Putting oneself deliberately in such a disadvantaged situation is a decision I respect, but I am not sure why Fleet Boss Battles are suddenly the deal breaker.
It's simple actually. It's the difference between difficult and impossible.
Quoting, but speaking to everyone who needs to hear this...
It is "impossible" by choice, that is the point I am making. There is a remedy to the problem already in place; join a fleet. Players need fleets more than ever now, active fleets are always looking for new members more than ever now, it is win-win.
To people in dying fleets or small fleets, if you want to keep your core players together find people in a similar situation and merge fleets (I'd move everyone into the fleet with the best starbase). For people who defiantly refuse to join a fleet for "reasons", find 49 like-minded individuals, start a fleet called Desolation Row, have everyone join up and then be content being alone together in a collective of 50 one-person squadrons. Or just add Fleet Bosses to the long list of other things you are depriving yourself of by choice.
This is a fleet-driven game. Join a fleet, merge fleets, or create a fleet. There are dozens of established fleets with fully developed starbases looking for active players RIGHT NOW, pick one you like, join up, and you will have helped solve TWO problems. Your new Admiral/officers/fleet will thank you, and you will thank yourself when you start getting bonus chronitons, lots of bonus Honor, huge starbase bonuses, and the ability to actually have fun with the Fleet Boss.
Everything in this game is by choice. The best way to advance is to buy campaigns or spend money in some other way, but there are players who choose not to. This is a P2W game, but F2P players can eventually get the crew they want.
The best way to get new crew is to play and compete in events. But players can choose not to. They still have the option of buying packs for crew or waiting until that crew show up in the portal. You can say this is an event driven game, but players can choose to not compete and they can still get the crew eventually.
This boss is different. If players choose not to be in a full competitive fleet there is no way to earn McCoy. He's the first crew that will be 100% unobtainable unless you do X. That's a fundamental change in the game design.
Imagine if there was a crew that was only in an ultra premium campaign and we were told they would never be added to the portal? Or a crew in a permanent paid pack for $100. You could buy the crew whenever you wanted, but you had to buy the crew to get them. Or a crew that was only available below rank 100 in an expedition event and would not show up in the portal eventually. Or even imagine if voyages was locked and you needed to be VIP14 to play voyages. That's how the higher levels feel to players in small fleets.
This too is one of my biggest complaints about Boss Battles. You are essentially dependent on others to get be able to get exclusives like McCoy and Scotty with (currently) no other way to get them. Since the game has turned into a collecting type of game, this is extremely disappointing and frustrating. I have had all crew three times. I am still waiting patiently for the Klingons in the Gauntlet, but eventually they will come. With this Boss Battle twist, it pretty much ends the ability to collect all crew.
There are some people who are actively discussing and talking about FBB in fleet. Usually on discord.
There are some people who haven’t said a word ever, there’s no guarantee they’re seeing fleet chat, they’re not on discord and I’m only aware that they’re doing anything because they appear on the fleet rankings list. The only reason they seem to attack the hard boss is because it dies twice a day. These same people are probably getting a decently upgraded bridge and starbase loot everyday with almost no interaction and definitely no communication. It’s almost like we’re not asking for much.
Then they're lucky. Like I said before, I'm happy with my fleet and I'm glad I joined, but that doesn't mean I can't be sympathetic toward the people who have more social anxiety or trepidation about being in a group like that than you or I do [and feeling trepidation about being in a group like that could mean they never join up to find out how little communication might be required, if they're lucky enough to find a fleet as chill as yours that has any openings]. Personally, I don't feel like they should be excluded from the rewards you and I will probably be able to get eventually. I'm not gonna be the type of person who says "screw you, I got mine," just because I was lucky enough to find a chill fleet that I can fit in with pretty well. I want the people who aren't as lucky to still have some avenue by which they can obtain the bridge-exclusive ship and crew.
It would be great if this would be a game where every kind of player and person could find their way and have fun. But you have to realize that is an utopia. You can't please everyone, especially when you are a small team. Sometimes it happens that a game goes into direction that is not yours. I have experienced that in the past. I decided then to move on. But that is for everyone to decide on their own. But I find it not fair that it is taken for granted that WRG should consider the desirements of every unique individual.
It’s a Freemium game. Not spending money is far more crippling than not joining a fleet.
Are there any crew that are absolutely impossible to get if you don't spend money? Because there are now crew that are absolutely impossible to get if you don't join a fleet.
JFC, I don't think in all my years on this planet I've ever seen such a collection of whinging, crying and complaining people as this bunch. First, you all complain about issues that you didn't like (and, I'll grant you, there are some egregious flaws in this newly-devised feature of the game), mostly because you felt entitled to something something gazpacho, and then, when the developers actually listen and make attempts at fixing them, you all keep complaining that the fixes weren't what you wanted.
I left retail management because of people like you all. Now you're seriously infringing on my enjoyment of the game, because I can't even read the forums for great stories and advice; it's all nattering nabobs of negativity, 24/7 around here now.
JFC, I don't think in all my years on this planet I've ever seen such a collection of whinging, crying and complaining people as this bunch. First, you all complain about issues that you didn't like (and, I'll grant you, there are some egregious flaws in this newly-devised feature of the game), mostly because you felt entitled to something something gazpacho, and then, when the developers actually listen and make attempts at fixing them, you all keep complaining that the fixes weren't what you wanted.
I left retail management because of people like you all. Now you're seriously infringing on my enjoyment of the game, because I can't even read the forums for great stories and advice; it's all nattering nabobs of negativity, 24/7 around here now.
