew retrieval.
We don’t expect to have access to retrieve all crew - obviously that it how you make money
However if we are unable to acquire these crew and they appear in boss battle combos then we will be blocked from progress. Given that we are spending significant resources and dilithium for these battles this is unfair.
Please can the developers confirm and make an undertaking that combo crew possibilities will be limited to crew available in retrieval or through achievement rewards ONLY.
This was implemented.
If you have reasons to believe that's not the case we would need examples.
Not just a list of crew like you've posted after this post, but a screenshot with the combo, preferably while the battle is still active.
Submitting a ticket would also help.
I do not see any other reports of this, as I said earlier this was addressed a few weeks ago.
Apologies for the delay, I have seen this bug twice.
I went to bed about 1am, in the UK. Before going to bed, I used up all my remaining valor.
I was rudely awoken at 7:30 am by my alarm clock. Checking my game it claimed I had 4 valor, I was expecting 2 (or possibly 3). Pressing the valor display, also showed my valor was full.
I quickly did one FBB battle, and my valor dropped down to 1.
So, although the game had correctly remembered my valor, I guess on the server, the client had decided that I had full valor.
Reset is about 6 am in the UK (Summer time), and the client was running all night. This is on Android.
This was the second time I had seen this display bug.
I had 2 battles where it did not add my damage points to my total.
As you can see it only shows 1.7M of damage when I did 18M+ twice, I noticed it and screenshot just one of the battles
It would be nice to be able to review unsolved nodes after the battle ends especially when people try multiple times to solve a node.
It does not look like this was an issue as I no longer see that particular node.
I see you've submitted a ticket for this, when asking for help for FBB please provide as much information as possible such as the difficulty level and screenshot.
But please know that you will not receive an immediate reply and that Support will not divulge who can unlock the node.
This was the 5th node on Nightmare that just ended. There were no matching crew using 3rd party tool that contain the entire crew catalogue. My fleet tried all the available matches.
This was the 5th node on Nightmare that just ended. There were no matching crew using 3rd party tool that contain the entire crew catalogue. My fleet tried all the available matches.
I am sorry you were not able to pass that node, unfortunately as the battle has ended, it is not something that Support will be able to look into.
These are getting quite annoying. Not getting any damage credit and losing a valor each time. It happens randomly, but it's like the fourth or fifth time this month.
The Guardians of Tomorrow Protecting the Galaxy's Future from itself
These are getting quite annoying. Not getting any damage credit and losing a valor each time. It happens randomly, but it's like the fourth or fifth time this month.
I think I may have found a "feature" with FBB & Supply Kits.
- Our NM FBB was in flight at the start of the skirmish event, with approx 3 hrs remaining after the start of the event.
- I applied a Supply kit soon after event start and proceeded to generate approx 150K intel
- played event to 100K VP
- generated another 60k or 70K intel
I know for sure the supply kit was active up to this stage
- dealt the last 30M or so damage to Boss, defeated it and collected rewards
- played event a little more
- generated some more intel - maybe 20k - 30k
- did my replications
- went to bed
This morning - supply kit is not active. I am also unsure if the supply kit was active after the Boss was killed, but that is the only "different" action to have happened in my game from a typical Skirmish event
The supply kit should be active for at least another 6.5 hrs at the time of posting
You might consider re-evaluating the rewards for Brutal Boss and higher. Perhaps award 1 bilitrium (or other high level components) for 50% damage to the Brutal or higher level Boss and 2 for 100%. Me and my fleet have thousand of Magnisite and hundreds of Kemosite but have hit a brick wall at Bridge level 7 and are dead in the water as far as making progress. That kind of causes a great deal of frustration which is not good for the players and which means it’s not good for the game in general. If players feel that there isn’t any possibility of making any advancement, they just might not bother with playing Boss battles. 1 Bilitrium (or any future high level component) with 50% damage may convince player to continue. Slow progress is much better than none at all. Just a thought…
I would really enjoy playing FBB if the Boss was randomly selected after the current Boss battle was over. There is no way to pick a boss that will help the fleet members when anyone can start a battle.
