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Key information about the event: Imperial Decree - 12/14

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    Pallidyne wrote: »
    How is the DS9 not consistent with the TOS? It simply had an event in the future, Spock inspired by Kirk in Mirror Mirror to make a peaceful Empire and got eaten alive by the KCA.

    Enterprise is a weird one, as the Defiant inexplicably travels not only between universes but back in time as well, but actually (and oddly for Enterprise as it was a continuity mess in many other ways) not contradictory with the Mirror Mirror in any way that I can find.

    I grew tired of those too-cute-by-half instances of tying together of disparate plot points and characters ages ago, but I confess I really dug that idea that the U.S.S. Defiant lost in "The Tholian Web" ended up in the Mirror Universe. It wasn't a remotely obvious idea, and it was used to great effect. I think it helped that we stayed with the Mirror crew exclusively for those two episodes, so it never had to be dealt with in any way by "our" Archer and crew.

    My only question is why their technology didn't progress in all the time before "Mirror, Mirror", given that they had the Defiant to reverse engineer for a century. Unless, that is, there is something amazingly technological about that yellow paint on the I.S.S. Enterprise's hull.

    Actually, I would argue that the Mirror Universe we saw in Enterprise was considerably behind technologically. If you recall, Trip and his whole team were regularly exposed to radiation because no one cared enough to develop a safe warp drive. It's entirely likely that they were pretty behind in general, and only developed technology as needed, instead of having a "typical" Starfleet approach of "science for its own sake". Plus let's face it: when you're enslaving Vulcans instead of working with them as scientists, you aren't going to progress as fast.

    I would say that them capturing the Defiant is one of the main reasons that we do see them with advanced technology by Mirror Mirror.

    Your characterization of Terran tech is spot on, but I'm still left with the fact that at the end of "In a Mirror, Darkly", the most advanced thing they have is a Constitution class starship (the U.S.S. Defiant). A century later in "Mirror, Mirror", the most advanced thing they have is...a Constitution class starship with yellow paint (the I.S.S. Enterprise). That's not a lot to show for all the time they had to work from the Defiant, no matter how negligent they are about scientific advancement.
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    DralixDralix ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2017
    That's not a lot to show for all the time they had to work from the Defiant, no matter how negligent they are about scientific advancement.

    There's more to it than though. Constantly killing your superiors to get ahead probably stagnates growth a bit. Plus paranoia - didn't Archer explicitly state that he wasn't going to let the ship be reverse engineered, instead choosing to hoard its technology for himself? Would Sato have done the same, or whoever killed her to take her throne?

    The Terran Empire as presented is illogical (I think someone else said that once) so it's best not to overthink these things, imo.
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    Dralix wrote: »
    That's not a lot to show for all the time they had to work from the Defiant, no matter how negligent they are about scientific advancement.

    There's more to it than though. Constantly killing your superiors to get ahead probably stagnates growth a bit. Plus paranoia - didn't Archer explicitly state that he wasn't going to let the ship be reverse engineered, instead choosing to hoard its technology for himself? Would Sato have done the same, or whoever killed her to take her throne?

    That insatiable blood thirst is all the more impetus for someone to have upped their game in the tech development area, though, no?
    The Terran Empire as presented is illogical (I think someone else said that once) so it's best not to overthink these things, imo.

    You sound like my therapist.
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    DralixDralix ✭✭✭✭✭
    You sound like my therapist.

    No charge! :)
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    For CardassiaFor Cardassia ✭✭✭✭✭
    Dralix wrote: »
    That's not a lot to show for all the time they had to work from the Defiant, no matter how negligent they are about scientific advancement.

    There's more to it than though. Constantly killing your superiors to get ahead probably stagnates growth a bit. Plus paranoia - didn't Archer explicitly state that he wasn't going to let the ship be reverse engineered, instead choosing to hoard its technology for himself? Would Sato have done the same, or whoever killed her to take her throne?

    That insatiable blood thirst is all the more impetus for someone to have upped their game in the tech development area, though, no?
    The Terran Empire as presented is illogical (I think someone else said that once) so it's best not to overthink these things, imo.

    You sound like my therapist.