Sheesh, people, get a grip.
How does “we found out how you people are solving nodes eadier than we wanted, and we are going to make that more challenging and at times flat out impossible now” equate to them trying to solve the problems that have been expressed in this thread?
Put up one quote where someone is complaining that fbb is too easy, needs to be more challenging, and if possible, make it IMPOSSIBLE.
It’s a Freemium game. Not spending money is far more crippling than not joining a fleet.
Are there any crew that are absolutely impossible to get if you don't spend money? Because there are now crew that are absolutely impossible to get if you don't join a fleet.
It’s a Freemium game. Not spending money is far more crippling than not joining a fleet.
Are there any crew that are absolutely impossible to get if you don't spend money? Because there are now crew that are absolutely impossible to get if you don't join a fleet.
And yet there's so much material in game its a lot more likely the game will collapse before a low or no spender will obtain all of them. Nevermind fusing all that crew.
Yes, in a couple days I'll get the new Scotty at 1/5. I have no idea when he'll be fully fused. Meanwhile there's still ~300 crew I don't have. It will take about 10M Honour to fuse all of my crew.
At least that honour debt is narrowed by being in a fleet.
Who cares. We spent what, 2 weeks building feedback and beta resting, tapping our hard earned resources to test their new feature, and they responded to that with a big ole middle finger.
The whole thing is ridiculously buggy, like a picnic in the Everglades buggy. Voyages have been messed up for years and it's recently even gotten worse. The wrong choices come up in a chain based on your previous choice. A second half comes up without the first one.
This piece de resistance was waiting when I came in from the chickens...
Yep, that's Voyage exclusive Tarquin from a straight drop. (Why couldn't you be Picard? Then, I'd have you all.)
I'm actually happy that anything is being made to work like it should. Too many problems will crash it eventually. Now, off to post my cat's midnight selfie online. How she managed... Who knows? She turned it on, accessed the camera, switched it to selfie, and took a shot of her foot in the pitch dark. All you see are her toes illustrated by the screen.
W.W. CarlislePlayed since January 20, 2019Captain Level- 99 (May 9, 2022)VIP 14Crew Quarters: 485/485Most recent/Lowest- Anbo-jyutsu Kyle Riker (1/5* Lvl 30) 5/29/23Immortalized x-866 5* x184, 4* x 490, 3* x91, 2* x62, and 1* x27Most recent Immortal - Tearful Janeway 4* 5/25/23Current non-event project- Improving my Science base skill. Retrieval Project- Mestral 1/5*
Who cares. We spent what, 2 weeks building feedback and beta resting, tapping our hard earned resources to test their new feature, and they responded to that with a big ole middle finger.
No one forced you do anything. Including spell checking
I like most of the suggested improvements. For my two cents, it seemed odd/a mistake that you could match across different crew as the entire user interface design suggested otherwise. Also, great that they're adressing the frozen crew issues!
First, you all complain about issues that you didn't like (and, I'll grant you, there are some egregious flaws in this newly-devised feature of the game),
At least we agree on that much. Can you also agree that players have articulated very clearly what it would take for those problems to be resolved, and the people making the game haven't done any of those things? What's the point of feedback if people who actually play and enjoy the game say, "this is what it would take to make this fun for us," and then the people they're saying it to just don't do any of those things?
mostly because you felt entitled to something something gazpacho,
The reason you had to phrase it in this ridiculous way, is because the reality is that the only thing any of us feel entitled to is a game mode that's actually fun. Would you rather people not say anything and just quietly stop playing or spending money on this game?
Personally, I'm gonna keep playing STT until they shut the servers down no matter what, but BS like this (where the people in charge of the game do basically the exact opposite of what players tell them is necessary for it to be fun), makes me very concerned that the eventual demise of this game will happen a lot sooner than I'd prefer. That's why I'm "crying and complaining" so much, because I don't want to see this game brought to an end by profit-driven people showing a disregard and even disdain for customer feedback.
and then, when the developers actually listen and make attempts at fixing them, you all keep complaining that the fixes weren't what you wanted.
We're complaining because "actually listen" is exactly what they did not do.
We said that every player who participates in a fleet battle needs to get some rewards. They made a minor change (which could've been far more major just by inputting a different number, so I don't buy the line about "this was all we could do on short notice") that still makes it very possible for players to participate in a boss battle and get no rewards.
We said that boss battles cost too many merits to thaw specific crew, and sometimes it's downright impossible to unlock nodes, and they announced that they're urgently moving forward on a change that will make those problems worse.
We said that players who unlock nodes should get some kind of personal reward, and they announced that unlocking nodes will give everyone in the fleet some kind of buff, without doing anything to offset the damage totals of the specific players who use weaker crew to unlock nodes.
If customers at a retail store complained that the checkout lines were too long, and you responded by rerouting the queue so it doesn't get in other shoppers' way, instead of just adding more cashiers, those customers would be right to keep complaining.
Now you're seriously infringing on my enjoyment of the game, because I can't even read the forums for great stories and advice; it's all nattering nabobs of negativity, 24/7 around here now.
Quite frankly, this seems like manufactured outrage, since you're not posting this comment in the thread that's specifically for advice (which, as far as I can tell, has none of this negativity), not to mention a thread that has "positivity" right there in the name. Instead, you're actively going into the thread that exists entirely for the purpose of players telling the people making the game how to make a feature more fun, and then getting mad at them for doing that.
No one forced you do anything. Including spell checking
Don't you mean, "no one forced you to do anything," if we're being nitpicky about very minor typos? And you didn't even end the second sentence with a period.