I would be happy to play a rotation of easy to ultra as long as it its inclusive to all members of the fleet.
Ok, so here is why i doubt Fleet Boss ship boosts are applied properly.
When i start a Skirmishes it shows the hull including bonus. But when my ship takes damage at the end screen the unboosted shield stats appears. 😐
Reminds me of the issue with the AM Fleet Boss Bonus for voyages that was shown correctly before u started the voyage, but then disappeared as soon as the voyage had started. WRG fixed it meanwhile.
If thats the same issue here, then Shield and Hull Bonus don t apply
once a Boss Battle is started.
Please can the developers confirm and make an undertaking that combo crew possibilities will be limited to crew available in retrieval or through achievement rewards ONLY.
This was implemented.
If you have reasons to believe that's not the case we would need examples.
Not just a list of crew like you've posted after this post, but a screenshot with the combo, preferably while the battle is still active. Submitting a ticket would also help.
I do not see any other reports of this, as I said earlier this was addressed a few weeks ago.
Lt Commander Ron Docent
Our fleet will lose our current battle because we lost a lot of valor and merits trying to match this slot. This crew member is not available in crew retrieval.
Please can the developers confirm and make an undertaking that combo crew possibilities will be limited to crew available in retrieval or through achievement rewards ONLY.
This was implemented.
If you have reasons to believe that's not the case we would need examples.
Not just a list of crew like you've posted after this post, but a screenshot with the combo, preferably while the battle is still active. Submitting a ticket would also help.
I do not see any other reports of this, as I said earlier this was addressed a few weeks ago.
Lt Commander Ron Docent
Our fleet will lose our current battle because we lost a lot of valor and merits trying to match this slot. This crew member is not available in crew retrieval.
The fact that Ron unlocked it for you on this occasion doesn't mean he's the only possible crew for that combo. I make it that there are four 4*s in the portal who hit Desperate+Scoundrel: Archaeologist Q, and three different Quarks (Tourist, Klingon and Wedding Day).
Comments
* the suggested crew is not in the portal
* the suggested crew has both the open trait and (at least) two traits listed in the general trait pool
* no other crew in the portal has the specific combination of traits
as an example of the above, see the following screenshots. as you can see, dahj on the run was suggested for the botanist + ? + ? node, with the possible traits in the interface being listed as only civilian and survivalist.
however, using unsanctioned third-party tools we can learn, that this dahj variant is the only one in the game with these three traits. thus she would've been excluded from being a viable choice after the fbb update, that stopped using non-portal crew as the source for possible trait combos.
i thought this was common knowledge and was surprised nobody in my fleet knew about it, so i'm posting it here.
Crew select will show you crew that YOU have that COULD potentially satisfy the node, based on the list of traits shown.
This does not mean that that particular node requires a crew with : Botanist, Survivalist, Civilian.
That's why the other crew displayed has another a different set of traits: Douwd, Civilain, Botanist.
What ended up being the traits combo for that particular node?
I've highlighted the relevant part of your comment, because my assertion is, that dahj on the run, the crew used in the example I showed in my previous post, cannot be the correct crew to unlock that node. if it's impossible for dahj to unlock the node, she shouldn't be listed as a suggestion.
Before August 2nd you would have been correct, but in that day's server update you wrote the following:
with this change, any trait combination required for a node unlock has to be present on at least one crew that's in the portal/crew retrieval.
please take a look at the screenshot below as proof that the trait combination of botanist + civilian + survivalist doesn't exist on any crew currently in the portal:
since we have now established that this specific combination doesn't exist on any crew in the portal, it should also stand that the combination cannot be the requirement in fleet boss battles either. if there is a 0% chance that this crew can unlock the node, it shouldn't be listed as a suggestion.
we haven't had problems with boss battles or node unlocks, in this case we easily found kevin uxbridge (botanist + civilian + dowd) to be the correct solution. thank you for your help though
Let me try again
Crew Select will show available crew that:
- have the revealed trait for the node
- have traits that are displayed in the trait list
For this case, having done the research and seen that only a crew not yet in the Time Portal had the traits Botanist, Survivalist, Civilian - was the clue that those were not the traits for that node.