    Well, if everyone is fighting over the Defiant constantly (Archer, Sato, whomever came next...), there's a reasonable chance that at some point someone said "I'd rather see it destroyed than fall in to so-and-so's hands" and then proceed to blow it up. So maybe they had reverse engineered it, or maybe they just stole some parts and ideas from it. But either way, there would be a limit on how much they could do.

    And again, if that technology was enough for them to dominate everyone around them, well then they were going to spend more time using it and less time improving it.

    Besides, for all you know that yellow paint was part of a highly advanced shielding system :P
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    Besides, for all you know that yellow paint was part of a highly advanced shielding system :P

    I'll concede this.
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    Ok
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    I was attempting to make a point
    Nicole K wrote: »
    Grant77 wrote: »
    Nicole K wrote: »
    Grant77 wrote: »
    Nicole K wrote: »
    Grant77 wrote: »
    This is basically fan fiction making it's way into DB "canon", where does the line stop? What else is coming our way? At what point does this become ridiculous? Can't wait for Mirror Wesley :D:wink:

    We passed that point when they made a non-Star Trek character the event 5*.

    That's a bit unfair. It's not like anyone is playing this game for its storyline anyway. I don't even read it most of the time. But a comic series is not "fan fiction". It's at minimum licensed content so it was approved by the content owners.

    This is a game. In case you haven't noticed, the very premise the game is built around isn't "canon trek". It doesn't hurt anything to mix it up and not have every card represent something that happened in a show. I just don't get what the problem is here. I really believe some of you just enjoy being turds in the punchbowl every week.

    Please get over yourselves and quit acting so entitled. You don't speak for the fanbase or everyone playing the game. So please stop speaking as if you do.

    Someone who doesn't agree with you is entitled? Learn the definitions of words before you use them. I think that a Star Trek game should be limited to Star Trek characters, especially the ones that are somewhat forced on to people as requirements to succeed in the mega event. It's a perfectly reasonable thought. If you want characters that aren't Star Trek then so be it. I'm not going to criticize you for liking a comic book that some guy made with characters resembling those in real Star Trek. It's just not for me.

    Deciding that you are the arbiter of what counts as real or not real star trek strikes as the very definition of entitled. While I quoted you, my comments could be applied in general to those who keep saying that this isn't what "we" (that's speaking for the playing community) wanted. I don't remember voting for any of you to be our spokesperson, so all I am saying is speak for yourself. I am very satisfied with the content of this event and honestly don't care where the card source material came from. We're talking about a fictional show. The whole thing is pretend and imaginary.

    You can't just create random emotions and statements and then assign them to me in order to make your argument work.

    When a statement starts with 'I think' , it means that it is my opinion. I'm not trying to speak for anyone else.

    I like Star Trek characters in my game, but I'm ok with non-Star Trek characters for those who like that sort of thing. I just think it's crossing the line when characters like Mirror Picard and Assimilated La Forge are kind of forced onto the player base due to their huge stats and/or multiple stars. I'd prefer that they were not essential to success in the game. Many of us don't want that and it ruins the game experience considerably.

    What game experience are you getting ripped out of? The 5 lines of text at the start of the event and at the phase change? I see absolutely nothing immersing in this game. We're crafting items and collecting cards and that's mostly it.

    That doesn't mean it has to be that way. While you may not care for immersion, there are others who appreciate it. I can use my own imagination in the game, but if the writing is actually good (or art, or any aspect of the game) it gives me more incentive to support the game more/longer.
    Nicole K wrote: »
    This is a game.

    It is known.
    Nicole K wrote: »
    It's not like anyone is playing this game for its storyline anyway.

    Not like anyone is a trekkie for the story lines; we just watch for explosions n' stuff. ;) So if we play a Trek game, the stories must be a non-factor too. ;)
    Nicole K wrote: »
    Please get over yourselves and quit acting so entitled. You don't speak for the fanbase or everyone playing the game. So please stop speaking as if you do.

    I understand that you don't like reading the overload of complaining every week, but endless standoffishness and borderline ad hominem is not helpful, and not everyone has a hundred dollars or so to put into the game every month like you've stated that you do. However, that doesn't render all of their concerns into meaningless complaints. Some complaints are not helpful while others are justified and could help improve the game. Putting down anyone who would like to see changes also ironically adds to the complainy vibe.

    *Please note the bolded selections from your comment.