We're complaining because "actually listen" is exactly what they did not do.
We said that every player who participates in a fleet battle needs to get some rewards. They made a minor change (which could've been far more major just by inputting a different number, so I don't buy the line about "this was all we could do on short notice") that still makes it very possible for players to participate in a boss battle and get no rewards.
We said that boss battles cost too many merits to thaw specific crew, and sometimes it's downright impossible to unlock nodes, and they announced that they're urgently moving forward on a change that will make those problems worse.
We said that players who unlock nodes should get some kind of personal reward, and they announced that unlocking nodes will give everyone in the fleet some kind of buff, without doing anything to offset the damage totals of the specific players who use weaker crew to unlock nodes.
They did listen, but not to a few individual desires.
The adjustments they are doing and have planned are good. Not perfect but nothing is perfect.
They addressed the nodes, easier to find the crew needed, and more.
The only thing they did not, is making STT a single player game which they should not do it.
It's also very clear that this is not their intention.
So it's normal that it will be fleet based.
As your customer example. It feels like some are complaining in a fish store that there is no meat.
The only thing they did not, is making STT a single player game which they should not do it.
That is not the only thing they didn't do, not by a long shot. I already gave three examples of things they didn't do, but thanks for giving me a fourth, I guess?
The only thing they did not, is making STT a single player game which they should not do it.
That is not the only thing they didn't do, not by a long shot. I already gave three examples of things they didn't do, but thanks for giving me a fourth, I guess?
I'm afraid you were misinformed. This is a multiplayer game not a single player game.
But I'm glad we found the root cause of the issues.
I'm quite positive that the issues you mentioned can all be pointed to: "Playing a multiplayer game as a single player game"
I'm quite positive that the issues you mentioned can all be pointed to: "Playing a multiplayer game as a single player game"
Quite the opposite, actually. All three of the problems I mentioned are issues that people have gotten frustrated with because this ostensibly multiplayer game mode is essentially punishing people for trying to help their fleet (like, if you use weaker crew to unlock nodes, you just end up doing less damage; if you spend one valor to help your fleet defeat a boss instead of waiting till all your valor is maxed out, you might just not get any rewards, etc.).
And oh yeah, that reminds me of a fifth thing people have been asking for that WRG has ignored. A lot of people have said that opening battles should be restricted to the officers or admirals, but WRG has staunchly refused to do that, while not having any sense of urgency about implementing the half-measure alternative to it (officers and admirals being able to just recommend specific battles), or any other way for fleet leaders to communicate with other players within that mode.
So I guess you're right, we are getting to the root cause of the issues. Namely, that WRG has structured this like a multiplayer game in terms of rewards, but a single player game in terms of design (they've made it so people can only level up their bridge if they cooperate with a large, active fleet, but then implemented a bunch of individual game mechanics that make it less rewarding and difficult to do so).
I'm quite positive that the issues you mentioned can all be pointed to: "Playing a multiplayer game as a single player game"
Quite the opposite, actually. All three of the problems I mentioned are issues that people have gotten frustrated with because this ostensibly multiplayer game mode is essentially punishing people for trying to help their fleet (like, if you use weaker crew to unlock nodes, you just end up doing less damage; if you spend one valor to help your fleet defeat a boss instead of waiting till all your valor is maxed out, you might just not get any rewards, etc.).
And oh yeah, that reminds me of a fifth thing people have been asking for that WRG has ignored. A lot of people have said that opening battles should be restricted to the officers or admirals, but WRG has staunchly refused to do that, while not having any sense of urgency about implementing the half-measure alternative to it (officers and admirals being able to just recommend specific battles), or any other way for fleet leaders to communicate with other players within that mode.
So I guess you're right, we are getting to the root cause of the issues. Namely, that WRG has structured this like a multiplayer game in terms of rewards, but a single player game in terms of design (they've made it so people can only level up their bridge if they cooperate with a large, active fleet, but then implemented a bunch of individual game mechanics that make it less rewarding and difficult to do so).
I can counter them all.
The node issue. When doing a battle with lets say 30 people. (60% Fleet activity)
There are lets say 20 nodes, I believe it is even less.
Let's say you have very bad RNG. Nobody has the crew needed and you need 3 attempts on average for each node. That means 60 crew needed to unlock all the nodes.
2 crew for each person.
Let's say another bad luck and you need to do it in 2 battles.
You get 8 each day. So this means 2 bad damage and 6 good ones.
They already lowered the threshold enough.
Merit cost = 250 ?
On Normal when you destroy the boss you get 210. On higher difficulties you get even more.
Cost = 40 merits.
I don't see any problems. The threshold damage was indeed too high at start but now, not anymore.
Unless you play this as a single player game. At hard, you don't even have to do the nodes when you are with a full fleet. You can kill it without it and everyone can make more damage -> more rewards.
Actually, I even heard on the STT stream that they were happy about it that everyone can open a battle. So a lot of people is not correct. Me personally, first I would have like it to be restricted but after hearing their arguments, I changed my mind.
Bottom line is, if you play Boss Battle as a multiplayer it is fun.
If you play it as a single player game, it's horrible.
The personal rewards do not include Kemocite, which is needed to upgrade the bridge past level 3. So there is a "Kemocite" wall that personal rewards do not help with in the normal boss battle
WRG should replace the insulting starbase parts with Kemocite and even higher level material in the ultimate campaign track.
Well that's great if you have a fleet with perfect communication and coordination so that everyone is sharing the load equally, instead of a smaller number of players having to take the initiative and bear the burden for everyone else (with nothing to show for it), not to mention people wasting their tries on crew that someone else was already trying.