The change that was made ensures nodes will require a trait combination that is only found on crew not yet in the time portal.
If crew select showed only crew that can resolve the node, that would be too easy.
If it showed only crew available in the Time Portal that would deprive you of the ability to use crew you possess and that could very well resolve a node due to the fact that the traits combination is found on various crew, some limited, some not.
I hope this is clearer, let me know if it is not.
i can accept that approach - it's a bug, but we're selling it as a feature - but i feel dissatisfied with the official stance on it.
After our conversation here, the only undeniable fact is this: the in-game crew-select feature changed how it worked on august 2nd, but this fact hasn't been mentioned anywhere that i can remember. on that day it stopped showing real suggestions of crew that have a chance at unlocking the node. the list now is merely a collection of crew that happen to share a sufficient number of traits and it's now up to players to know whether any of the listed combinations are a possibility or not.
how we should know (or learn) that with 40k+ combinations in the game (and sometimes over a hundred for a single chain) is beyond me. the game doesn't provide any easy to use method to check this, after all. in the end, this approach results in an average false-positive rate of listed non-portal crew that can be as high as 54%!
it didn't dawn on me until i ran the numbers, how significant a problem this would turn out to be. to me, it's a very deceptive method of knowingly tricking players into using more valor and spending dilithium on certain failure. and you've just confirmed this isn't caused by a bug but completely intentional.
it encourages me even more to solely rely on unsanctioned third-party tools that can get around these pitfalls. that said, i'm happy there's clarity on the topic. i'll now go and enjoy playing the game.
finally, here's the raw numbers to support my claim, for full transparency and as raw unbiased information:
total crew: 1,264
non-portal crew: 152
total distinct trait combinations of all crew: 42,889
... of portal crew: 38,129
... of non-portal crew: 8,831
... of non-portal crew shared with portal crew: 4,071
... of non-portal crew exclusive to non-portal crew: 4,760
We have several players in my fleet who started playing within the very first few months of the game launch. Yet between us we have identified twelve 4-star crew that nobody has and are unavailable in crew retrieval.
We don’t expect to have access to retrieve all crew - obviously that it how you make money
However if we are unable to acquire these crew and they appear in boss battle combos then we will be blocked from progress. Given that we are spending significant resources and dilithium for these battles this is unfair.
Please can the developers confirm and make an undertaking that combo crew possibilities will be limited to crew available in retrieval or through achievement rewards ONLY.
I just lost two antimatter after refresh.
My voyage started with 2970 AM. I guess they round to the nearest ten's or they truncate the one's digit.
Now that I realize how the original number is generated I would say my FBB AM bonus was subtracted for refuel. Which means they truncate the one's digit.
My bonus AM for 2950AM is 23.6. 2973.6 truncate the one's (and less) digit is then 2970.
With subtraction on refuel instead of addition, 2950-23.6= 2926.4 truncate the one's (and less) digits then is 2920 which is what I got.
I had the hologram ship. It is 9/10. My mistake , refill was correct.
For example:
- Nemesis Sacrifice Data, (I)nspring
- Gabriel Bell, Inspr(i)ng
- Profitable Ishka,(I)nspring
- The Hansens, (I)nnovator
Is there a problem with the letter i ?
For all combo crew slots there should be at least one match for crew available via Crew Retrieval or Achievement Rewards. There is no need to exclude any crew from the filtered list if they are additional possible matches.
This approach gives benefit to those that have obtained exclusive crew.