    When people make statements like "hey DB this isn't what we asked for" it definitely seems to me that that person is trying to say everyone hates this. I simply was saying please stop using "we" when you mean "I".

    How much I do or do not spend on this game has nothing to do with anything. I'm not sure I understand why you would bring that up? I only mentioned it because someone else said the recent changes had caused them to scale back their spending, while I had recently increased mine because I had been enjoying the game more than I used to.

    I'm pretty much done with posting in these forums anyway. I believe someone in the universal chat got it right when they advised me to just stay away from the forums. Nothing useful is to be found there. The experience here is the exact opposite of the experience I've found interacting with players in the game. This is just not a fun or enjoyable place to be.
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    So any Picard, Data, Tucker & Vic, plus mirror crew get the 2x bonus right?
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    MagisseMagisse ✭✭✭✭✭
    MR Aguia wrote: »
    So any Picard, Data, Tucker & Vic, plus mirror crew get the 2x bonus right?
    No, for Picard it's just the Mega Event 5* Picard. The others you mentioned should all be bonus crew though.
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    DScottHewittDScottHewitt ✭✭✭✭✭
    MR Aguia wrote: »
    So any Picard, Data, Tucker & Vic, plus mirror crew get the 2x bonus right?
    Magisse wrote: »
    MR Aguia wrote: »
    So any Picard, Data, Tucker & Vic, plus mirror crew get the 2x bonus right?
    No, for Picard it's just the Mega Event 5* Picard. The others you mentioned should all be bonus crew though.

    This. ONLY the Mirror Jean-Luc Picard gives the Bonus for Picards. This was well covered this past week, when people jumped to conclusions, then got mad they concluded wrong......



    Scott

    "The truth is like a lion; you don't have to defend it. Let it loose; it will defend itself."
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    Conclusions based on every single past event ever with out any exception I can think of... But yes, conclusions. Lol. The no Picard variant bonus was a curve ball. One that we can't ignore going forward.

    So right now all I know about the next event bonus character structure is that I'm waiting for it to be announced..
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    DralixDralix ✭✭✭✭✭
    Conclusions based on every single past event ever with out any exception I can think of

    This was the first mega event where the recurring 5* had more than one variant. So regardless of every past event ever, this was a unique situation - mega event recurring 5* crew are different than normal featured crew.


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    SiblinSiblin ✭✭✭
    Magisse wrote: »
    MR Aguia wrote: »
    So any Picard, Data, Tucker & Vic, plus mirror crew get the 2x bonus right?
    No, for Picard it's just the Mega Event 5* Picard. The others you mentioned should all be bonus crew though.

    What’s the word on Hollander- has he been classed as a data in previous events?
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    DralixDralix ✭✭✭✭✭
    Siblin wrote: »
    What’s the word on Hollander- has he been classed as a data in previous events?

    Always - he is a Data variant.

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    thanks for clearing that up
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    MR Aguia wrote: »
    thanks for clearing that up

    Info like this is readily available on the wiki, if you ever find yourself with the question again. Just go to the event list, select the most recent event to feature that crew, and you'll immediately see the list of variants (excluding, obviously, crew that has been introduced in the meantime, which isn't the case with Hollander).
    "Dance with me. For science."
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    WebberoniWebberoni ✭✭✭✭✭
    Pardon my ignorance, but have there been any formal announcements/posts about the types of events we'll be getting in weeks 3 and 4 of the current Mirror mega event?
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    For CardassiaFor Cardassia ✭✭✭✭✭
    Webberoni wrote: »
    Pardon my ignorance, but have there been any formal announcements/posts about the types of events we'll be getting in weeks 3 and 4 of the current Mirror mega event?

    Nope. We know their names and lengths (here: https://forum.disruptorbeam.com/stt/discussion/1967/announcing-the-mirror-universe-mega-event-smoke-mirrors), but nothing else.
    “Treason, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder.” - Elim Garak

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    PallidynePallidyne ✭✭✭✭✭
    Pallidyne wrote: »
    How is the DS9 not consistent with the TOS? It simply had an event in the future, Spock inspired by Kirk in Mirror Mirror to make a peaceful Empire and got eaten alive by the KCA.

    Enterprise is a weird one, as the Defiant inexplicably travels not only between universes but back in time as well, but actually (and oddly for Enterprise as it was a continuity mess in many other ways) not contradictory with the Mirror Mirror in any way that I can find.