They didn't lower the threshold enough for everyone who participated in the boss battle to get some rewards, which is what the persistent and emphatic feedback was saying should be done. They just ignored that.
Merit cost = 250 ?
On Normal when you destroy the boss you get 210. On higher difficulties you get even more.
And if you don't clear the personal thresholds, you get 0. That incentivizes people to focus on raw damage before worrying about nodes (at which point they might not have any Valor left), which again leads to a few players having to take the initiative and bear the burden for everyone else (with nothing to show for it).
Unless you play this as a single player game. At hard, you don't even have to do the nodes when you are with a full fleet. You can kill it without it and everyone can make more damage -> more rewards.
Which would solve all our problems, if they didn't lock some very vital resources behind higher difficulties that even large, active fleets (that are treating this like a multiplayer game) are having trouble with.
Actually, I even heard on the STT stream that they were happy about it that everyone can open a battle. So a lot of people is not correct.
Okay, then make it a switchable setting, where an admiral can restrict who opens a battle, or make it open to everyone. Some fleets with good communication can have it open, and others that try not to force players to be social can keep it locked (at least in certain situations), so that they can keep it focused on a single unified goal without needing to communicate that to individual players who aren't interested in following the lines of communication.
Best of both worlds, right? If you don't agree with that solution, then all you're really saying is, "I only want players who do things my way to have fun."
Bottom line is, if you play Boss Battle as a multiplayer it is fun.
If you play it as a single player game, it's horrible.
If you play Boss Battles as single player game, you wait until your Valor is filled up before you attack, so you can guarantee you get rewards. If you play Boss Battle as a multiplayer game, you help your fleet out with whatever they're currently working on, which will sometimes mean you end up getting absolutely nothing for your efforts.
If you play Boss Battles as single player game, you save all your merits for gauntlets and events, focusing on raw damage instead. If you play Boss Battles as a multiplayer game, you help your fleet out with unlocking nodes, which might lead to other players just counting on you to spend your merits (and dilithium) while they save theirs, or might lead to you missing out on rewards (regardless of any purely hypothetical math).
Sure, if you happen to be in a perfect fleet with great communication and coordination, then of course it's gonna be more fun to play with that fleet. But not everyone is so lucky, and some fleets are specifically focused on not forcing players to communicate or coordinate, or do anything but continue treating this like the single player game that is the most fun for them, with some nice little bonuses now and then.
If I had been told at the beginning that this game is intended to be multiplayer-only, I never would've started playing it, and I bet I'm not the only person who would be driven away by that. How does narrowing the field of what kind of player can enjoy this game, instead of letting everyone have their own kind of fun, help make this product more successful?
Why don’t you put in a “Favorite” or Specifier mark so we can alert the entire fleet on which BOSS Battle we’re working on. Like with Starbases, contributing to other “rooms” stretches out our fleet. A Prioritizing flag would be appreciated.
Wonders what Gandy keeps in his "other rooms"....umm, wait, nm, not sure I wanna know
Founding ADM - PoF family of fleets (POF, POF2 & POF3) - Dear TP: Non sequitur. Your facts are uncoordinated.
Yep, that's Voyage exclusive Tarquin from a straight drop. (Why couldn't you be Picard? Then, I'd have you all.)
Tarquin isn't a voyage exclusive. He was a Tuesday pack crew.
Hmmm..that's odd. I thought he was. I don't seem to ever remember getting him out of a Portal, just coming back on a Voyage. Odd, but not impossible. I know I got "Burden of Proof" without having had "Class Act" though. I went back and checked. I had screenshots until I needed room. I also helped the Andorion in "Friend in Need" a couple days ago and the Born options came up.
W.W. CarlislePlayed since January 20, 2019Captain Level- 99 (May 9, 2022)VIP 14Crew Quarters: 485/485Most recent/Lowest- Anbo-jyutsu Kyle Riker (1/5* Lvl 30) 5/29/23Immortalized x-866 5* x184, 4* x 490, 3* x91, 2* x62, and 1* x27Most recent Immortal - Tearful Janeway 4* 5/25/23Current non-event project- Improving my Science base skill. Retrieval Project- Mestral 1/5*
Id like to humbly request that people like @Peets, @Bylo Band@Ivanstone and others refrain from continuing to use this thread as a platform to spew their criticisms of people from. You are only distracting us, and derailing the purpose of this thread. Please stop.
Are you telling me that only your feedback matters or those who agree with you?
Serious? I'm sorry, but my feedback also matters.
Feedback on feedback is still feedback.
The purpose of this thread is not that they have to listen to you and who agrees with you and change the game accordingly.
Well that's great if you have a fleet with perfect communication and coordination so that everyone is sharing the load equally, instead of a smaller number of players having to take the initiative and bear the burden for everyone else (with nothing to show for it), not to mention people wasting their tries on crew that someone else was already trying.
You don't need much communication and coordination. Most nodes are easy to complete.
They didn't lower the threshold enough for everyone who participated in the boss battle to get some rewards, which is what the persistent and emphatic feedback was saying should be done. They just ignored that.
I agree with you that it would be even better that everyone can gets some magnesite. But they did not ignore it. Otherwise they would not have lowered it.
Merit cost = 250 ?
On Normal when you destroy the boss you get 210. On higher difficulties you get even more.
And if you don't clear the personal thresholds, you get 0. That incentivizes people to focus on raw damage before worrying about nodes (at which point they might not have any Valor left), which again leads to a few players having to take the initiative and bear the burden for everyone else (with nothing to show for it).