More importantly, it avoids blocking the entire fleet from progressing in a battle because a randomly picked exclusive crew member is a Unicorn.
Of course other fleets may vary but in ours none of us have any of these crew and there is no means available to acquire them:
This is not a request to make these crew retrievable, only that they are excluded from being required to unlock a combo slot. We just want it actually possible to find a match.
This was implemented.
If you have reasons to believe that's not the case we would need examples.
Not just a list of crew like you've posted after this post, but a screenshot with the combo, preferably while the battle is still active.
Submitting a ticket would also help.
I do not see any other reports of this, as I said earlier this was addressed a few weeks ago.
Nothing was changed since your previous report re: AM
Shan I made a mistake. I thought my ship was max level it was 9/10.
So it was working correctly.
I went to bed about 1am, in the UK. Before going to bed, I used up all my remaining valor.
I was rudely awoken at 7:30 am by my alarm clock. Checking my game it claimed I had 4 valor, I was expecting 2 (or possibly 3). Pressing the valor display, also showed my valor was full.
I quickly did one FBB battle, and my valor dropped down to 1.
So, although the game had correctly remembered my valor, I guess on the server, the client had decided that I had full valor.
Reset is about 6 am in the UK (Summer time), and the client was running all night. This is on Android.
This was the second time I had seen this display bug.
As you can see it only shows 1.7M of damage when I did 18M+ twice, I noticed it and screenshot just one of the battles
Does this Combo have a hidden trait?
It would be nice to be able to review unsolved nodes after the battle ends especially when people try multiple times to solve a node.
It does not look like this was an issue as I no longer see that particular node.
I see you've submitted a ticket for this, when asking for help for FBB please provide as much information as possible such as the difficulty level and screenshot.
But please know that you will not receive an immediate reply and that Support will not divulge who can unlock the node.
I am sorry you were not able to pass that node, unfortunately as the battle has ended, it is not something that Support will be able to look into.
Protecting the Galaxy's Future from itself
Does this potentially happen with similar crew?
This was my loadout during the last time. But, I've seen it with other loadouts as well.
I ran another attack using the exact same crew (after restarting the client) and it worked fine.
Protecting the Galaxy's Future from itself
- Our NM FBB was in flight at the start of the skirmish event, with approx 3 hrs remaining after the start of the event.
- I applied a Supply kit soon after event start and proceeded to generate approx 150K intel
- played event to 100K VP
- generated another 60k or 70K intel
I know for sure the supply kit was active up to this stage
- dealt the last 30M or so damage to Boss, defeated it and collected rewards
- played event a little more
- generated some more intel - maybe 20k - 30k
- did my replications
- went to bed
This morning - supply kit is not active. I am also unsure if the supply kit was active after the Boss was killed, but that is the only "different" action to have happened in my game from a typical Skirmish event
The supply kit should be active for at least another 6.5 hrs at the time of posting
I would be happy to play a rotation of easy to ultra as long as it its inclusive to all members of the fleet.
When i start a Skirmishes it shows the hull including bonus. But when my ship takes damage at the end screen the unboosted shield stats appears. 😐
Reminds me of the issue with the AM Fleet Boss Bonus for voyages that was shown correctly before u started the voyage, but then disappeared as soon as the voyage had started. WRG fixed it meanwhile.
If thats the same issue here, then Shield and Hull Bonus don t apply
once a Boss Battle is started.
How is boss damage calculated?
Edit, after someone else battled, the boss damage was corrected, but it might be because the last battle also unlocked a node chain.
Our fleet will lose our current battle because we lost a lot of valor and merits trying to match this slot. This crew member is not available in crew retrieval.
The fact that Ron unlocked it for you on this occasion doesn't mean he's the only possible crew for that combo. I make it that there are four 4*s in the portal who hit Desperate+Scoundrel: Archaeologist Q, and three different Quarks (Tourist, Klingon and Wedding Day).