    I grew tired of those too-cute-by-half instances of tying together of disparate plot points and characters ages ago, but I confess I really dug that idea that the U.S.S. Defiant lost in "The Tholian Web" ended up in the Mirror Universe. It wasn't a remotely obvious idea, and it was used to great effect. I think it helped that we stayed with the Mirror crew exclusively for those two episodes, so it never had to be dealt with in any way by "our" Archer and crew.

    My only question is why their technology didn't progress in all the time before "Mirror, Mirror", given that they had the Defiant to reverse engineer for a century. Unless, that is, there is something amazingly technological about that yellow paint on the I.S.S. Enterprise's hull.

    Actually, I would argue that the Mirror Universe we saw in Enterprise was considerably behind technologically. If you recall, Trip and his whole team were regularly exposed to radiation because no one cared enough to develop a safe warp drive. It's entirely likely that they were pretty behind in general, and only developed technology as needed, instead of having a "typical" Starfleet approach of "science for its own sake". Plus let's face it: when you're enslaving Vulcans instead of working with them as scientists, you aren't going to progress as fast.

    I would say that them capturing the Defiant is one of the main reasons that we do see them with advanced technology by Mirror Mirror.

    Yet for the TNG comics they can make some major leaps up to the 'All Good Things' Enterprise?
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    [TFA] A$AP[TFA] A$AP ✭✭
    edited December 2017
    If this event ends with no Mirror Mayweather, I will be extremely disappointed.



    That makes two of us.

    "
    Join TFA II now.
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    Pallidyne wrote: »
    How is the DS9 not consistent with the TOS? It simply had an event in the future, Spock inspired by Kirk in Mirror Mirror to make a peaceful Empire and got eaten alive by the KCA.

    Enterprise is a weird one, as the Defiant inexplicably travels not only between universes but back in time as well, but actually (and oddly for Enterprise as it was a continuity mess in many other ways) not contradictory with the Mirror Mirror in any way that I can find.

    I grew tired of those too-cute-by-half instances of tying together of disparate plot points and characters ages ago, but I confess I really dug that idea that the U.S.S. Defiant lost in "The Tholian Web" ended up in the Mirror Universe. It wasn't a remotely obvious idea, and it was used to great effect. I think it helped that we stayed with the Mirror crew exclusively for those two episodes, so it never had to be dealt with in any way by "our" Archer and crew.

    My only question is why their technology didn't progress in all the time before "Mirror, Mirror", given that they had the Defiant to reverse engineer for a century. Unless, that is, there is something amazingly technological about that yellow paint on the I.S.S. Enterprise's hull.

    Actually, I would argue that the Mirror Universe we saw in Enterprise was considerably behind technologically. If you recall, Trip and his whole team were regularly exposed to radiation because no one cared enough to develop a safe warp drive. It's entirely likely that they were pretty behind in general, and only developed technology as needed, instead of having a "typical" Starfleet approach of "science for its own sake". Plus let's face it: when you're enslaving Vulcans instead of working with them as scientists, you aren't going to progress as fast.

    I would say that them capturing the Defiant is one of the main reasons that we do see them with advanced technology by Mirror Mirror.

    Your characterization of Terran tech is spot on, but I'm still left with the fact that at the end of "In a Mirror, Darkly", the most advanced thing they have is a Constitution class starship (the U.S.S. Defiant). A century later in "Mirror, Mirror", the most advanced thing they have is...a Constitution class starship with yellow paint (the I.S.S. Enterprise). That's not a lot to show for all the time they had to work from the Defiant, no matter how negligent they are about scientific advancement.

    That's one of the things that I didn't like about the mirror episodes (and klingons). Tech evolves faster in times of war and in empires. The need for it is more pressing than in peace time or for stagnating civilizations.
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    Magisse wrote: »
    MR Aguia wrote: »
    So any Picard, Data, Tucker & Vic, plus mirror crew get the 2x bonus right?
    No, for Picard it's just the Mega Event 5* Picard. The others you mentioned should all be bonus crew though.