Personal thresholds are not that difficult now. I can get them all at the moment until hard with just one attack. Higher not yet possible, I'm still progressing in the captain bridge. When I get higher, my damage will get higher.
Unless you play this as a single player game. At hard, you don't even have to do the nodes when you are with a full fleet. You can kill it without it and everyone can make more damage -> more rewards.
Which would solve all our problems, if they didn't lock some very vital resources behind higher difficulties that even large, active fleets (that are treating this like a multiplayer game) are having trouble with.
Actually, I even heard on the STT stream that they were happy about it that everyone can open a battle. So a lot of people is not correct.
Okay, then make it a switchable setting, where an admiral can restrict who opens a battle, or make it open to everyone. Some fleets with good communication can have it open, and others that try not to force players to be social can keep it locked (at least in certain situations), so that they can keep it focused on a single unified goal without needing to communicate that to individual players who aren't interested in following the lines of communication.
Best of both worlds, right? If you don't agree with that solution, then all you're really saying is, "I only want players who do things my way to have fun."
If I had been told at the beginning that this game is intended to be multiplayer-only, I never would've started playing it, and I bet I'm not the only person who would be driven away by that. How does narrowing the field of what kind of player can enjoy this game, instead of letting everyone have their own kind of fun, help make this product more successful?
For me it was obvious when I read about the game that it would be heavy multiplayer.
But not all the game modes are multiplayer-only, far from.
But when you see multiplayer, it would be obvious that some parts would be multiplayer only?
Id like to humbly request that people like @Peets, @Bylo Band@Ivanstone and others refrain from continuing to use this thread as a platform to spew their criticisms of people from. You are only distracting us, and derailing the purpose of this thread. Please stop.
Are you telling me that only your feedback matters or those who agree with you?
Serious? I'm sorry, but my feedback also matters.
Feedback on feedback is still feedback.
The purpose of this thread is not that they have to listen to you and who agrees with you and change the game accordingly.
Well that's great if you have a fleet with perfect communication and coordination so that everyone is sharing the load equally, instead of a smaller number of players having to take the initiative and bear the burden for everyone else (with nothing to show for it), not to mention people wasting their tries on crew that someone else was already trying.
You don't need much communication and coordination. Most nodes are easy to complete.
They didn't lower the threshold enough for everyone who participated in the boss battle to get some rewards, which is what the persistent and emphatic feedback was saying should be done. They just ignored that.
I agree with you that it would be even better that everyone can gets some magnesite. But they did not ignore it. Otherwise they would not have lowered it.
Merit cost = 250 ?
On Normal when you destroy the boss you get 210. On higher difficulties you get even more.
And if you don't clear the personal thresholds, you get 0. That incentivizes people to focus on raw damage before worrying about nodes (at which point they might not have any Valor left), which again leads to a few players having to take the initiative and bear the burden for everyone else (with nothing to show for it).
Personal thresholds are not that difficult now. I can get them all at the moment until hard with just one attack. Higher not yet possible, I'm still progressing in the captain bridge. When I get higher, my damage will get higher.
Unless you play this as a single player game. At hard, you don't even have to do the nodes when you are with a full fleet. You can kill it without it and everyone can make more damage -> more rewards.
Which would solve all our problems, if they didn't lock some very vital resources behind higher difficulties that even large, active fleets (that are treating this like a multiplayer game) are having trouble with.
Actually, I even heard on the STT stream that they were happy about it that everyone can open a battle. So a lot of people is not correct.
Okay, then make it a switchable setting, where an admiral can restrict who opens a battle, or make it open to everyone. Some fleets with good communication can have it open, and others that try not to force players to be social can keep it locked (at least in certain situations), so that they can keep it focused on a single unified goal without needing to communicate that to individual players who aren't interested in following the lines of communication.
Best of both worlds, right? If you don't agree with that solution, then all you're really saying is, "I only want players who do things my way to have fun."
If I had been told at the beginning that this game is intended to be multiplayer-only, I never would've started playing it, and I bet I'm not the only person who would be driven away by that. How does narrowing the field of what kind of player can enjoy this game, instead of letting everyone have their own kind of fun, help make this product more successful?
For me it was obvious when I read about the game that it would be heavy multiplayer.
But not all the game modes are multiplayer-only, far from.
But when you see multiplayer, it would be obvious that some parts would be multiplayer only?
Your comments are not constructed as feedback. They are constructed as arguments against other peoples feedback. Look at your post, pal. You are not really speaking to the devs, are you?
So again, please stip trying to argue with us. If you have positive feedback, thats great. Frame it as such and write to the developers.
Stop quoting peoples feedback and trying to start trouble, please. I WILL report you.
Sure, because you can unlock them with traits spread over multiple crew... which is exactly what WRG is "fixing" next week. It's gonna be harder after the update (in a way that will conveniently increase the need for players to spend merits and dilithium).
I agree with you that it would be even better that everyone can gets some magnesite. But they did not ignore it. Otherwise they would not have lowered it.
If X = "make sure everyone who does an attack gets some rewards," then they did ignore X, unless they did something to make sure everyone who does an attack gets rewards.
Personal thresholds are not that difficult now. I can get them all at the moment until hard with just one attack.
Bully for you. Not everyone has the same ships and crew that you do. Personally, I think everyone should get rewards if they spend Valor to help out their fleet, regardless of how much damage they can do in one attack. It should be a situation where a can fleet can say, "hey, this newbie can't do much damage now, but we can help them get up to speed by finishing off the bosses that they do an attack in, so they get some rewards." As it is, there's just no way for the rising tide of a fleet to lift any boats except the ones that are able to make personal thresholds all on their own, as if it were a single player game.