    Was wondering why my Enterprise-E Picard wasn't showing up for the last event...
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    I do wonder if we'll have a Mirror Janeway in the mix. Doesn't seem any Mirrors have come from Voyager inspiration, though I think some have made their way into books.
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    My only question is why their technology didn't progress in all the time before "Mirror, Mirror", given that they had the Defiant to reverse engineer for a century. Unless, that is, there is something amazingly technological about that yellow paint on the I.S.S. Enterprise's hull.

    By the way, @Travis S McClain, if you look at the Prime Universe you'll see the Excelsior class, serving for roughly one hundred years (introduced in the TOS movies, and still doing battle in the Dominion War). Even with "our" Starfleet, and its rapid technological advancement, it is not impossible to see the same hull in service for 100 years.

    Of course, the tech of a Excelsior class around the year 2370 is completely different than a year 2260. The tech is new, the design of the hull is old. But we have ultimately no way to compare the tech level of the ISS Enterprise to the tech level of the USS Enterprise, so we can't know whether there has been tech advancement or not. The only thing we know is that the ISS Enterprise can destroy the Halkan planet, and the capacity of destroying planets isn't found very often on Prime starships: I'd infer that the ISS Enterprise has much more advanced weaponry than the USS Enterprise.

    Moreover the Constitution class is probably the symbol of the Sato dynasty (if she has a dynasty). It's possible that Hoshi Sato and her descendants (if they got the throne) it is likely they insisted on the Constitution design to be kept in order to keep the memory alive. It's like a memento of the might of the Sato Emperors, in a way.

    Nothing strange, in my opinion. It sits well in my head-canon.
    "Dance with me. For science."
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    ClanofClanof ✭✭✭
    My only question is why their technology didn't progress in all the time before "Mirror, Mirror", given that they had the Defiant to reverse engineer for a century. Unless, that is, there is something amazingly technological about that yellow paint on the I.S.S. Enterprise's hull.

    By the way, @Travis S McClain, if you look at the Prime Universe you'll see the Excelsior class, serving for roughly one hundred years (introduced in the TOS movies, and still doing battle in the Dominion War). Even with "our" Starfleet, and its rapid technological advancement, it is not impossible to see the same hull in service for 100 years.

    Of course, the tech of a Excelsior class around the year 2370 is completely different than a year 2260. The tech is new, the design of the hull is old. But we have ultimately no way to compare the tech level of the ISS Enterprise to the tech level of the USS Enterprise, so we can't know whether there has been tech advancement or not. The only thing we know is that the ISS Enterprise can destroy the Halkan planet, and the capacity of destroying planets isn't found very often on Prime starships: I'd infer that the ISS Enterprise has much more advanced weaponry than the USS Enterprise.

    Moreover the Constitution class is probably the symbol of the Sato dynasty (if she has a dynasty). It's possible that Hoshi Sato and her descendants (if they got the throne) it is likely they insisted on the Constitution design to be kept in order to keep the memory alive. It's like a memento of the might of the Sato Emperors, in a way.

    Nothing strange, in my opinion. It sits well in my head-canon.

    I believe there was a book that outlined the Sato dynasty and Hoshi's heirs. I've been meaning to get around to reading it at some point.
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    SiblinSiblin ✭✭✭
    for once I'm doing quite well for bonus crew in a shuttle event. Will have 2 main event crew and 8 secondary bonus crew - mostly close to fully equipped (only a few FF though).

    Problem is i guess most people will be in the same situation, with a large number of mirror crew and the awarded thresholds last week?
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    Siblin wrote: »
    for once I'm doing quite well for bonus crew in a shuttle event. Will have 2 main event crew and 8 secondary bonus crew - mostly close to fully equipped (only a few FF though).

    Problem is i guess most people will be in the same situation, with a large number of mirror crew and the awarded thresholds last week?

    You (we!) are always playing catch-up in events. It's great when you start getting more to work with. Best not to worry about what others have and enjoy what you do - you'll finish higher and higher with a bit of luck and next re-run you'll be in the box seat :smile:
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    PallidynePallidyne ✭✭✭✭✭
    I do wonder if we'll have a Mirror Janeway in the mix. Doesn't seem any Mirrors have come from Voyager inspiration, though I think some have made their way into books.

    Mirror Tuvok is actually in the DS9 episode "Through the Looking Glass".

    Hell, I'd be up for a Mirror Janeway though, its 'Tradition! TRADITION!' Now if I was a rich man, having all the credits in the land... if I was a very rich man. :)

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