You missed my point. I was saying that even the fleets that are already treating this like a multiplayer game are still having trouble with those higher difficulty levels (behind which higher bridge levels are locked), therefore treating this as a multiplayer game is not automatically a solution to every problem.
Cool, glad we agree. I can't help but wonder why WRG doesn't seem to care about making something like this a priority (and in fact seems opposed to ever doing anything like that at all).
For me it was obvious when I read about the game that it would be heavy multiplayer.
But not all the game modes are multiplayer-only, far from.
But when you see multiplayer, it would be obvious that some parts would be multiplayer only?
It's not obvious at all, which is evidenced by the fact that absolutely none of the other game modes demanded a multiplayer focus before now (unless you count the starbase, which I grant is similar to the Bridge, but the key difference is that it doesn't have exclusive crew or ship schematics).
Id like to humbly request that people like @Peets, @Bylo Band@Ivanstone and others refrain from continuing to use this thread as a platform to spew their criticisms of people from. You are only distracting us, and derailing the purpose of this thread. Please stop.
If by helping, you mean attempting to bully me into being quiet, then yes, you are absolutely correct that there is no helping me.
You can feel free to ignore me but I don’t ignore anyone. Even a broken clock is right twice per day.
Not all feedback is useful. Some alleged game problems are not actually problems. Some of us try to actually develop strategies to help others. When was the last time you posted in the Ready Room?
Id like to humbly request that people like @Peets, @Bylo Band@Ivanstone and others refrain from continuing to use this thread as a platform to spew their criticisms of people from. You are only distracting us, and derailing the purpose of this thread. Please stop.
If by helping, you mean attempting to bully me into being quiet, then yes, you are absolutely correct that there is no helping me.
You can feel free to ignore me but I don’t ignore anyone. Even a broken clock is right twice per day.
Not all feedback is useful. Some alleged game problems are not actually problems. Some of us try to actually develop strategies to help others. When was the last time you posted in the Ready Room?
Is this the ready room? No. Its a feedback thread for devs.
Players are here providing ffeedback and you are here to argue woth them.
Thats where the toxicity of these forums is eminating from. No one is posting here and saying “hey i have this feedback, butbi really need ivanstone to come in and determine whether or not it should be relevant for the devs to consider” thats where your self entitlement comes in.
So again, there is no need for you to try to hijack a FEEDBACK THREAD and to argue with people who are doing EXACTLY WHAT SHAN ASKED.
Comments
This too is one of my biggest complaints about Boss Battles. You are essentially dependent on others to get be able to get exclusives like McCoy and Scotty with (currently) no other way to get them. Since the game has turned into a collecting type of game, this is extremely disappointing and frustrating. I have had all crew three times. I am still waiting patiently for the Klingons in the Gauntlet, but eventually they will come. With this Boss Battle twist, it pretty much ends the ability to collect all crew.
It would be great if this would be a game where every kind of player and person could find their way and have fun. But you have to realize that is an utopia. You can't please everyone, especially when you are a small team. Sometimes it happens that a game goes into direction that is not yours. I have experienced that in the past. I decided then to move on. But that is for everyone to decide on their own. But I find it not fair that it is taken for granted that WRG should consider the desirements of every unique individual.
Are there any crew that are absolutely impossible to get if you don't spend money? Because there are now crew that are absolutely impossible to get if you don't join a fleet.
I left retail management because of people like you all. Now you're seriously infringing on my enjoyment of the game, because I can't even read the forums for great stories and advice; it's all nattering nabobs of negativity, 24/7 around here now.
Sheesh, people, get a grip.
How does “we found out how you people are solving nodes eadier than we wanted, and we are going to make that more challenging and at times flat out impossible now” equate to them trying to solve the problems that have been expressed in this thread?
Put up one quote where someone is complaining that fbb is too easy, needs to be more challenging, and if possible, make it IMPOSSIBLE.
Show me that wuote and we can listen to you.
And yet there's so much material in game its a lot more likely the game will collapse before a low or no spender will obtain all of them. Nevermind fusing all that crew.
Yes, in a couple days I'll get the new Scotty at 1/5. I have no idea when he'll be fully fused. Meanwhile there's still ~300 crew I don't have. It will take about 10M Honour to fuse all of my crew.
At least that honour debt is narrowed by being in a fleet.
This piece de resistance was waiting when I came in from the chickens...
Yep, that's Voyage exclusive Tarquin from a straight drop. (Why couldn't you be Picard? Then, I'd have you all.)
I'm actually happy that anything is being made to work like it should. Too many problems will crash it eventually. Now, off to post my cat's midnight selfie online. How she managed... Who knows? She turned it on, accessed the camera, switched it to selfie, and took a shot of her foot in the pitch dark. All you see are her toes illustrated by the screen.
Tarquin isn't a voyage exclusive. He was a Tuesday pack crew.
No one forced you do anything. Including spell checking
Well then, I guess you haven't ever seen people who are passionate about something and want to see it done well.
At least we agree on that much. Can you also agree that players have articulated very clearly what it would take for those problems to be resolved, and the people making the game haven't done any of those things? What's the point of feedback if people who actually play and enjoy the game say, "this is what it would take to make this fun for us," and then the people they're saying it to just don't do any of those things?
The reason you had to phrase it in this ridiculous way, is because the reality is that the only thing any of us feel entitled to is a game mode that's actually fun. Would you rather people not say anything and just quietly stop playing or spending money on this game?
Personally, I'm gonna keep playing STT until they shut the servers down no matter what, but BS like this (where the people in charge of the game do basically the exact opposite of what players tell them is necessary for it to be fun), makes me very concerned that the eventual demise of this game will happen a lot sooner than I'd prefer. That's why I'm "crying and complaining" so much, because I don't want to see this game brought to an end by profit-driven people showing a disregard and even disdain for customer feedback.
We're complaining because "actually listen" is exactly what they did not do.
We said that every player who participates in a fleet battle needs to get some rewards. They made a minor change (which could've been far more major just by inputting a different number, so I don't buy the line about "this was all we could do on short notice") that still makes it very possible for players to participate in a boss battle and get no rewards.
We said that boss battles cost too many merits to thaw specific crew, and sometimes it's downright impossible to unlock nodes, and they announced that they're urgently moving forward on a change that will make those problems worse.
We said that players who unlock nodes should get some kind of personal reward, and they announced that unlocking nodes will give everyone in the fleet some kind of buff, without doing anything to offset the damage totals of the specific players who use weaker crew to unlock nodes.
If customers at a retail store complained that the checkout lines were too long, and you responded by rerouting the queue so it doesn't get in other shoppers' way, instead of just adding more cashiers, those customers would be right to keep complaining.
Quite frankly, this seems like manufactured outrage, since you're not posting this comment in the thread that's specifically for advice (which, as far as I can tell, has none of this negativity), not to mention a thread that has "positivity" right there in the name. Instead, you're actively going into the thread that exists entirely for the purpose of players telling the people making the game how to make a feature more fun, and then getting mad at them for doing that.
Don't you mean, "no one forced you to do anything," if we're being nitpicky about very minor typos? And you didn't even end the second sentence with a period.
They did listen, but not to a few individual desires.
The adjustments they are doing and have planned are good. Not perfect but nothing is perfect.
They addressed the nodes, easier to find the crew needed, and more.
The only thing they did not, is making STT a single player game which they should not do it.
It's also very clear that this is not their intention.
So it's normal that it will be fleet based.
As your customer example. It feels like some are complaining in a fish store that there is no meat.
That is not the only thing they didn't do, not by a long shot. I already gave three examples of things they didn't do, but thanks for giving me a fourth, I guess?
I'm afraid you were misinformed. This is a multiplayer game not a single player game.
But I'm glad we found the root cause of the issues.
I'm quite positive that the issues you mentioned can all be pointed to: "Playing a multiplayer game as a single player game"
Quite the opposite, actually. All three of the problems I mentioned are issues that people have gotten frustrated with because this ostensibly multiplayer game mode is essentially punishing people for trying to help their fleet (like, if you use weaker crew to unlock nodes, you just end up doing less damage; if you spend one valor to help your fleet defeat a boss instead of waiting till all your valor is maxed out, you might just not get any rewards, etc.).
And oh yeah, that reminds me of a fifth thing people have been asking for that WRG has ignored. A lot of people have said that opening battles should be restricted to the officers or admirals, but WRG has staunchly refused to do that, while not having any sense of urgency about implementing the half-measure alternative to it (officers and admirals being able to just recommend specific battles), or any other way for fleet leaders to communicate with other players within that mode.
So I guess you're right, we are getting to the root cause of the issues. Namely, that WRG has structured this like a multiplayer game in terms of rewards, but a single player game in terms of design (they've made it so people can only level up their bridge if they cooperate with a large, active fleet, but then implemented a bunch of individual game mechanics that make it less rewarding and difficult to do so).
Tarquin is in the portal.
I can counter them all.
The node issue. When doing a battle with lets say 30 people. (60% Fleet activity)
There are lets say 20 nodes, I believe it is even less.
Let's say you have very bad RNG. Nobody has the crew needed and you need 3 attempts on average for each node. That means 60 crew needed to unlock all the nodes.
2 crew for each person.
Let's say another bad luck and you need to do it in 2 battles.
You get 8 each day. So this means 2 bad damage and 6 good ones.
They already lowered the threshold enough.
Merit cost = 250 ?
On Normal when you destroy the boss you get 210. On higher difficulties you get even more.
Cost = 40 merits.
I don't see any problems. The threshold damage was indeed too high at start but now, not anymore.
Unless you play this as a single player game. At hard, you don't even have to do the nodes when you are with a full fleet. You can kill it without it and everyone can make more damage -> more rewards.
Actually, I even heard on the STT stream that they were happy about it that everyone can open a battle. So a lot of people is not correct. Me personally, first I would have like it to be restricted but after hearing their arguments, I changed my mind.
Bottom line is, if you play Boss Battle as a multiplayer it is fun.
If you play it as a single player game, it's horrible.
WRG should replace the insulting starbase parts with Kemocite and even higher level material in the ultimate campaign track.
Well that's great if you have a fleet with perfect communication and coordination so that everyone is sharing the load equally, instead of a smaller number of players having to take the initiative and bear the burden for everyone else (with nothing to show for it), not to mention people wasting their tries on crew that someone else was already trying.
They didn't lower the threshold enough for everyone who participated in the boss battle to get some rewards, which is what the persistent and emphatic feedback was saying should be done. They just ignored that.
And if you don't clear the personal thresholds, you get 0. That incentivizes people to focus on raw damage before worrying about nodes (at which point they might not have any Valor left), which again leads to a few players having to take the initiative and bear the burden for everyone else (with nothing to show for it).
Which would solve all our problems, if they didn't lock some very vital resources behind higher difficulties that even large, active fleets (that are treating this like a multiplayer game) are having trouble with.
Okay, then make it a switchable setting, where an admiral can restrict who opens a battle, or make it open to everyone. Some fleets with good communication can have it open, and others that try not to force players to be social can keep it locked (at least in certain situations), so that they can keep it focused on a single unified goal without needing to communicate that to individual players who aren't interested in following the lines of communication.
Best of both worlds, right? If you don't agree with that solution, then all you're really saying is, "I only want players who do things my way to have fun."
If you play Boss Battles as single player game, you wait until your Valor is filled up before you attack, so you can guarantee you get rewards. If you play Boss Battle as a multiplayer game, you help your fleet out with whatever they're currently working on, which will sometimes mean you end up getting absolutely nothing for your efforts.
If you play Boss Battles as single player game, you save all your merits for gauntlets and events, focusing on raw damage instead. If you play Boss Battles as a multiplayer game, you help your fleet out with unlocking nodes, which might lead to other players just counting on you to spend your merits (and dilithium) while they save theirs, or might lead to you missing out on rewards (regardless of any purely hypothetical math).
Sure, if you happen to be in a perfect fleet with great communication and coordination, then of course it's gonna be more fun to play with that fleet. But not everyone is so lucky, and some fleets are specifically focused on not forcing players to communicate or coordinate, or do anything but continue treating this like the single player game that is the most fun for them, with some nice little bonuses now and then.
If I had been told at the beginning that this game is intended to be multiplayer-only, I never would've started playing it, and I bet I'm not the only person who would be driven away by that. How does narrowing the field of what kind of player can enjoy this game, instead of letting everyone have their own kind of fun, help make this product more successful?
Wonders what Gandy keeps in his "other rooms"....umm, wait, nm, not sure I wanna know
Hmmm..that's odd. I thought he was. I don't seem to ever remember getting him out of a Portal, just coming back on a Voyage. Odd, but not impossible. I know I got "Burden of Proof" without having had "Class Act" though. I went back and checked. I had screenshots until I needed room. I also helped the Andorion in "Friend in Need" a couple days ago and the Born options came up.
Are you telling me that only your feedback matters or those who agree with you?
Serious? I'm sorry, but my feedback also matters.
Feedback on feedback is still feedback.
The purpose of this thread is not that they have to listen to you and who agrees with you and change the game accordingly.
You don't need much communication and coordination. Most nodes are easy to complete.
I agree with you that it would be even better that everyone can gets some magnesite. But they did not ignore it. Otherwise they would not have lowered it.
Personal thresholds are not that difficult now. I can get them all at the moment until hard with just one attack. Higher not yet possible, I'm still progressing in the captain bridge. When I get higher, my damage will get higher.
But this is a multiplayer game...
I agree, great suggestion.
For me it was obvious when I read about the game that it would be heavy multiplayer.
But not all the game modes are multiplayer-only, far from.
But when you see multiplayer, it would be obvious that some parts would be multiplayer only?
Your comments are not constructed as feedback. They are constructed as arguments against other peoples feedback. Look at your post, pal. You are not really speaking to the devs, are you?
So again, please stip trying to argue with us. If you have positive feedback, thats great. Frame it as such and write to the developers.
Stop quoting peoples feedback and trying to start trouble, please. I WILL report you.
Sure, because you can unlock them with traits spread over multiple crew... which is exactly what WRG is "fixing" next week. It's gonna be harder after the update (in a way that will conveniently increase the need for players to spend merits and dilithium).
If X = "make sure everyone who does an attack gets some rewards," then they did ignore X, unless they did something to make sure everyone who does an attack gets rewards.
Bully for you. Not everyone has the same ships and crew that you do. Personally, I think everyone should get rewards if they spend Valor to help out their fleet, regardless of how much damage they can do in one attack. It should be a situation where a can fleet can say, "hey, this newbie can't do much damage now, but we can help them get up to speed by finishing off the bosses that they do an attack in, so they get some rewards." As it is, there's just no way for the rising tide of a fleet to lift any boats except the ones that are able to make personal thresholds all on their own, as if it were a single player game.
You missed my point. I was saying that even the fleets that are already treating this like a multiplayer game are still having trouble with those higher difficulty levels (behind which higher bridge levels are locked), therefore treating this as a multiplayer game is not automatically a solution to every problem.
Cool, glad we agree. I can't help but wonder why WRG doesn't seem to care about making something like this a priority (and in fact seems opposed to ever doing anything like that at all).
It's not obvious at all, which is evidenced by the fact that absolutely none of the other game modes demanded a multiplayer focus before now (unless you count the starbase, which I grant is similar to the Bridge, but the key difference is that it doesn't have exclusive crew or ship schematics).
I have one thing to say:
You can feel free to ignore me but I don’t ignore anyone. Even a broken clock is right twice per day.
Not all feedback is useful. Some alleged game problems are not actually problems. Some of us try to actually develop strategies to help others. When was the last time you posted in the Ready Room?
Is this the ready room? No. Its a feedback thread for devs.
Players are here providing ffeedback and you are here to argue woth them.
Thats where the toxicity of these forums is eminating from. No one is posting here and saying “hey i have this feedback, butbi really need ivanstone to come in and determine whether or not it should be relevant for the devs to consider” thats where your self entitlement comes in.
So again, there is no need for you to try to hijack a FEEDBACK THREAD and to argue with people who are doing EXACTLY WHAT SHAN ASKED.